MLB 11 The Show - Overall Team Rankings

[Dog]

Quote: Originally Posted by jd369

felix hernandex plays for the sucky mariners, not the "juggernaut all mighty" philadelphia phillies! and I guess Im not scared of madson cause I usually only see him when he plays the braves. his 6 something ERA against last year isnt all that imposing.

Trust me, Madson is a great setup guy, and will most likely jump ship and be a good closer for another team when his contract ends. And I don't have the stats in front of me, but I'm pretty sure Hamel's average run support was the same if not lower than Felix's. Not saying he is on the same level as Felix, but he certainly isn't as low as you are saying he is.

[jd369]

Quote: Originally Posted by JNes12

Trust me, Madson is a great setup guy, and will most likely jump ship and be a good closer for another team when his contract ends. And I don't have the stats in front of me, but I'm pretty sure Hamel's average run support was the same if not lower than Felix's. Not saying he is on the same level as Felix, but he certainly isn't as low as you are saying he is.

And I dont think hamels is a scrub, but he is not an ace, he is a slightly above average pitcher, so this whole "4 aces" thing is a crock. I could tag the braves with the same title if I was as dilusional as some of the phils fans that I read posts on, but I know the braves dont have anywhere close to 4 aces. they do have an excellent pitching staff though, so the "4 aces" fans shouldnt expect to run away with the division this year.

[Dog]

Quote: Originally Posted by jd369

And I dont think hamels is a scrub, but he is not an ace, he is a slightly above average pitcher, so this whole "4 aces" thing is a crock. I could tag the braves with the same title if I was as dilusional as some of the phils fans that I read posts on, but I know the braves dont have anywhere close to 4 aces. they do have an excellent pitching staff though, so the "4 aces" fans shouldnt expect to run away with the division this year.

The Phillies top 4 are in the top 22 overall in Pitcher WAR in the entire MLB since 2008.

http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.asp...on1=2008&ind=0

And in the top 14 overall for WHIP since 2008:

http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.asp...on1=2008&ind=0

Looks like 4 aces to me.

[Dogslax41]

Quote: Originally Posted by jd369

And I dont think hamels is a scrub, but he is not an ace, he is a slightly above average pitcher, so this whole "4 aces" thing is a crock. I could tag the braves with the same title if I was as dilusional as some of the phils fans that I read posts on, but I know the braves dont have anywhere close to 4 aces. they do have an excellent pitching staff though, so the "4 aces" fans shouldnt expect to run away with the division this year.

I think Hamels is a bit more than a slightly better than average pitcher. He is not an ace by any stretch but 80% of teams would love to have him as their #2 let alone their #4. I think that Philly fans are going to miss Werth far more than they think they are. Having that right handed power bat hitting just under .300 and right around 100 RBIs protecting left handed Howard and Utley was a big component of their offense.

[etched Chaos]

Quote: Originally Posted by jd369

And I dont think hamels is a scrub, but he is not an ace, he is a slightly above average pitcher, so this whole "4 aces" thing is a crock. I could tag the braves with the same title if I was as dilusional as some of the phils fans that I read posts on, but I know the braves dont have anywhere close to 4 aces. they do have an excellent pitching staff though, so the "4 aces" fans shouldnt expect to run away with the division this year.

Um, what? You do realise that last year Hamels was 7th for WAR for pitchers, not to mention he was top ten for alot of his peripherals. If he was a Brave (thank god he isn't) he'd be your defacto ace and you'd be shouting it from the rooftops.

[jd369]

Quote: Originally Posted by JNes12

The Phillies top 4 are in the top 22 overall in Pitcher WAR in the entire MLB since 2008. http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.asp...on1=2008&ind=0 And in the top 14 overall for WHIP since 2008: http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.asp...on1=2008&ind=0 Looks like 4 aces to me.

That list shows exactly why this WAR "stat" is stupid. It only values how good you are based on who would replace you if you went down. It does nothing to show actual value to the overall game. Wandy Rodriguez has a higher WAR than Chris Carpenter. going by this "stat" would mean that Wandy would be more sought after than Carpenter if both were on the market.

[Dog]

Quote: Originally Posted by jd369

That list shows exactly why this WAR "stat" is stupid. It only values how good you are based on who would replace you if you went down. It does nothing to show actual value to the overall game. Wandy Rodriguez has a higher WAR than Chris Carpenter. going by this "stat" would mean that Wandy would be more sought after than Carpenter if both were on the market.

So what is your defense of the WHIP leaders then?

[jd369]

Quote: Originally Posted by etched Chaos

Um, what? You do realise that last year Hamels was 7th for WAR for pitchers, not to mention he was top ten for alot of his peripherals. If he was a Brave (thank god he isn't) he'd be your defacto ace and you'd be shouting it from the rooftops.

see my above post about WAR, its a useless "stat". Tim hudson is the braves ace, he would be even if hamels was a brave, which I also thank god he is not. hudson last year was more comparable to halladay than he was hamels, the only thing he lacks is he is not a high strikeout pitcher.