Madden NFL 11 News Post

Madden NFL 11 Blog: Locomotion w/ Videos and L.T. Screenshot

03:53 PM - April 7, 2010 by Steve_OS

EA Sports has just posted another Madden NFL 11 blog. This one focusing on locomotion.

Quote:


	"Obviously, players in pads can�t run the same speed as a world class sprinter coming out of blocks but their acceleration curves have the same shape. They get up to around 80% of their top speed relatively quickly, but the last 20% is stretched out further (it takes the Olympic guys around 60 meters to hit 100% of their top speed). Once I had the curves created, I tuned them around combine 40 times and 100 meter times of players who ran track in college. I then passed that info on to Ratings Czar Donny Moore so he could set speed and acceleration accurately for our rosters. In total, we have 24 different curves that we can tune to control everything from how a player's speed increases over time (based on acceleration and speed ratings), to how much he can turn based on his current speed (driven by the agility rating). That level of control really lets us differentiate players on the field. It is now possible for our ratings guys to make players that are quick over 10 to 20 yards, but get smoked at longer distances. A 90 speed player can now run the same 40 time as a 99 speed player, but lose over longer distances. I have a video here to highlight this. I created two players. The first is 99 speed, 90 acceleration (#99, on the top in the video). The second is 90 speed ,99 acceleration (#90 on the bottom in the video). The players race for 90 yards in the video. As you can see, the player with higher acceleration jumps out to an early lead, but gets passed at around 40 yards by the higher speed player. The animations aren't final (particularly the initial move that plays), and I still have some fine tuning to do on how we map the acceleration and speed ratings into our set of curves, but you can see how powerful acceleration is going to be in Madden NFL 11."

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Member Comments

# 161 splff3000 @ 04/09/10 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pacman83


	^^Maybe its you that doesn't get it. Read my other posts to get where i'm coming from.

Pacman, it's well known that it's not really cost effective to try to make a sim style football game without the NFL license, especially in this day and age with high development costs. APF2k8 tried this and while it was a solid game of football it didn't sell too well. That is mostly due to the lack of the NFL license. You see, to make a full fledged sim football game, with full franchise and the works, without the NFL license is very risky. It takes a lot of time and money to do that and it's not guaranteed you'll see a return on your investment because of how popular the NFL is. Without that, you could put all this money, time, and effort into a game, only to have it not sell well simply due to the lack of the NFL license. I'm fairly confident that a game could come out and be 10x better than Madden and Madden would still have comparable sales simply for the fact that it has the NFL license. That's why you see games like Backbreaker trying new things like euphoria and different camera angles and like Blitz with over the top violence and stuff. They are trying something different because they know the sim crowd wants the NFL. Now I consider myself a sim football fan, and I'll give any football game a try, but the majority won't. That's the real reason there isn't a 2k football game. Most people know this. In fact, 2k execs themselves have said this.

I just wanted to point this out to you because you're posts are making you look.....what's the word..........young, I guess. I'm not trying to call you names or anything like that, but that's what you are coming off as. Some young kid who doesn't understand the concept of business. Once again, I'm not saying that's what you are, but that's what you're coming off as.

# 162 Pacman83 @ 04/09/10 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by splff3000


	Pacman, it's well known that it's not really cost effective to try to make a sim style football game without the NFL license, especially in this day and age with high development costs. APF2k8 tried this and while it was a solid game of football it didn't sell too well. That is mostly due to the lack of the NFL license. You see, to make a full fledged sim football game, with full franchise and the works, without the NFL license is very risky. It takes a lot of time and money to do that and it's not guaranteed you'll see a return on your investment because of how popular the NFL is. Without that, you could put all this money, time, and effort into a game, only to have it not sell well simply due to the lack of the NFL license. I'm fairly confident that a game could come out and be 10x better than Madden and Madden would still have comparable sales simply for the fact that it has the NFL license. That's why you see games like Backbreaker trying new things like euphoria and different camera angles and like Blitz with over the top violence and stuff. They are trying something different because they know the sim crowd wants the NFL. Now I consider myself a sim football fan, and I'll give any football game a try, but the majority won't. That's the real reason there isn't a 2k football game. Most people know this. In fact, 2k execs themselves have said this. I just wanted to point this out to you because you're posts are making you look.....what's the word..........young, I guess. I'm not trying to call you names or anything like that, but that's what you are coming off as. Some young kid who doesn't understand the concept of business. Once again, I'm not saying that's what you are, but that's what you're coming off as.

This is the Madden forums, so gonna let it go...I guess i am young (26), maybe a bit dumb, plenty of things i dont understand (maybe because my major isnt business)...not that i care. But my point was that maybe at the time yes football isnt going to sell for 2K, however, whose to say?--I mean to me their other games have slipped, hockey, baseball, & basketball. So whose to say that there's no market for them to compete with a subpar Madden? To me BB producers have less money than 2k...so i guess i don't understand it, its sounds backwards to say its not cost effective and then you have someone making BB when obviously Madden is back to reaching its peak.

# 163 Only1LT @ 04/09/10 04:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NavigatorD83


	Visual Concepts knows what they are doing

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pacman83


	If they did, they'd still be making football* games.*

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pacman83


	Yea...learn to read, never said that.

Lol. Maybe you should learn to read what you write.

# 164 Pacman83 @ 04/09/10 04:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Only1LT


	Lol. Maybe you should learn to read what you write.

wow...

Yup...got me? Read one post and all

# 165 Only1LT @ 04/09/10 04:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pacman83


	This is the Madden forums, so gonna let it go...I guess i am young (26), maybe a bit dumb, plenty of things i dont understand (maybe because my major isnt business)...not that i care. But my point was that maybe at the time yes football isnt going to sell for 2K, however, whose to say?--I mean to me their other games have slipped, hockey, baseball, & basketball. So whose to say that there's no market for them to compete with a subpar Madden? To me BB producers have less money than 2k...so i guess i don't understand it, its sounds backwards to say its not cost effective and then you have someone making BB when obviously Madden is back to reaching its peak.

The one thing that you, and everyone else, needs to understand about Natural Motion is that they could care less about Football. Making a Football game is not some passion that they have. They aren't trying to take over EA's turf. First and foremost, their objective is to showcase the Euphoria engine, and they felt that Football was a great opportunity to show what their tech can do. How do I know this? Because, THEY said it.

You can't compare someone making a game to showcase an engine with the end game being to license said engine to as many companies as possible, and who wants to sell games, don't get me wrong, but that is not the ONLY motivation, to someone like a 2K, who would not be licensing their tech, and whose ONLY goal is to sell games. Not even close to being the same.

# 166 splff3000 @ 04/09/10 04:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pacman83


	This is the Madden forums, so gonna let it go...I guess i am young (26), maybe a bit dumb, plenty of things i dont understand (maybe because my major isnt business)...not that i care. But my point was that maybe at the time yes football isnt going to sell for 2K, however, whose to say?--I mean to me their other games have slipped, hockey, baseball, & basketball. So whose to say that there's no market for them to compete with a subpar Madden? To me BB producers have less money than 2k...so i guess i don't understand it, its sounds backwards to say its not cost effective and then you have someone making BB when obviously Madden is back to reaching its peak.

Once again, I wasn't trying to offend you. I was just saying what you were coming off like. Anyway, BB is trying a lot of new things that haven't been done in a football game before. I don't think 2k would be willing to try those things because, to be quite honest, it wouldn't be the 2k that we know anymore. It would be something different. Another thing is 2k has already thrown their hat in the ring one time and they didn't like the return they got on it. This is Natural Motion(the Backbreaker producers) first game in the market. If it's sales are lower than expected, it too will be gone. I'm hoping that isn't case though because I feel that Madden needs to feel threatened to really shine.

# 167 Only1LT @ 04/09/10 04:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pacman83


	wow... Yup...got me? Read one post and all

I've read every single post on this thread, including yours. That's irrelevant though, considering the only post that I need to have read is the one above to show the point I was making. But forget it at this point. It is what it is.

# 168 Pacman83 @ 04/09/10 04:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Only1LT


	The one thing that you, and everyone else, needs to understand about Natural Motion is that they could care less about Football. Making a Football game is not some passion that they have. They aren't trying to take over EA's turf. First and foremost, their objective is to showcase the Euphoria engine, and they felt that Football was a great opportunity to show what their tech can do. How do I know this? Because, THEY said it. You can't compare someone making a game to showcase an engine with the end game being to license said engine to as many companies as possible, and who wants to sell games, don't get me wrong, but that is not the ONLY motivation, to someone like a 2K, who would not be licensing their tech, and whose ONLY goal is to sell games. Not even close to being the same.

Ok, slowly gettin' it. Still some questions, not the place for it, but that clears its up a bit. Kinda appreciate that bit of insight.

# 169 Pacman83 @ 04/09/10 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Only1LT


	I've read every single post on this thread, including yours. That's irrelevant though, considering the only post that I need to have read is the one above to show the point I was making. But forget it at this point. It is what it is.

Then you'd know that is never said that they didn't know how to make football games, if i did then quote me?

# 170 Only1LT @ 04/09/10 04:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pacman83


	Then you'd know that is never said that they didn't know how* to make football games, if i did then quote me?*

Lol. I don't know if you are messing with me at this point or not, but it's Friday so I'll bite.

When someone makes a comment saying that EA should take some cues from 2K, and you say they shouldn't. Then the person replies that 2K knows what they are doing, and you say if they did they would still be making Football games. How could any reasonable person not infer that you are saying that the fact that 2K doesn't make games anymore is because they DON'T know what they are doing, i.e. that their Football games are not good? Especially when you preface it by saying how their other Sports titles are not good or declining lol?

So did you ever post "2K makes bad Football games"? No, but it doesn't take a genius to make the connection from the conversation that you had with the other poster, that you were saying that, without saying it lol.

Own up to it, or don't. Just don't think me a fool. I'm done with it, for reals this time lol. We can move on.

# 171 Pacman83 @ 04/09/10 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Only1LT


	Lol. I don't know if you are messing with me at this point or not, but it's Friday so I'll bite. When someone makes a comment saying that EA should take some cues from 2K, and you say they shouldn't. Then the person replies that 2K knows what they are doing, and you say if they did they would still be making Football games. How could any reasonable person not infer that you are saying that the fact that 2K doesn't make games anymore is because they DON'T know what they are doing, i.e. that their Football games are not good? Especially when you preface it by saying how their other Sports titles are not good or declining lol? So did you ever post "2K makes bad Football games"? No, but it doesn't take a genius to make the connection from the conversation that you had with the other poster, that you were saying that, without saying it lol. Own up to it, or don't. Just don't think me a fool. I'm done with it, for reals this time lol. We can move on.

Wow. Don't know what dots you're connecting...you're twisting my words, half read ish, & drawing dumb conclusions. Sounds like my Ex...moving on...

# 172 Only1LT @ 04/09/10 05:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pacman83


	Wow. Don't know what dots you're* connecting...you're twisting my words, half read ish, & drawing dumb conclusions. Sounds like my Ex...moving on...*

Lol. What ever helps you sleep at night

# 173 jclentzthadon @ 04/09/10 10:04 PM

Pac, leave it alone dude. It's getting embarassing for you...

# 174 Pacman83 @ 04/09/10 11:29 PM

Embarrassing? lol...its online, plus anybody that can read can see my point, w/o twisting my words.

Some one else mentioned 2k, so i just question 2K's business decisions in reference to competition with Madden and other EA games. Any other assumption is just dumb.

# 175 Pacman83 @ 04/09/10 11:49 PM

If you say so....dude.

# 176 johnnyg713 @ 04/10/10 01:09 AM

Looking at the screenshots and comparing how much better NCAA 11 looks, I have concluded Madden 11 is going to have a lot going on, on the sidelines this year...

# 177 23 @ 04/10/10 01:29 AM

You guys move on from the back and forth

# 178 Valdarez @ 04/10/10 08:50 AM

While we are on the subject of locomotion, doesn't anyone here wonder why EA Sports didn't license Euphoria? If you're going to make the best football game to date, why not use the best tech to date?

My answer. Pride. Someone in the EA organization doesn't want to admit they can't build the same thing, and IMHO whoever made that decision needs to be removed from the decision making process as they are limiting the potential of Madden. Think of what Madden could be with Euphoria + Madden's Art team.

The build versus buy debate is always a core choice in the business world, and for the most part you always buy. It almost never makes sense to reinvent the wheel.

# 179 briax87 @ 04/10/10 09:13 AM

Correct me if I'm wrong, but at the community day (for Madden 10) wasn't there some small amounts of locomotion added, but were eventually removed due to the AI defence running past the offence and other related issues? I'm assuming this will have to be worked on too if the locomotion is added too?

# 180 Valdarez @ 04/10/10 09:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by briax87


	Correct me if I'm wrong, but at the community day (for Madden 10) wasn't there some small amounts of locomotion added, but were eventually removed due to the AI defence running past the offence and other related issues? I'm assuming this will have to be worked on too if the locomotion is added too?

I'm not sure, I know that Ian said they weren't able to work on locomotion last year as it meant they'd have to redo all animations and they simply didn't have the cycles to do it and all of the game fixes + ProTak. So if they did anything, then odds are it was very, very small changes. I bet the community day guys can sound off on whether there were changes to locomotion in M10.

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