NBA 2K12 News Post

NBA 2K12 Developer Insight #9 - Defense

02:14 PM - September 16, 2011 by mreyes930

Check out the new NBA 2K12 Developer Insight #9, as Jerson Sapida talks about the defensive side of the ball.

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# 41 blues rocker @ 09/16/11 03:03 PM

Hey Pared...chill...the "auto contest" is not really "automatic"....you control it by pressing the left trigger or right stick.

# 42 Pared @ 09/16/11 03:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shmitty


	I see what pared is saying, it would be nice if it was more about anticipation and quick reaction than just holding down LT or hands up whenever ur in the paint. Alteast have more of a risk/reward depending on how u time it...def on the right track tho, love what theyve shown us so far.

EXACTLY.

Quote:

Originally Posted by blues rocker


	Hey Pared...chill...the "auto contest" is not really "automatic"....you control it by pressing the left trigger or right stick.

It is - that's not user controlled.

To the same extent, that's like moving your player around on offense and having the CPU shoot when you're open.

It needs to be completely user dependent IN ADDITION to the auto-contest.

Either way - we should have word on how it works soon. The way this is now, if the shooter pumpfakes, you would never bite - because it is done by you just holding either of those inputs.

# 43 Colts18 @ 09/16/11 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blues rocker


	Hey Pared...chill...the "auto contest" is not really "automatic"....you control it by pressing the left trigger or right stick.

^ But it is automatic. It can't be done by the user if he is controlling a defender that isn't guarding the ball handler. That is not 100% control. That is what his issue is.

That is almost as bad as having a post up button but not being able to post up around the perimeter, ala Magic and GP.

So I feel his pain.

# 44 Self313 @ 09/16/11 03:07 PM

i understand where youre coming from

but fam, I just want defense... for too long people have gotten to go crazy on offense without the skill... I dont care how they implement it as long as its there I will adapt lol...

# 45 blues rocker @ 09/16/11 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pared


	EXACTLY. It is - that's not user controlled. To the same extent, that's like moving your player around on offense and having the CPU shoot when you're open. It needs to be completely user dependent IN ADDITION to the auto-contest. Either way - we should have word on how it works soon. The way this is now, if the shooter pumpfakes, you would never bite - because it is done by you just holding either of those inputs.

the reason it doesn't bother me is that the auto contest animation is not a "full contest" animation...it's only a weak "hand up" animation where the defender doesn't leave his feet....so if you really want to bother the shot with a "full contest" you still have to press the block button and time it right. i'm sure the "auto contest hand up" animation won't be as powerful as a "full contest" in which the block button is used. so a user with more skill and timing will still have an advantage using the block button over the auto contest.

# 46 Spartan901 @ 09/16/11 03:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Goffs


	The only part I didn't like reading was that playing on ball defense is a must now as it will effect the offense shot. YES! I PLAY OFF BALL D! I like playing as the center because I just like going for the blocks... Need the demo to get the feel on how well the movement is for the defense...

I have a slight concern with this as well. Especially in cases where say I'm playing against the Lakers or Bulls and i decide I wanna focus on locking down Kobe and Rose. I shouldn't have to be penalized for this defensive strategy by having the rest of their team mates having higher chances of hitting shots now because I'm doing all I can to deny them the ball.

# 47 Knickerbocker @ 09/16/11 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toaster


	I am also very partial towards this. I think the game (especially offline) should allow us to play defense any way we see fit. I am not much for artificial bonuses\penalties.

It's a great solution. When I play online I want to play against a user and not the CPU. 95% of online matches ppl used offball D, so I might just as well play against the CPU. Love this change, I just love it!

# 48 dukedude24 @ 09/16/11 03:13 PM

this sounds terrific

improved defense means we can stop the cheesers more easily now.

stop the stupid hop step, spin dunk and pick and rolls.

# 49 Colts18 @ 09/16/11 03:14 PM

I think some of you are over-reacting with the perks of playing on ball defense. Nobody has implied that the players defended by CPU teammates will shoot the lights out. It simply said there will be a slight increase in how much the shot will be bothered when defended by a human.

Relax.

# 50 Knickerbocker @ 09/16/11 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spartan901


	I have a slight concern with this as well. Especially in cases where say I'm playing against the Lakers or Bulls and i decide I wanna focus on locking down Kobe and Rose. I shouldn't have to be penalized for this defensive strategy by having the rest of their team mates having higher chances of hitting shots now because I'm doing all I can to deny them the ball.

You have strategies ingame to lock down either areas of the game or specific players, plus I'm sure the CPU will still contest just fine.

# 51 mlp111 @ 09/16/11 03:16 PM

this years game is going to have a steep learning curve! sooooooooo much added, its CrAzY!!!!!!!!!!

# 52 blues rocker @ 09/16/11 03:18 PM

the only part i'm not happy with is how a user-controlled defender will affect shots more powerfully than an AI defender...this is an interesting way to motivate people to play more onball defense, but it's simply unrealistic...does this mean a bad defender will suddenly get a "boost of defensive power" just because he's controlled by the user...or a great defender will suddenly become bad just because he's controlled by the AI?

I guess the important question is...how much of a defensive boost does a user-controlled player get over an AI player?...and how much more ineffective do AI defenders become simply because they are AI-controlled?

# 53 Pared @ 09/16/11 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Self313


	i understand where youre coming from but fam, I just want defense... for too long people have gotten to go crazy on offense without the skill... I dont care how they implement it as long as its there I will adapt lol...

I'll adapt too - I enjoy the game too much! They know that...

Quote:

Originally Posted by blues rocker


	the reason it doesn't bother me is that the auto contest animation is not a "full contest" animation...it's only a weak "hand up" animation where the defender doesn't leave his feet....so if you really want to bother the shot with a "full contest" you still have to press the block button.

But that's where the philosophy behind it isn't something I agree with.

There are three types of shot contests: light contest (hands up), heavy contest (going out to the shooter, risking a foul), shot block attempt.

Right now with these controls you are combining the first and the second. They are two unique contests that can occur without leaving your feet. You can just put your hand up or you can actually do a forced, heavy contest at the shooter.

Block attempts will always leave your feet. That part should go without saying.

Right now you don't have any control over the type of contest except leaving your feet or not leaving.

On top of that, the closeout contest not being mentioned disallows chances for a wide open shooter to pump fake and drive.

This is an area that could become a very deep chess match with everything else included. It's similar to the pitcher/batter interface of a baseball game - it's one of deepest, most important parts of the sport.

# 54 Colts18 @ 09/16/11 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sam Marlowe


	I agree with Spartan901. There shouldn't be any kind of penalty. Bad defense is bad defense and you should get penalized for that. But defenders shouldnt have their defensive ablilties hampered simply because the user isnt controlling them

Nobody said that there is a PENALTY. There is just an INCENTIVE for the user.

Example: Teacher gives a test with 10 problems + 5 bonus problems.
Teacher says, "Extra credit given to those that do all 15."

That isn't the same as saying, "Negative marks will be given to those that don't do all 15."

Meaning if you do just 10, you are fine. No deductions.

# 55 yungsta404 @ 09/16/11 03:20 PM

I thought everyone knew that the AI doesnt contest as well as a onball defender????????????? I have noticed this in 2k for years.

# 56 The 24th Letter @ 09/16/11 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pared


	.That's a fair point, but the one in 2k7 was (edit: mostly) visual..

Dont know about that sir!

If it was it sure made me feel better, lol

# 57 infam0us @ 09/16/11 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Colts18


	I think some of you are over-reacting with the perks of playing on ball defense. Nobody has implied that the players defended by CPU teammates will shoot the lights out. It simply said there will be a slight increase in how much the shot will be bothered when defended by a human. Relax.

I doubt anyone thinks if the CPU is defending you instead of the user you are going to shoot 60%. Average FG% has been between 45 and 46% last few years, it will probably be like 5% difference at best.

# 58 Spartan901 @ 09/16/11 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Knickerbocker


	You have strategies ingame to lock down either areas of the game or specific players, plus I'm sure the CPU will still contest just fine.

I understand that I can select the cpu to play tight on any player, but I enjoy the personal challenge of trying to do it myself.

# 59 Colts18 @ 09/16/11 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by infam0us


	I doubt anyone thinks if the CPU is defending you instead of the user you are going to shoot 60%. Average FG% has been between 45 and 46% last few years, it will probably be like 5% difference at best.

Reading some of these responses folks must think it is more than a 5% differential. 5% seems high, I would give 2K more credit than that.

# 60 blues rocker @ 09/16/11 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pared


	I'll adapt too - I enjoy the game too much! They know that... But that's where the philosophy behind it isn't something I agree with. There are three types of shot contests: light contest (hands up), heavy contest (going out to the shooter, risking a foul), shot block attempt. Right now with these controls you are combining the first and the second. They are two unique contests that can occur without leaving your feet. You can just put your hand up or you can actually do a forced, heavy contest at the shooter. Block attempts will always leave your feet. That part should go without saying. Right now you don't have any control over the type of contest except leaving your feet or not leaving. On top of that, the closeout contest not being mentioned disallows chances for a wide open shooter to pump fake and drive. This is an area that could become a very deep chess match with everything else included. It's similar to the pitcher/batter interface of a baseball game - it's one of deepest, most important parts of the sport.

i get what you're saying, but i kind of disagree with you on how you define the different "levels" of shot contests...

for me the 3 levels of shot contests go more like this:

1: hands up but don't leave feet (weak contest)

2: jump straight up, and don't risk fouling (medium contest)

3: jump "into" the shooter and lean into him with your hand - a momentum jump that risks fouling (heavy contest)

so for me...the "auto contest" really only covers the first level of shot contests..the other two are still controlled by the block button - just pressing block and nothing else will make him jump straight up for a level 2 contest...but pressing turbo and moving toward him while pressing block will get a "heavy momentum jump contest."

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