2k's Obsession with Shooting Cheese

[ksuttonjr76]

Quote: Originally Posted by loso_34

its not even questionable. there was a patch late in 2k17 that had non shooters hitting at a 30-40% clip. big youtubers and guys in the 2KL today threatened to stop playing because their teammates missing open shots was unacceptable to them. they just want a competitive game under basketball settings.

I don't get how they're defining "competitive" game. Basketball, by nature, is a competitive game when stats are "similar" to real life. Now, the average gamer do recognize that the stats will be slightly inflated due to it being a videogame. For example, I'm not going to be highly upset if my opponent shoots 50% from 3PT land on good looks despite a "good" 3PT shooter in the NBA might shoot high 40's on the same open looks unless they're on fire.

When you allow absurd stats in basketball, it STOPS being basketball. It becomes a game of metas, overused cheese tactics, and unrealistic defensive schemes to beat ONE aspect of basketball. The proof is in the pudding.

[derlaid]

There's another way to go about this, and that's to make open shots still go in at a good clip, but to change defense/screens work so that you have to work to get an open shot.

[ILLSmak]

Online has been shooting cheese since 5 on 5 started. It just so happened that now more builds can join the party. 3 is better than 2, better players rebound better, having to chase people around to stop them from shooting 3s = more rebounds. The shot percentage of a 3 + the chance of getting an oreb (both factoring in to what is a 'good shot' online) against the fact that if you miss, the other team is gonna score a lay up at the other end.



That's high level competitive bball online. It's never gonna change, but it gets stupid when you have the same player setting multiple picks for shooters then the whole team flopping when it greens in. I also agree the big man shooting 'meta' is weird, there is basically a 'can do it' and 'can't do it' threshold, but some of that can be negated with badges. It kind of makes you feel like they should lock out more shooting badges from 'paint beast' level big men, kinda like they lock out dimer from non playmaking builds. Get rid of corner badge for them and catch and shoot. Theirs should be more like a catch and finish badge applying to post moves.


Edit: @ ksut, I dunno man. I disagree with the it ain't bball premise. It's not fun though. It's not really good competition. It definitely has to be basketball and it still takes skill to play, but it does take a lot of the beauty away from basketball. I prol need to start posting here again, more often, and start making suggestions. ha.



-Smak

[jk31]

Did you guys know that there exist scripts for getting a perfect release with every shot? And that's not PC exclusive, but available on all consoles, too!


2k could either try to establish some anticheat, or, you know, just remove the green = 100% ****. Wouldn't matter if some stupid losers use a shot timing script then, as they wouldn't hit 100% with it.

[ILLSmak]

Quote: Originally Posted by jk31

Did you guys know that there exist scripts for getting a perfect release with every shot? And that's not PC exclusive, but available on all consoles, too! 2k could either try to establish some anticheat, or, you know, just remove the green = 100% ****. Wouldn't matter if some stupid losers use a shot timing script then, as they wouldn't hit 100% with it.

those dudes on PC with .2 sec releases that are green every time. haha. Almost as funny as the guys with 8 foot long arms. You can still contest it, though. It's pretty funny to make them miss. It's funny how these dudes go through all the trouble of 'hacking' their character, and THEY ARE TRASH.



I was on the mic w/ this dude (or talking at him), just saying I don't understand how you can be so trash if you got a player who is that jacked with exploits. I was even passing him the ball. haha. And we lost. It's like sigh.


-Smak

[MrWrestling3]

Quote: Originally Posted by ksuttonjr76

I don't get how they're defining "competitive" game. Basketball, by nature, is a competitive game when stats are "similar" to real life. Now, the average gamer do recognize that the stats will be slightly inflated due to it being a videogame. For example, I'm not going to be highly upset if my opponent shoots 50% from 3PT land on good looks despite a "good" 3PT shooter in the NBA might shoot high 40's on the same open looks unless they're on fire. When you allow absurd stats in basketball, it STOPS being basketball. It becomes a game of metas, overused cheese tactics, and unrealistic defensive schemes to beat ONE aspect of basketball. The proof is in the pudding.

I think you answered your own question....Basketball and 2K (in its current iteration) define competitive using two completely different set of criteria.

Basketball is defined by the skills associated with the game itself (i.e.Shot IQ,Defensive IQ,knowledge of various techniques, knowledge of plays and personnel,etc.) and with the associated physical skills (Speed,Strength,Agility,Vertical,etc.).

2K is currently defined almost solely by video gaming skills (i.e.the knowledge of metas,cheese tactics,etc. you mentioned).

Remember a few years ago when 2k said they would begin taking "a more RPG esque-approach to the game"? We should have paid more attention back then and raised concerns right away...it's resulting in a game that has become more in common with most of the other popular competitive online games that have nothing to do with basketball than it does with basketball.

[bigeastbumrush]

They’re a business. They’re not in the business of pleasing everyone.

“Sim” should be just that. Make it based on player ratings. Period.

The main online lobby should be “recreation”. An arcade experience that is balanced between player ratings (45%) and shots contested (55%) giving the defense a slight advantage to counter the amount of cheese players online. No green lights whatsover.

This whole shot stick aiming shouldn’t be in any sports game. That is just taking things way too far unnecessarily.

You want guys to blow layups? Ratings and momentum.

You want players to get hot? Ratings and momentum.

Cold? Ratings and momentum.

I shouldn’t miss a layup because I aimed slightly left like I’m firing a gun in Call of Duty.

Get rid of the green lights. Let players focus on the action on the court. Not some stupid minigame to make or miss a shot.

[Real2KInsider]

Quote: Originally Posted by MrWrestling3

The thing is....Alot of the audience aren't hardcore basketball guys.Being more casual fans they've been programmed by highlight reels,Sportscenter, and even 2K itself into thinking that in a typical NBA game Kyrie takes multiple guys off the dribble every possession, Curry drains it every time he shoots, Lebron dunks it over 3 guys every time he gets the ball,etc. With that mindset, of course they're going to think that the guy they made with a similar build shouldn't ever miss.It's basically what they've been taught about the NBA.

It's worth pointing out that most of the people who think they are hardcore basketball guys are really just casuals with an elitist mindset.

2K sold 16 million units this year. The number of applicable "hardcore" players is no more than 50-100K (at best).