Madden 12 News Post

Madden NFL 12 Super Bowl Halftime Blog: Tuner Sets and Surprise Onside Kicks

09:00 PM - February 6, 2011 by Steve_OS

The Madden NFL 12 Super Bowl Halftime blog is online. Tuner sets and surprise onside kicks are in.

Quote:


	""Tuner Sets", introduced in the NHL series and brought into NCAA Football last year, are hugely important to the development of sports games in that they allow us to tune and tweak many existing parts of game code without the major delay that comes from a full title update requiring 1st party console manufacturer approvals. A quick addition to my hacked surprise onside kick code made this feature easily tunable post-ship, and thus much safer against any exploits that may crop up. This isn't the only thing in the tuner sets obviously...we are in the process of moving as many items into these as possible, from gameplay tuning to franchise data to even presentation aspects. We are excited to the possibilities this will open up to our fans in being able to provide live feedback and having us act on it in near real-time. The days of shipping a disc in a box and forgetting about it are long gone, and we want to be at the forefront of blazing new trails in reacting to our audience and improving the game quickly."

Read the entire blog right here, along with a short video showing off the new surprise onside kick, in action.

UPDATE: The podcast is now on iTunes, for those that couldn't listen to it, via the blog.

EDIT: Per Ian Cummings

Quote:


	"RE: surprise onside, you pick a normal kickoff, then hit the B (or Circle) button as the last press on the meter. Your opponent has no clue!"

UPDATE #2: Via Ian

Quote:


	"Since so many people have asked...surprise onside as of today is only allowed 2x per team per game. That value is also in the tuner set."

Game: Madden NFL 12Reader Score: 6.5/10 - Vote Now
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Madden NFL 12 Videos

Member Comments

# 161 Senator Palmer @ 02/08/11 04:03 PM

I can't recall seeing it in regular onside kicks either, but I always thought that that play should trigger some sort of 'fight for the fumble'. That would go a ways in solving the interaction problem.

Every type of onside I've seen was clear recovery, play dead, everyone freezes.

# 162 ryan36 @ 02/08/11 05:05 PM

I don't think tuner sets are minor. I think that's huge for guys like us. Ian's trying to throw us a bone, and we bitch ...SMH

# 163 Bellsprout @ 02/08/11 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LiquorLogic


	I'm sorry, but it looks like it's going to be more of the same.

5 months before it goes gold, that's a reasonable statement.

Isn't it possible that they've only coded the surprise kicks and haven't yet tied celebration animations to the kicks yet?

# 164 jeremym480 @ 02/08/11 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dayman


	5 months before it goes gold, that's a reasonable statement. Isn't it possible that they've only coded the surprise kicks and haven't yet tied celebration animations to the kicks yet?

By George, you might be onto something

# 165 The GIGGAS @ 02/08/11 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ryan36


	I don't think tuner sets are minor. I think that's huge for guys like us. Ian's trying to throw us a bone, and we bitch ...SMH

I agree with you there. Having tuner sets is a step in the right direction. The bitching is not even close to being warranted at this point in the game's release cycle. No one knows how the game's going to be at release... not even developers! To immediately write the game off is short-sighted at best.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dayman


	5 months before it goes gold, that's a reasonable statement. Isn't it possible that they've only coded the surprise kicks and haven't yet tied celebration animations to the kicks yet?

It's quite possible. We've got multiple months before the game goes gold.

# 166 The GIGGAS @ 02/08/11 05:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LiquorLogic


	Anything is possible, but that doesn't mean it's probable. At this stage of the game, I've been disappointed too much, I need to see it to believe it.

Yet you're not going to wait to bash the game? Let's step back for a minute. Let's look at what we know about Madden 12.

It's got tuner sets.
It's got surprise onsides.

That is pretty much all we know. Anything we saw in that build Ian was playing could be changed at any time.

All I'm asking is to wait to bash the game. The game is not anywhere close to a shippable state. Madden hasn't been great, but just because a game hasn't been great doesn't mean it can't recover. FIFA recovered. EA NHL recovered. Let's give Ian and co. a chance to improve it without jumping down his throat because he showed us two features that he barely got approved.

# 167 sb24 @ 02/08/11 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LiquorLogic


	Anything is possible, but that doesn't mean it's probable. At this stage of the game, I've been disappointed too much, I need to see it to believe it.

Well then just wait and see and move on.

Moving on......

I never play NCAA so I will be curious to see the effect the tuner set brings to this game. And As long as the surprise onside has balance, its a great feature. I am so tired of guys taking something like this and then complaining about it claiming its going to ruin online. The next sentence they claim they dont even play online. So annoying.

# 168 Hooe @ 02/08/11 05:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The GIGGAS


	Yet you're not going to wait to bash the game? Let's step back for a minute. Let's look at what we know about Madden 12. It's got tuner sets. It's got surprise onsides. That is pretty much all we know. Anything we saw in that build Ian was playing could be changed at any time. All I'm asking is to wait to bash the game. The game is not anywhere close to a shippable state. Madden hasn't been great, but just because a game hasn't been great doesn't mean it can't recover. FIFA recovered. EA NHL recovered. Let's give Ian and co. a chance to improve it without jumping down his throat because he showed us two features that he barely got approved.

On top of all that, we also know it's being built on top of Madden NFL 11, which is actually (speaking strictly on-the-field) a pretty solid and fun football video game, IMO.

Are there things we all want to see done for Madden 12? Sure. Are the two new features unveiled in Ian's blog a fine start, particularly with the knowledge that the best is yet to come? Indeed they are.

# 169 The GIGGAS @ 02/08/11 08:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LiquorLogic


	Given EA's track record, with Madden, EA has earned my skepticism. I've purchased every Madden on this generation of consoles and have been disappointed every single time. I have no problems with the tuner sets. In fact I'm glad that there are tuner sets in the game. It would have been nice to have them in M11, but that's water under the bridge. The onside kick footage was discouraging. The player movement, emotion, and awareness left a lot to be desired.

Why have you continued to buy them if you are disappointed?

Regardless, software can only change so much in the early part of a piece of software. First, features have to be designed and implemented. February is a very early stage to completely cast out the chance of a game being bad. I understand the idea of skepticism, but at least give the Madden guys a chance to build the game! Emotion isn't just a flip you can switch in the code... it's going to take time to build into it (if they are indeed doing that). To extrapolate that the game is going to suck (or if it is going to be great) based on 20 seconds of a pre-alpha build is jumping the gun so badly that the gun hasn't left the official's pants pocket.

# 170 TexasBorn1 @ 02/08/11 08:14 PM

Having tuner sets is nice. The NHL team has made great use of them and I hope the Madden team can do the same.

Don't really care about the surprise onside kick, but I know they can't give much else because of Marketing. We'll see by draft time what the game is mostly about

# 171 frankrizzo380 @ 02/08/11 09:11 PM

oh yeah, i forgot to tell yall,

# 172 BlueNGold @ 02/08/11 09:16 PM

^ Already posted.

# 173 carnalnirvana @ 02/08/11 09:19 PM

when tuner sets were being introduced for ncaa, some guys over at the nhl boards came over and told us the things it had done for their game, they mentioned things like gameplay elements like puck speeds, on the ice changes so we were all hyped thinking things like throw velocity or jumping LB's could be altered

well.....

if i remember right ncaa tuners fixed bugs in stats

the Lb's the qb's and on field elements were never touched what are the tuners really for in the football games?

if the tuner sets aren't for gameplay then its like admiting that the game has bugs that we will try to address at a later date post release.

tuners were supposed to give you a different version of the same game, you choose which tuner you wanted to use.

why do we even need tuners?

# 174 spit_bubble @ 02/09/11 06:24 AM

Quote:


	"Since so many people have asked...surprise onside as of today is only allowed 2x per team per game. That value is also in the tuner set."

It's stuff like this that makes me question this team's ability to design a game. A better way to set it up would be to simply have a surprise onside kick have about a fraction of a percent chance of actually working a second time around.

In real life, if a team pulls off a surprise onside kick, it's basically not going to work if it's tried again. So in the game a better design choice would be to have the receiving team ready to snuff out any subsequent attempt at a surprise onside kick.

The way they did it is merely a shortcut, and while it may be at least somewhat effective at simulating reality, it is not strong design.

If they are worried about people spamming the play, the fact that it wouldn't work a second or third time should be enough to discourage said spamming.

# 175 blklightning @ 02/09/11 06:36 AM

from what little footage they showed, it didn't look that impressive. and i didn't like seeing the ea logo on the score board. where is espn? or the nfl channel? they have the licenses, but they don't use them. that's just ridiculous, imo. and surprise onside kicks are cheese, so i'm not interested in that. but the addition of tuner sets is promising.

# 176 johnprestonevans @ 02/09/11 09:09 AM

I can only speak for myself, but I reluctantly have grown weary of the Madden franchise. This is a game that I LOVED deeply on last generation systems. While the gameplay has improved since the atrocious '06 season, when you set Madden down and compare it to other sports games of the day - it just doesn't hold up. I want to see Madden return to Hall of Fame form and that means the game engine, animations, AI and most of all presentation need to take big steps forward. I am underwhelmed by this initial blog that talks about an extremely rare play call and AI tuners that should be in every sports game. I really don't want to be so negative, but I remain heavily guarded based on 1) What I have seen in this year's (early) game footage. and 2) The repeating trend of EA hyping up new features and ultimately fall short of the total package. I do appreciate when the team makes those steps forward in gameplay improvements and broadcast integration (Madden 10 was the biggest step forward this generation), but as we approach the end of this cycle of consoles, we still appear to have a long way to go.

I sincerely hope to see some big things for Madden 12 in the months ahead.

# 177 roadman @ 02/09/11 09:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnprestonevans


	I can only speak for myself, but I reluctantly have grown weary of the Madden franchise. This is a game that I LOVED deeply on last generation systems. While the gameplay has improved since the atrocious '06 season, when you set Madden down and compare it to other sports games of the day - it just doesn't hold up. I want to see Madden return to Hall of Fame form and that means the game engine, animations, AI and most of all presentation need to take big steps forward. I am underwhelmed by this initial blog that talks about an extremely rare play call and AI tuners that should be in every sports game. I really don't want to be so negative, but I remain heavily guarded based on 1) What I have seen in this year's (early) game footage. and 2) The repeating trend of EA hyping up new features and ultimately fall short of the total package. I do appreciate when the team makes those steps forward in gameplay improvements and broadcast integration (Madden 10 was the biggest step forward this generation), but as we approach the end of this cycle of consoles, we still appear to have a long way to go. I sincerely hope to see some big things for Madden 12 in the months ahead.

I don't disagree with much of this except for the tuner sets and the underwhelming part. The tuner sets will be a welcome addition, whether they could have, should have, been in a year or two ago.

Heck, I could have said the blog was underwhelming, but it's exactly what I expected, a few nuggets of information.

Also, I feel that having a former college QB at the top will help out as well.

# 178 RedZoneD25 @ 02/09/11 09:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roadman


	I don't disagree with much of this except for the tuner sets and the underwhelming part. The tuner sets will be a welcome addition, whether they could have, should have, been in a year or two ago. Heck, I could have said the blog was underwhelming, but it's exactly what I expected, a few nuggets of information. Also, I feel that having a former college QB at the top will help out as well.

How do you figure? It was said that the marketing team has a pretty big say on what the main features are and the game itself. The former college QB is a current EA employee, which means he too has to go by what he is told to do.

I don't disagree, I'm just playing devil's advocate. For all I know, he could be the missing piece of the puzzle that drives Madden over the hump. Both EA football games are already offense driven, so hopefully his (former) position doesn't affect the future premise of upcoming editions too much. Madden needs some defensive work.

# 179 Hova57 @ 02/09/11 09:56 AM

I think the tuner sets will be a good addition, NCAA is was a good addition too, but they didn't monkey with the right things , plus I believe there was a built in flaw with the linebackers and corner play. ncaa team werent happy with the level they had with the tuners. So it should be happy for the ncaa team too.

# 180 BostonJay14 @ 02/09/11 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ian_Cummings_EA


	Glad to see some of you guys dug it though...it's obviously extremely early so I'm happy to release one so called "fluff" feature and one important feature.

Which one was the important feature? To me they are both fluff.

1) Tuner: Great, im glad you added something that allows you to correct things on the fly. however, to me this isnt a feature, its just a debug tool for you guys. If you want to put it in, great, but please don't sell it to us as some "feature".

Thats like me painting someones car and leaving the spare paint in the back seat and telling them "hey its a special no feature... if the paint scratches, then i can fix it!"

2) suprise onside kicks: Nice to have, it fits "if its in the game its in the game" but to me, its not even fluff. its like "oh hey thats kinda neat i guess".

to stick with the car analogy, its like getting a new car, then finding like some kind of cool pop out cup holder. its neat, but its not something you should be promoting to sell the car.

For me, id much rather hear about something useful that is going to bring madden back to being a top 3 sports game(up there with NHL '11, MLB the show, and NBA2k11)... I mean even if its gotta be fluff this early, id rather something useful like...

"this year during replays you can press X to skip and it will skip cuts scenes/menus, instead of you having to wait through it only to have 'x' select gameflow, which you turned off in the settings anyways and dont want to use"

or even

"on the fly audibles are back!" even though thats not something new, but having it back would be great.

or best yet

"classic defensive controls!" so instead of having to hit "x" before playmakering a defender into a zone/blitz, i can do it the old PS2 way where i can assign 6 guys before the snap.

Don't take this as a complain... i liked the strides made for madden 2011. it just kind of annoys me when i feel like things arent continuing to go in the right direction. and when i hear stuff like "important feature" and im looking at tuners/suprise onside... that really makes me scratch my head.

If your gonna get back to being a top 3 sports game, you really need to look at what the other games are doing well. sure they all have great presentation and the "little things". but what those 3 games do best are:

- Controls/UI (including stuff like menu navigation and skipping things)
- gameplay (it always comes down to this)

the prettiest most authentic game in the world doesnt mean jack if I hate the controls and dont find the gameplay insanely fun.

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