NBA 2K12 News Post

NBA 2K12 Developer Insight #9 - Defense

02:14 PM - September 16, 2011 by mreyes930

Check out the new NBA 2K12 Developer Insight #9, as Jerson Sapida talks about the defensive side of the ball.

Game: NBA 2K12Reader Score: 8/10 - Vote Now
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# 121 BRxSKINSx @ 09/16/11 06:22 PM

Okay 2k...u keep amazing me day after day....sooner or later, you're gonna run out of stuff to give me....and when u do....I'll have te best damn sports game ever....2K12....dang I can't wait...

# 122 Bingo King @ 09/16/11 06:37 PM

they still need to add on to the fouls. They need to get a slap foul in there for late game situations. it's so annoying at end of games to see guys chasing the player trying to wrap them up when in real life it's a simple slap on the arm.

this still needs adjustments and is a huge pet peeve of mine.

# 123 TUSS11 @ 09/16/11 06:41 PM

Off-ball defense as a primary strategy is...lame. Occasionally switching to get your teammates in better position to defend against, for example, the lead pass is fine. But camping with your center the entire game = fear.

I bet if 2K gave people the option to control the coach on defense, most people would.

And if your reason for playing off-ball is lag, keep practicing playing with lag and you'll get better at it. Every year at release I literally suck at on-ball D. I get burnt up real bad some games. But after a few months I can actually play competent D. I'd rather that than playing off-ball all year and never learning.

# 124 Beluba @ 09/16/11 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fatleg3


	Yes im the same way. I like playing off ball with d12 I agree. Some animations disable user controls for example in 2k11 when someone is fouled making a layup or in the paint, all the players are dead, and it wont let me jump up and block the shot even though the shot is blockable. Like you said on thing like the wrap up foul, hopefully it will let you finish the play if you have someone like tony parker trying to wrap up lebron. However you want to put it, there shouldnt be no penalty/bonus or whatever at all. I play both onball d and offball. I like playing offball d because it is fun to playing d with d12. I dont camp in the paint, or do anything cheese with him. He is my favorite player and i simply like playing with him on d. Why do i have to be at a disadvantage because thats what i like to do. And yes it is a disadvantage. No matter how you put it. If the shot % went up .01%, you would still have an advantage playing onball d. What you are trying to argue is playing styles. Some people prefer to play on way some dont. Its not cheese if done the right way so whats the problem. What may be fun to you may not be to the next person and vise versa. What if some people like the ratings to play out and be the determining factor with a defender guarding the ball handler? What about the people who dont camp and play legit off ball defense? 2k is giving an advantage to onball d because they think it is more fun the play onball. But once again what is fun to one person may not be fun to another. Now what i would have no problem with them doing is if you are playing offball and not away from you man for a certain amount of time then penalize you.

fatleg, it's not that we consider playing offball D an invalid playing style. the decision to tune user-controlled onball defenders differently than AI-controlled defenders was a result of a longstanding balancing issue. The fact is, most humans can't react to shooters the same way our AI defenders can. That's amplified online. We simply wanted to give users who prefer to play onball defense an aid to level the playing field with the AI. You'll just have to trust me for now... but I spent a lot of time tuning the shot penalties so as not to sway the balance in the other direction. IMO, 2K12 strikes a good balance for both camps (offball and onball D users.)

But just for the record... I do think it's more manly to play onball D.

# 125 NINJAK2 @ 09/16/11 06:43 PM

User conntrolled defender and shooter vulnerability sections were my favorites. I'm really glad they tried to address both those issues. Another great insight.

# 126 guesswhozbak17 @ 09/16/11 06:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beluba


	fatleg, it's not that we consider playing offball D an invalid playing style. the decision to tune user-controlled onball defenders differently than AI-controlled defenders was a result of a longstanding balancing issue. The fact is, most humans can't react to shooters the same way our AI defenders can. That's amplified online. We simply wanted to give users who prefer to play onball defense an aid to level the playing field with the AI. You'll just have to trust me for now... but I spent a lot of time tuning the shot penalties so as not to sway the balance in the other direction. IMO, 2K12 strikes a good balance for both camps (offball and onball D users.) But just for the record... I do think it's more manly to play onball D.

"it's more manly to play on ball D." = it's a higher risk...therefore I agree with the reward. Thank you.

# 127 eko718 @ 09/16/11 06:50 PM

I am just lost for words really. There has never been a basketball game with this much detail put into the defensive end of the floor.

# 128 infam0us @ 09/16/11 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DukeC


	@beluba While you're still here, I know it's probably too late for 2k12, but for 2k13 could you think of implementing the option of being able to stop And 1 plays with a close defender? Say D-Rose drives to the hoop and gets bumped on the way by Rondo. While Rose is adjusting his shot in mid-air (the whistle having already been blown) someone like Garnett for instance would be able to rotate and swat away the ball, thereby negating the chance for an And 1 instead of the animation playing out and everyone is standing still? Or is this already possible?

I don't remember seeing this in 2k11 but in previous 2k games there were times where I would swat the ball away after the foul. Problem was they never took into account goaltending

# 129 kolanji @ 09/16/11 06:57 PM

well we will all stop the guessing and assuming game come Tuesday when the demo drops baby

# 130 Kaanyr Vhok @ 09/16/11 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beluba


	fatleg, it's not that we consider playing offball D an invalid playing style. the decision to tune user-controlled onball defenders differently than AI-controlled defenders was a result of a longstanding balancing issue. The fact is, most humans can't react to shooters the same way our AI defenders can. That's amplified online.

I see what you mean. There were times when I was playing on ball against a player like Nowitzki or Derron Williams and it seemed like no matter what I was going to be late contesting so the only solution was to reach or double to throw off their rhythm. I can live with Dirk hitting some shots in a defender's face but what messed things up was the feeling that you couldnt even contest without pump fake fouling because you were a step slow and you couldnt time the pump fake with the steal (one of the few or only areas where 2k10 was better than 11).

# 131 amedawg00 @ 09/16/11 07:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beluba


	But just for the record... I do think it's more manly to play onball D.

First Jerson in the insight, and now Beluba, validating the preeminence of on ball defense in user vs. user competition. Whose next Simballer?

On ball defense FTW again!

# 132 Rdub33 @ 09/16/11 07:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yeah...THAT Guy


	Not sure if this has been addressed, but I assume that if you're playing defense with the hands up thing, that it makes you more vulnerable to get beaten by dribble penetration so that people can't just sit there with their hands up the entire game and make your shooting percentage much lower?

Exactly... That's why it's not an advantage to play on ball... It's just more manly! Any one who comes running out all willy nilly with their hands up should give up paint points and fouls. Making people pay for bad defense is not cheese. Playing bad on ball defense is.

With that said I do think if off ball is your thing, u should be free to do that, but u have to live with the results if your not willing to manually sway the results.

# 133 fatleg3 @ 09/16/11 07:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beluba


	fatleg, it's not that we consider playing offball D an invalid playing style. the decision to tune user-controlled onball defenders differently than AI-controlled defenders was a result of a longstanding balancing issue. The fact is, most humans can't react to shooters the same way our AI defenders can. That's amplified online. We simply wanted to give users who prefer to play onball defense an aid to level the playing field with the AI. You'll just have to trust me for now... but I spent a lot of time tuning the shot penalties so as not to sway the balance in the other direction. IMO, 2K12 strikes a good balance for both camps (offball and onball D users.) But just for the record... I do think it's more manly to play onball D.

Thanks im glad you can come in and clarify this. As long as there is a good balance then there should be no problem. My problem and i think so was some others on here is that basically we were taking from this is that you would have better chances playing onball d. But i will take your word for it because you guys (2k) track record has earned it.

BTW I feel pretty manly when i send you ball into the first row with d12 lol

# 134 AllStarDaDon @ 09/16/11 07:08 PM

Wow this insight just tells me I'm going to have as much fun on defense as I do on offense this year.

# 135 wrestlinggod1 @ 09/16/11 07:09 PM

Hopefully, I can recreate the Miami Heat's defensive system with all of the new options that we have. Especially the pick and roll defense. Now the question is, will we be able to save these settings to teams? Or do we have to do them for each game?

# 136 clipperfan811 @ 09/16/11 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaanyr Vhok


	I see what you mean. There were times when I was playing on ball against a player like Nowitzki or Derron Williams and it seemed like no matter what I was going to be late contesting so the only solution was to reach or double to throw off their rhythm. I can live with Dirk hitting some shots in a defender's face but what messed things up was the feeling that you couldnt even contest without pump fake fouling because you were a step slow and you couldnt time the pump fake with the steal (one of the few or only areas where 2k10 was better than 11).

A lot of players felt the same way with Dirk last year in the playoffs

# 137 Pims33 @ 09/16/11 07:15 PM

Great news here. Got to see how that whole off-ball, on-ball defense thing plays out though. Almost all the time I play on-ball D but I also like to play some off-ball, with players that are great team defenders, from time to time.

Also want to know if they did something to the turbo blocking, last year it was too easy and felt unreal.

# 138 qpc123 @ 09/16/11 07:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wrestlinggod1


	Hopefully, I can recreate the Miami Heat's defensive system with all of the new options that we have. Especially the pick and roll defense. Now the question is, will we be able to save these settings to teams? Or do we have to do them for each game?

Won't you want to adjust the settings for every game anyway? What I mean is you would want hedge harder on a pick and roll involving D. Rose than say someone like Derek Fisher.

# 139 iLLosophy @ 09/16/11 07:22 PM

I think this might be the best Developer Insight ever.

# 140 MrBallaBoy21 @ 09/16/11 07:23 PM

I liked most of the Insight but this is what I have a problem with, it's probably been mentioned before but I don't want to read the entire thread.

I know off-ball D is a major gripe with some people, but I don't feel that making shot percentages less affected when being contested by a computer player is good for the balance of the game.

I don't play 100% off ball D, but I also don't immediately switch to the player that gets the ball because it puts me at a disadvantage. I like to see what they're going to do with the ball before I switch so I don't get beat off the dribble or get Jd on because I couldn't react to a quick jumpshot.

I also felt it was like this in previous 2k games. Imo if a shot is being contested, whether it be a human or computer player, it should equally affect the shot based on how good the contest is.

My other problem was that the dunking controls are still the same as last year. I loved the dunking controls on 2k10(Basic, flashy, power, reverse). This year I just couldn't do the dunk I wanted to do and I didn't like it.

I want to do a reverse but do a spin dunk, I want to do a basic dunk but do a windmill(with players like KD and WJ), etc. I was really hoping they'd be changed back.

Other than that I liked the Insight.

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