Madden 2010 News Post

Madden NFL 10 Blog - Improvements to QB Position

07:54 PM - February 23, 2009 by Ian_Cummings

Check out the new Madden NFL 10 blog, which talks about improvements to the QB position.

Quote:


	"I'm back again folks, bringing you some more additions and improvements that you can expect to see in Madden NFL 10. This week, I'm going to focus primarily on the QB position and show some of the improvements we've made for this year. First off, I'm going to talk about a new animation technology that we can call "layered blending". Layered Blending "Layered blending? I thought you were going to talk about quarterbacks?" You'll see shortly how this works for QB's. First, a quick lesson on what blending is. Anytime a player transitions from one animation to another, he will use a 'blend' of his previous animation into the next animation. When you don't have a nice smooth blend, you'll get poppy / hitching animations. If you make blends that are too long, you can easily not have the correct amount of control over your player (he can feel very 'sluggish' or unresponsive). The most common types of blends are linear, ease in, and ease out. Those just refer to how many frames of either the previous or current animation you use while blending. For Madden NFL 10 though, we've added something new - the ability to actually separate the blends out between different parts of the body. We call this layered blending because it allows us to create different layered animation by blending one part of the body out quicker or slower based on the needs of the game. So how does it relate to QB's? Well, how often has this happened to you?"

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Member Comments

# 141 Stikskillz @ 02/24/09 04:32 PM

As most of us realize in Madden, playing QB is a major key to success and these new additions so far are welcome. EA, please continue with the innovation! Push the envelope!

I agree with another post that stated play-action has to be tuned and addressed correctly! A defense should never bite on play-action on any down and long yardage. The offense should earn the D's respect by running the ball to set up play-action.

Also, QB's should not be able to thow across their bodies while on the run so effectively. I hope the throw on the run attribute reflects that. A user should be rewarded with a ratings boost or ratings stay the same for stopping and setting their feet, staying and moving around in the pocket and stepping into throws. A user should be penalized for immediately running out of the pocket backwards or without looking downfield and making throws. The icons disappearing were a good start, but it seems like it should be incorporated more. This is why the Light (Vision Cone) must come back.

EA has already stated they are working on the headtracking for WR's/DB's/LB's, so it makes sense for QB's to have to see who they are throwing to. The light should be mandatory on All-Madden and All-Pro. As you may recall the amount of Vision/light was affected by the QB's awareness, which brings me to my next point.

QB and overall player awareness should be more integral throughout the game. Hopefully this is where procedural awareness also makes an impact. For example, users shouldn't be no-huddling all the way down the field with QB's with low awareness. The user should be penalized with random audibles not being available, false starts, fatigue, poor play execution. It could also be possible for a user to have a QB that is high in awareness, but other skill players are low and that would cause them to make mistakes on hot routes, run poor routes, and miss blocking assignments, again making no huddling risky.

Like all of us, I look forward to hearing more information about the game, but please forgive me when I get distracted by MLB '09 the Show

# 142 STLRams @ 02/24/09 04:45 PM

Please don't have that QB vision/flashlight thing that was on one of the former Madden games on by default. I hated how that looked during gameplay, it looked like a gimmick. I understand the reason behind it, but lets get back to playing straight up sim football. No weapons, icons, flashlights, attached to players, have the game look like you are watching a real NFL game.

# 143 thejake @ 02/24/09 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYyankz225


	I have a question about the accuracy section. Don't know if this was mentioned.... Based on your new algorithm...It seems like there's no way that a ball can be thrown behind the receiver. I think having an inaccurate qb throw right behind a receiver running an out and into the waiting safeties arms would be good too. I'm no programmer (or artist obviously ) but this is how it should look imo. I understand the smaller the area the less odds of the ball being thrown around that area which is why you went for the new shape. But the same should be done in a smaller fashion for the opposite side. Just my opinion. Don't know if it's feasible or maybe I'm just misunderstanding your chart. EXCELLENT work overall though Ian .

You see the part where it says perfect accuracy. That is where the wide receiver will be when the ball get there. There is some area behind that red circle, therefore passes behind the receiver are possible.

# 144 Lakers 24 7 @ 02/24/09 04:53 PM

No it's not about me and what I feel. I didn't want to say of whom I'm speaking for because I know what would ensue. But, since you think I'm being selfish I'm actually expressing the same feelings that many sim/2k fans have expressed for a long time now. So, no its not about me its about the thousands of gamers that EA took a game away from and has yet to deliver an enjoyable experience for that fanbase who has thus far been left in the dark. That's who its really about.

I'm done though now that everything has been clearified. My apologies for disrupting the mood, I was not trying to be disruptive, I'm just being honest. To this enhancement specifically and everything else aside it is something that's long over due.

# 145 roadman @ 02/24/09 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lakers 24/7


	No it's not about me and what I feel. I didn't want to say of whom I'm speaking for because I know what would ensue. But, since you think I'm being selfish I'm actually expressing the same feelings that many sim/2k fans have expressed for a long time now. So, no its not about me its about the thousands of gamers that EA took a game away from and has yet to deliver an enjoyable experience for that fanbase who has thus far been left in the dark. That's who its really about. I'm done though now that everything has been clearified. My apologizes for disrupting the mood, I was not trying to be disruptive, I'm just being honest. To this enhancement specifically and everything else aside it is something that's long over due.

Here's the thing, though, and you've already addressed this.

It isn't anything EA/Ian/Phil and this forum haven't heard on a daily basis in other threads.

There isn't anything the current new leadership can do with the past and neither can we.

So far, Ian and the new team has been listening to bring the sim into Madden, don't you agree?

# 146 Stikskillz @ 02/24/09 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by STLRams


	Please don't have that QB vision/flashlight thing that was on one of the former Madden games on by default. I hated how that looked during gameplay, it looked like a gimmick. I understand the reason behind it, but lets get back to playing straight up sim football. No weapons, icons, flashlights, attached to players, have the game look like you are watching a real NFL game.

I agree the icons should be toned down a bit. Most of us know which players can do what. However, the Vision Cone/light doesn't detract from the look or feel of the game.

Since you expressed you understand the reason for the Vision Cone, why do you describe it as a gimmick? It is effective if you are good at using it and it also prevents user's from throwing blindly. It is also realistic because the QB has to see who he is throwing to and the light allows you to look defenders off and use precision passing.

# 147 splff3000 @ 02/24/09 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by STLRams


	Please don't have that QB vision/flashlight thing that was on one of the former Madden games on by default. I hated how that looked during gameplay, it looked like a gimmick. I understand the reason behind it, but lets get back to playing straight up sim football. No weapons, icons, flashlights, attached to players, have the game look like you are watching a real NFL game.

Sorry to get off topic fellas, but how can you say take out vision cone and then let's get back to straight up sim football. The vision cone is/was sim football. You may not have liked the way it looked on the field, but it was no gimmick.

# 148 Stikskillz @ 02/24/09 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by splff3000


	Sorry to get off topic fellas, but how can you say take out vision cone and then let's get back to straight up sim football. The vision cone is/was sim football. You may not have liked the way it looked on the field, but it was no gimmick.

Not off topic at all! This has everything to do with QB improvements. Good to read someone else shares my perspective.

# 149 Danimal @ 02/24/09 05:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYyankz225


	I have a question about the accuracy section. Don't know if this was mentioned.... Based on your new algorithm...It seems like there's no way that a ball can be thrown behind the receiver. I think having an inaccurate qb throw right behind a receiver running an out and into the waiting safeties arms would be good too. I'm no programmer (or artist obviously ) but this is how it should look imo. I understand the smaller the area the less odds of the ball being thrown around that area which is why you went for the new shape. But the same should be done in a smaller fashion for the opposite side. Just my opinion. Don't know if it's feasible or maybe I'm just misunderstanding your chart. EXCELLENT work overall though Ian .

In my opinion you're reading the chart wrong, the WR circle is not the target, the dashed circle is the perfect throw. So there is a small chance of throwing behind the receiver and the chance to throw wide, high or low grows as it goes out. In essence pretty much spot on for an out pattern IMO.

# 150 LBzrule @ 02/24/09 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by splff3000


	Sorry to get off topic fellas, but how can you say take out vision cone and then let's get back to straight up sim football. The vision cone is/was sim football. You may not have liked the way it looked on the field, but it was no gimmick.

Even if the vision cone was/is sim, he can still say get rid of it, because a game can be sim without it. And if a game can be sim without it, what need would there be for it except as some add on, that's an option at best and irrelevant at worst.

# 151 dregnus @ 02/24/09 05:58 PM

Absolutely awesome.

If we can get some new throws added in as a result of the new ratings (i.e. touch passes, instead of just bullets and lobs), this will be amazing. Cover 2 will become a very viable defense package against those QBs that flat out can't stretch out the safeties deep.

And I love the fact that someone who gets sacked while throwing will throw interceptions, incompletions etc again. I hated having a guy wrapped around the QB and the QB is able to get off a laser perfect pass.

In the end, I hope this technology leads to passing that is slightly harder (yet, with a good touch pass, will allow you to beat defenses). When you're no longer able to complete a 10 yard pass, given 3 chances every time, people will start running the ball again.

# 152 adembroski @ 02/24/09 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LBzrule


	Even if the vision cone was/is sim, he can still say get rid of it, because a game can be sim without it. And if a game can be sim without it, what need would there be for it except as some add on, that's an option at best and irrelevant at worst.

I liked the vision cone a lot, but yeah, it doesn't, in and of itself, decide whether Madden is "sim" or not. The same effect can be simulated in a number of ways, which we've had endless discussion about.

The biggest problem with the sim argument is that we want to, for the most part, retain control. In most cases, more control = less sim, and vica virca. By putting the function of the vision cone (to make smart, experienced QBs commensurately better than their lesser counterparts) under the hood, you make the game "more sim" by taking control away from the player.

The nice thing about the vision cone is that it struck a good balance between sim and control. However, it was probably too much control as it made the player's job more difficult, and often frustrating. Much as I liked it, I'd rather see something less intrusive.

# 153 atlplayboy23 @ 02/24/09 06:18 PM

Yes im very excited

# 154 BezO @ 02/24/09 06:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by splff3000


	Sorry to get off topic fellas, but how can you say take out vision cone and then let's get back to straight up sim football. The vision cone is/was sim football. You may not have liked the way it looked on the field, but it was no gimmick.

There was nothing sim about the cone. All you had to do was hold the trigger and double-tap which ever pass button. At best it cost you an extra .3 seconds. I never felt it emulated a QB locating his receiver. And it was ugly.

# 155 Lakers 24 7 @ 02/24/09 07:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roadman


	Here's the thing, though, and you've already addressed this. It isn't anything EA/Ian/Phil and this forum haven't heard on a daily basis in other threads. There isn't anything the current new leadership can do with the past and neither can we. So far, Ian and the new team has been listening to bring the sim into Madden, don't you agree?

Listening yes, I'll give them that. It actually seems that EA has become more open to the community now, whereas 2k has kinda back-tracked in that regard. So, I'll give them their due respect for that. However actually taking enough action to make Madden more sim is debatable, I'll just say that 09 wasn't and I'll hold judgement on 10 until a demo is released.

# 156 savetheday21 @ 02/24/09 07:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ian_Cummings_EA


	http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Debbie_Downer

baaaaaahahahahaha.

# 157 roadman @ 02/24/09 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lakers 24/7


	Listening yes, I'll give them that. It actually seems that EA has become more open to the community now, whereas 2k has kinda back-tracked in that regard. So, I'll give them their due respect for that. However actually taking enough action to make Madden more sim is debatable, I'll just say that 09 wasn't and I'll hold judgement on 10 until a demo is released.

Agreed, it is debatable because 10 isn't out, yet. You have every right to hold judgment until then.

I'm not sure everything everyone wants will be in 10 because will all want different things. Personally, for me, game play, AI, and presentation needs beefed up, without going into much detail. I'm sure it's different for others.

# 158 rudyjuly2 @ 02/24/09 07:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by adembroski


	I liked the vision cone a lot, but yeah, it doesn't, in and of itself, decide whether Madden is "sim" or not. The same effect can be simulated in a number of ways, which we've had endless discussion about. The biggest problem with the sim argument is that we want to, for the most part, retain control. In most cases, more control = less sim, and vica virca. By putting the function of the vision cone (to make smart, experienced QBs commensurately better than their lesser counterparts) under the hood, you make the game "more sim" by taking control away from the player. The nice thing about the vision cone is that it struck a good balance between sim and control. However, it was probably too much control as it made the player's job more difficult, and often frustrating. Much as I liked it, I'd rather see something less intrusive.

I agree. I didn't like the look of the field with it in the short time I tried it. I'd prefer trying another method to tackle the same thing. The problem isn't just the QB though. Every player we use on offense and defense renders awareness useless. It's the nature of video game football.

# 159 kcarr @ 02/24/09 07:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rudyjuly2


	I agree. I didn't like the look of the field with it in the short time I tried it. I'd prefer trying another method to tackle the same thing. The problem isn't just the QB though. Every player we use on offense and defense renders awareness useless. It's the nature of video game football.

There are ways they can make awareness more important for controlled players though. Reaction time is one simple way. Also with some of the animations. If a player is controlling a DB or receiver and hits the catch button then if the guy can see the ball he should know where it is and reach for it. If he can't see it he should still put his hands up and make an attempt but it should be without really knowing where the ball is and reduce the chances of getting his hands on the ball.

For tackles I don't really see where you could try to tackle a guy you can't see but the block shedding/avoiding thing come in to play.

As for reading plays and choosing the hole to plug it is tough to do this other than the reaction time but when it comes to getting blocked if the awareness determines your guy sees the block coming it could increase the chances of shedding it and decrease the chances of getting blindsided and completely leveled.

As for running the ball making moves guys with high awareness should naturally be more able to sense hits and keep from getting leveled like with the getting blocked thing. Also this could lead to less fumbles since although you still might get tackled you won't be blindsided by it. Also, for instance say you are running in the open with one defender in front of you and one coming from the side if your awareness causes your player to see the second defender coming then when you make your move he can try to adjust his steps to not run into the other guy. This would not necessarily mean success, agility should have something to do with the ability to actually adjust.

As for a blocker it can add to adjusting to moves made by the defense, avoiding penalties, etc.

As a quarterback the best way is the vision cone. It can also used for going in to evasive type moves. Also since there aren't any composure/leadership type ratings it could work for them too.

Also it can work to do a lot with CPU controlled players but these are ways it should effect user controlled players

# 160 rudyjuly2 @ 02/24/09 08:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kcarr


	As a quarterback the best way is the vision cone. It can also used for going in to evasive type moves. Also since there aren't any composure/leadership type ratings it could work for them too.

You make a lot of interesting points in your post but I hate the vision cone with regards to the QB position. The best idea I can come up with is to boost and weaken opposing DBs pass defense awareness based on the user QB awareness. This wouldn't change the way you play the game but would also make passing more difficult with a crappy QB and easier with a better QB.

Some might find that a cheap way to do it but I disagree. How many times have you watched a bad QB play and it seems as though nobody is open? DBs read their eyes and/or the bad QB is too slow on his reads making DBs anticipation seem better. This would mimic that. Conversely, Peyton Manning makes DBs look bad and slow to react while passing (ie. downgrade their awareness attributes). I'm not going to say it's a perfect sim but neither is a vision cone and my solution doesn't involve a goofy looking flashlight on the field.

Final point: the one thing EA could do to make this even better is to add a rating for quickness of release. That would separate the quick gunning qbs from the slow windup ones like Kerry Collins.

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