Madden NFL 11 News Post

FBGRatings Seeks to Recalibrate Madden Ratings, Change Game

01:46 PM - January 24, 2011 by RaychelSnr

I recentely sat down for a talk with FBGRatings.com's Dan Berens to discuss his site's vision and what's going on over there today. The site is currently working on getting accurate ratings for every player using real hard data converted into the Madden ratings universe. Dan claims that when these numbers are plugged into the game, it plays much better and much closer to real life. Check out the interview below and also check out Dan's website to see what he's got going on!

Interview with Berens on the OS Radio Show on BlogTalkRadio

Game: Madden NFL 11Reader Score: 6/10 - Vote Now
Platform: PS3 / Xbox 360Votes for game: 96 - View All

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Member Comments

# 1221 DCEBB2001 @ 07/22/14 07:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by michiganfan8620


	I guess I just don't understand how a scout could grade a player so lowly based on the fact that he is suspended if you aren't factoring in production. How is he any less of a player? And another thing, I'm guessing Madden doesn't use historical players in their interpretation of the data. Thus, if a player was considered to have the strongest arm in football, they give him a high rating. Even though he might only be a 4.0 on the 0-5.0 scale, which I'm assuming equals a 80 rating, he gets a high 90 rating in order to fit the programming of the game (making sure he can throw the ball as far as he actually can in real life). And then they go from there with the rest of the players. They are just focused on the present time, and how players currently in the league compare to each other, not on how they compare to all-time greats. At least that's what I'm assuming Madden does.

Think about it this way. If the ratings are real-time and a player is out (like he would be for an injury), he essentially falls off of the depth chart. When a player is active/healthy, he is placed back on the depth chart. The same thing follows here. Scouts actually do it, knowing full well that they will be readjusted at a later date. I doubt they lose sleep over it.

The problem with Madden, to me, is that they do keep adjusting year after year and do not allow for any continuity between seasons. They don't include the greats. They don't include the entire ratings scale. Why not? I think it has to do more with many current good players being rated in the 70s than the public could stomach. But, those are the facts. Scouts use all-time information to see how good a player may be. Why doesn't Madden.

# 1222 DCEBB2001 @ 07/22/14 07:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by michiganfan8620


	He will say its due to Pouncey's injury and surgery, and that once he is back to health, his rating will promptly be adjusted. Although I noticed something there as well. Why is Dion Jordan's rating a 72 when he is suspended, whereas Robert Mathis is a 44 with the same length suspension?

Correct. However, a suspension doesn't mean a player's rating will drop either. It just depends on a case by case basis. I guess they felt that Jordan's isn't worthy of a drop yet, or at least as severe as one.

# 1223 DCEBB2001 @ 07/22/14 07:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JHTJ


	My apologies, I would have liked to spend some time reading the thread but with 130+ pages I decided that just wasn't happening. The obvious question would be why are ratings being tweaked in the offseason based on injuries with speculative impact on performance? Eh, I'm sure that too was answered at some point in time. Disregard, if I really want the answer ill dig for it. I will say that regardless of justification, ratings adjustments made based on injuries or suspensions doesn't sound like a system that interest me.

You can look at our FAQ page. Most of your questions are answered there. Scouts tweak the ratings when ever a change is warranted. They do not do it without reason. Those reasons change from player to player. I suppose you would have to ask them directly. If this system doesn't interest you, you can always stick with EA's over-inflated ratings.

# 1224 DCEBB2001 @ 07/22/14 07:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JHTJ


	I couldn't even make it past the Dolphins before I saw some serious issues with the ratings on that site. I mean, real bad. Now I�m not suggesting players as a whole are underrated, or the team is collectively better than depicted at all. I could care less, honestly. I will say though that rating Pro Bowl C Mike Pouncey as the 4th worst player on the team is a travesty if Ive ever seen one. Rated 53 behind two undrafted Centers fighting for roster spots is crazy. You have an undrafted ROOKIE rated ahead of All SEC, All American, Pro Bowl, PFF rated top 10 Pouncey. I'm sure undertaking and implementing this rating process is a difficult task so this post comes with all respect due. I might be willing to concede that considering his injury pouncey had a slightly off year, but I watch every game - Every snap my Fins play repeatedly and I can say unequivocally that rating is garbage. I don't expect you to defend this rating because, quite honestly, i don't think it's possible. The fact is its your site and you can publish what you like. I just wanted to point out what I saw as a glaring inaccuracy.

Is Pouncey injured? Injuries definitely affect the OVR rating. I mean, try to play the game at the same All-Pro level with a torn ACL or dislocated hip. Not going to happen.

# 1225 DCEBB2001 @ 07/22/14 07:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ggsimmonds


	(Respond to this whenever you wish, not trying to hold you hostage) I am entering graduate school at UMD College Park studying Public Policy. So I am still something of a duckling learning to fly when it comes to statistical analysis. But for this, I think my interest is more of a scouting perspective. What goes into a grade in route running? Number of steps/yards covered, getting off the line, breakdown (how many steps do they take), foot planting, things like that? what about coverage skills? It seems easier to grade someone running routes as you would have a slightly easier time doing that without a defender than measuring coverage skills without a WR.

Many things, I am sure, go into each category. For route running, how well the receiver gets off the ball without false steps, gains leverage, sells the DB on the stem, uses a pressure step, accelerates out of the cut, doesn't give away the route, etc. all factor in.

# 1226 charter04 @ 07/22/14 12:45 PM

I'm broadcasting a game using the FBG rosters. Everything is default AP except I'm using slow speed 0 thresh. Also it's the version before rookies. Someone else is doing teams so I am waiting until he puts the file back up before I update. It's spectator mode so there is no user influence

www.twitch.tv/charter04.com

# 1227 charter04 @ 07/22/14 12:55 PM

I'll be showing some games off an on all day.

# 1228 charter04 @ 07/22/14 01:12 PM

Keep in mind this is still Madden. At default the QB's are still going to be too accurate. I think I'm just going to go back to 50 threshold too. The QB's had a more realistic accuracy % at 50. I just forgot to change it back. I'm going to get the FBG roster that someone just PMed me that is more updated and has some rookies.

# 1229 charter04 @ 07/22/14 01:44 PM

Got a good one going with Johnny Football and the Browns against the Bills. I don't think the Bills have their rookies yet but, the Browns do

# 1230 michiganfan8620 @ 07/22/14 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DCEBB2001


	Correct. However, a suspension doesn't mean a player's rating will drop either. It just depends on a case by case basis. I guess they felt that Jordan's isn't worthy of a drop yet, or at least as severe as one.

That just doesn't make sense. Both Jordan and Mathis have the same 4 game suspension. Therefore, any official scouting service would have a specific protocol to handle suspended players. It makes no sense to say "Robert Mathis only deserves a 2.4 FMV because he is suspended" but "Dion Jordan deserves a 3.2 FMV because he is suspended as well". Especially when Mathis is a much better player than Jordan at this point. No scouting service operates like that, and if they do, it isn't one that anyone with common sense would use.

# 1231 DCEBB2001 @ 07/22/14 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by michiganfan8620


	That just doesn't make sense. Both Jordan and Mathis have the same 4 game suspension. Therefore, any official scouting service would have a specific protocol to handle suspended players. It makes no sense to say "Robert Mathis only deserves a 2.4 FMV because he is suspended" but "Dion Jordan deserves a 3.2 FMV because he is suspended as well". Especially when Mathis is a much better player than Jordan at this point. No scouting service operates like that, and if they do, it isn't one that anyone with common sense would use.

Every player and their situations are different. Mathis is still graded out at 2.8 in his category correlating to the FMV attribute. Jordan is still graded at 1.4 in his. The suspension, injury, or whatever case happens to any player simply modifies the final value by a multiplier. Once he is designated good to go for a return, the multiplier will be adjusted. Keep in mind that we also have to work within the framework of EA's OVR formulas and can't just rate players in an equal-interval method without an OVR value to meet. Last time I did that, people were pissed because guys like Wes Welker were coming in at 75 instead of 90 or whatever, WHICH I CAN SEE as being an issue for contracts, trade values, etc.

# 1232 charter04 @ 07/22/14 05:49 PM

I'm broadcasting the rest of the CLE/Buff game now. It might be laggy because I think everyone in the whole house in using a device on the internet. lol

I think slow 35 thresh is proving to be the best with these rosters.

# 1233 DCEBB2001 @ 07/22/14 06:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by charter04


	I'm broadcasting the rest of the CLE/Buff game now. It might be laggy because I think everyone in the whole house in using a device on the internet. lol I think slow 35 thresh is proving to be the best with these rosters.

Watching it now. Pretty cool man!

# 1234 charter04 @ 07/22/14 06:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DCEBB2001


	Watching it now. Pretty cool man!

even at default sliders QB's accuracy is much closer to reality. It's still Madden but, the game is more realistic with these rosters IMO

# 1235 DCEBB2001 @ 07/22/14 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by charter04


	even at default sliders QB's accuracy is much closer to reality. It's still Madden but, the game is more realistic with these rosters IMO

I must say, you don't see as much herky jerky player movement. They seem to run and interact a bit more smoothly.

# 1236 charter04 @ 07/22/14 06:59 PM

showing Seahawks at Panthers now. No rookies.

# 1237 RogueHominid @ 07/22/14 07:26 PM

What do you guys do with/about the rookie classes once in a CFM?

# 1238 charter04 @ 07/22/14 07:34 PM

Ill show the rest of that game later tonight. Looks like it's going to be a defensive battle

# 1239 ggsimmonds @ 07/22/14 07:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DCEBB2001


	Many things, I am sure, go into each category. For route running, how well the receiver gets off the ball without false steps, gains leverage, sells the DB on the stem, uses a pressure step, accelerates out of the cut, doesn't give away the route, etc. all factor in.

But would they break it down to the components, assign each one a individual grade and then add them all up? Could you speak to how rigid the grading is? How much variance is there between different scouts?

This next question you may not be able or willing to answer, but how much variance is there for the entire data set? How is the distribution? The scale is 0.0 to 5.0 correct? Would you mind providing something of a landmark? Like the typical all pro grades at 3.8, average starter would be what? If I am getting too close to asking for specifics or information that you would rather not share I understand. Sorry if I am asking too many questions.

# 1240 charter04 @ 07/22/14 07:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ggsimmonds


	But would they break it down to the components, assign each one a individual grade and then add them all up? Could you speak to how rigid the grading is? How much variance is there between different scouts? This next question you may not be able or willing to answer, but how much variance is there for the entire data set? How is the distribution? The scale is 0.0 to 5.0 correct? Would you mind providing something of a landmark? Like the typical all pro grades at 3.8, average starter would be what? If I am getting too close to asking for specifics or information that you would rather not share I understand. Sorry if I am asking too many questions.

My guess would be 4.0-5.0 (blue chip) 3.0-3.99(red chip) 2.4-2.99 (purple)

Then the rest

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