8-10 Min Sim Sliders (Addressing Several CPU Issues)

[HOLLIDAY1183]

Note: These should work well post-patch. It seems the one glaring thing about the patch is the Post-up strength issue. Not a huge issue for me personally (I'ma mid-range guy myself) but I addressed it here.

I have been watching these boards and the ones at Operation Sports for some time now, and registered earlier this year. I have to say it was the best thing to see that there are diehard basketball nuts out there like myself and my brothers who take these games just as seriously (though the girlfriend is def NOT as thrilled as I am).
These forums are amazing, and I truly think if 2K (and to a MUCH larger extent EA) would just use these exclusively to guide them, they would have made the best bball game ever years ago. 2K9 though, is as close as any game has ever been to perfect.
With that said, this year’s game seems to have taken a page out of Live’s book with the ease of scoring down low at times, and with defense of certain moves.
I never ever posted before on either forum, because I usually just found info from you terrific diehard game nuts that helped me step my game up. But with the “slider market” as saturated as it is I still couldn’t find a set that gave me what I was looking for. So I’ve been tinkering with them for weeks trynna get the perfect blend, if you will, and I think I’ve found it. I’m definitely one who wants to see in my game the closest representation of the real thing as possible, even if I’m losing (which will happen, OFTEN in this game), and sliders have always been necessary to achieve this.
I wanna note since NBA 2K the first thing I do when I purchase a basketball game (even with Live), is create Settings save file with the game on the highest difficulty (Hall of Fame on 2K, Superstar on Live), so I have never even played on anything lower ever. So I’m not sure what results you’ll get on any other difficulty. Also, these are for peeps who care less about being able to win every game, but rather how close the game plays to the real thing. I’m just happy to contribute (hopefully) something that will help all you other diehard bball nuts with girlfriends who HATE 2K (lol)
I’ll try to explain things as I go here. Please feel free to offer comments/complaints... enjoy!

Gameplay Settings

Difficulty: Hall Of Fame
Quarter Length: 8
Fatique: ON
Injuries: ON
Clutch Factor: ON (The CPU really can't be trusted at all with this ON, but as you'll see below I found a happy medium by reducing the CLUTCH Attribute to 20)
Real Player FT%: ON
Game Speed: 55 (Purely a personal preference. I personally like the game playing at the speed of real life, but again, to find a medium I dropped speed for USER & CPU to get rid of the TURBO effect--still ABSOLUTELY need the 12pt cushion to account for the HOF CPU catch-up cheat on fastbreaks)
Free Throw Difficulty: 50

Hall of Fame is pretty straightforward—VERY HARD. These are meant for 8 min. qtrs, but if you bump the speed to 40-45, you can probably play 9 or 10 mins. Maybe even 11. But work/girlfriend/ESPN doesn’t leave time for longer than 8. Especially girlfriend. I changed my mind on the CLUTCH issue. I do like the idea in theory of the stars turning it on in crunch time, but with CLUTCH too high BS happens to ensure a close game CLUTCH at 20 seems to remedy it for now. Also changed my mind on GAME SPEED; I like it at 55 cuz for me it seems the closest to real life speed, but it's mostly a preference depending on your qtr length more than anything.
For me with this I get solid numbers, Lebron typically will get 23-32 pts, 7-10 rebs, 5-10 assts, while Z will get his 10-16, maybe 8-10 rebs, FG%’s for both teams around 45-50 on avg. The box score looks straight postgame.

NBA Rules All ON

Charging Foul: 75 (Raised from 60 originally, cuz I want to punish people who don't feel midrange game is necessary. I think after a few early charging calls on Kobe, people will realize they should use his excellent mid-range game for once. If Kobe is going to get by his man EVERY SINGLE TIME with that sizeup move, at least make him shoot jumpers like the real Kobe. Right? lol)
Blocking Foul: 40 (if you're in position the call should go to the D)
Reaching Foul: 80 (Just play D, get steals the way they do in the league. Reach and it will be called.
Shooting Foul: 50 (Up from 45, and like several other sliders the reason for this is to punish abusive habits, but to also get a realistic number of fouls across the board, and more FT's, which was a complaint of my original set)
Loose Ball Foul: 100
Intentional Foul: ON

Emphasis is on lending the D a helping hand, rewarding principled D, and also ensuring even cheesers will want to pull up for 15 footers because a fouled out Kobe is of no use even to them, lol. Don't reach, play D. Loose ball fouls are rare even at 100, they’re called when they happen though

Offense HUM/CPU

Close Shot Success: 40/40 (Up from 35, because I want people to use fadeaways and shots off actual moves with success.)
Mid-Range Success: 50/45 (Raised the CPU from 44 to 45; lol I'm getting better on D and actually beating the CPU more--maybe one day they'll get to 50 lol)
3PT Success: 50/45 ( Raised CPU from 44. Anything higher and they'll hit with hands in their face. Most annoying thing EVER to D the CPU up only to have them drain a contested 3 as the shot clock expires)
Layup Success: 46/36 (Raised HUM from 44, and lowered CPU from 42. Trust me, you probably still won't make the ridiculous layups that the CPU will)
Dunk Success: 70/70
Dunks in Traffic: 10/10 (Up from 0. Some people said they weren't even seeing guys like DHoward throw it down in the lane, so this increase is probably necessary)
Screen Success: 30/30 (Lowered from 60. But even at 10 or 0, screened players still go thru this stupid "fight thru screen" prolonged animation, so I wanted to give the D some leeway since that animation is often unavoidable)

Close shots only govern fadeaways and hooks, but down low they should be difficult when contested. Mid-range seems good for user, but the computer will NOT MISS at 50, especially when open. Kobe fine, but it’s a problem when Rondo hits 5 three’s and 18 ft’ers in a row with a hand in his face. Layups in this game govern all shots around the rim that aren’t jumpers or hooks, so this makes them reasonable especially when defended. Again, Duncan will kill you, but no more 17-18 for Bynum.
Most of these sliders I developed them in practice mode playing 5 on 5 full court and also in half court 2-on-2 post players. I put Lebron Kobe, KG, and Iverson all on the same Cavs squad and mixed in some lesser players like Gibson, Pavlovic and Ilgauskas just to make sure things stayed relative to skill set and player type. For example, to find a good balance in the post off/def battle, first I’d take a KG or Duncan and execute against a Gasol, but then I’d flip teams and try the same with a Kendrick Perkins or Alonzo Mourning to see what they’d do with that slider. Or I’d adjust the Layup slider and then take Kobe and repeatedly drive into traffic and do acrobatic layups and shots, and also with the open lane to see if he’d miss any open ones with that slider level. Then take a Vujacic or Gibson and drive him into traffic at that slider level and also without traffic. Most my sliders below underwent this Best vs Avg vs Scrub test to make sure that the best would be defendable but deadly, while lesser players were NEVER playing outside their abilities. I adjusted each slider to the max and then the minimum, one by one, and then played for about 20-30 possessions to see how they affected the game, and how they related to similar sliders, after which I’d tweak them up or down. For example the Contest Shots and Blocks go hand in hand together, and to an extent they are affected by Vertical. So when adjusting Contest Shots I had to adjust Blocks accordingly, you get the idea. This method translated really well into the real game.

[HOLLIDAY1183]

Defense

Steal Success: 25/25 (Down from 35. I wanted more deflections, and some people commented they saw too many steals in the original set)
Help Defense Strength: 100/100

On-ball steals happen too often on default, and it’s unrealistic as I’ve never seen people ripping people like that even in my high school or college career, and hardly ever in the pros. Especially not Bosh ripping CP3. Help defense at the max because you will call for it repeatedly when Kobe starts his drive. Like real life, guys like Kobe and Lebron simply CANNOT be defended one on one. We need to force some strategy here though, so even these guys will have to find a lane late which the D collapsing.

Attributes

Stealing: 30/30 (Down from 45. Wanted to reduce steals, but also get more tipped balls and the sense that on D you'd better just defend instead of camping the lanes)
Blocking: 70/70 (Down from 75. Was seeing a few too many blocks before)
Ball Handling: 44/44
Dunking Ability: 42/42
Offensive Awareness: 40/40
Defensive Awareness: 100/100
Offensive Rebounding: 60/40
Defensive Rebounding: 70/60
Clutch Factor: 20/20 (Clutch is a great concept, but the CPU just can't be trusted with it. 2K has it so that you suddenly just miss everything while the CPU makes everything)
Speed: 31/19 (With the Game Speed at 55, lowered this from 45/35 to reduce the TURBO effect. Plus, a 12pt gap is needed or the CPU will catch you unfairly on HOF)
Strength: 80/40 (This seems to even out the post issue following the patch. I still can't just back down anybody, or back down from the top of the key, but I can move Monta Ellis with Amare now. I actually kinda like what the patch did though--now you have to get it with good position and use a move to get a look. No more just backing in)
Stamina: 48/48 (Down from default. I like when people get tired, and their game is affected. Also, this punishes abusive stuff like camping the lanes, fast breaking all game with one player. Now he'll get tired and be useless)
Durability: 50/50
Vertical: 50/50
Quickness: 45/45
Hustle: 60/60
Hands: 35/20 (Down from 100, lol. I realized that it needs to be reduced to get more deflections and missed passes, which is great to see happen. But also, now you won't see the CPU throwing four oops per game in a half court setting)
On-Ball Defense: 100/100
Injury Severity: 60/60

Blocking is high to offset what I did to the Contest Shots Tendency. Don’t worry, you will not see many if any blocked jumpers from long range (tell me when you see jumpshooters getting blocked from 3 in real life, 2k wtf), but in the lane you need to watch out, maybe even alter your shot sometimes. Again, a Dwight Howard will likely send your !%#, but lesser shotblockers will still be scored on due to the Contest Shots rating which ties directly into blocking. Dunking ability toned just enough to allow Kobe to dunk when he has the proper step/angle, but Pavlovic will never dunk in traffic. Def Awareness needs to be maxed to stop the backdoor BS and heavily defended alleys. This ties into Off Awareness. Speed is a BIG ISSUE on HOF, but 31/19 is perfect so that on a fast break the CPU will create some separation and you won’t catch them unfairly, but if you’re ahead THEY WONT EITHER. So annoying, but this makes it even and eliminates it. I should note that even with this the speed of the player matters. For example I’ve been caught by Tony Parker on a break with Ben Wallace. It just eliminates the “HOF superspeed” of the CPU.
Also, on rebounds you need to have a thirty-point spread between your DEF Rebounds and the CPU’s OFF Rebounds, JUST TO MAKE IT FAIR. Otherwise the computer will grab countless Offensive boards, another one of 2K’s “HOF Difficulty” cheats. On-Ball D is great maxed out because you can actually bother a superstar if you shade him to the help and get bodies in his way, but they still can get around you. Yet, a Gibson will NEVER blow by you into the lane, and if he does, good luck for him getting a good look with the Blocks/Contest Shots at this balance. Quickness lowered to give more margin for error w/on-ball D. With Play Passing Lanes maxed, the CPU(and you) will be forced to play ball as if you’re out there yourself--you will rarely pass thru people, or complete passes than defy the defenders common sense to knock it down or steal it. Forces strategy and realism. I’ve seen instances, with myself or the CPU, where the shot clock is down to 5 and there’s no angle to find someone and you just have to throw something up rather than turn it over by forcing a pass. Beautiful. Ballhandling tweak tied into quickness to slow down the spin and make it more defendable. Injury severity at 60 cuz if I injury someone I want to see some real injuries besides ones where they always return to the game. Still haven’t seen one yet. You can leave that default though. The ones I left at 50 I left them cuz I feel like I found a balance w/o adjusting them.

Tendencies

Take Close Shots: 50/0 (CPU down from 15. They still largely ignore this slider though)
Take Mid-Range Shots: 50/100
Take 3PT Shots: 50/55 (I played with this a bit. Against the Celts, Rondo refused to take a 3 regardless how much space I gave him, but Nash pulled it immediately)
Attack The Basket: 50/20 (Lowered the CPU from 45, just so they'll run their sets more and shoot more J's)
Finish Strong Inside: 45/45
Look for Post Players: 50/75 (Raised the CPU from 20. As some suggested, this helps get the CPU to swing it around more, and use fadeaways, and just get their post players more involved)
Use Triple Threat: 50/10 (I lowered the CPU from 65, just because they seemed to be holding it too long just pivoting. With it low they'll move the ball more, and their offense flows more)
Use Fadeaways: 50/65
Use Hookshots: 0/0
Attempt Putbacks: 50/50
Throw Flashy Passes: 0/0 (Lowered from 30 for HUM and CPU. I HATE when I see a man open under the rim, and my supposedly good ballhandler attempts a behind-the-back bounce pass which is stolen. Even at 0 they'll still try fancy ish once in a while)
Commit Fouls: 45/45 (Up from 40 just to increase fouls in general)
Play Passing Lanes: 100/100
Go for On-Ball Steals: 5/5
Contest Shots: 10/10 (Lowered from 25 for HUM and CPU. Basically I shot jumpers in practice with Lebron and Kobe, while lowering this one by one. Every time someone like J.J. Redick was able to block them, regardless of their timing or position, I lowered it. At 10, you will NOT SEE Kobe being blocked from 18. EVER. Like real life. But in the paint, where the majority of blocks occur, bigs and shotblockers will bother shots and block them when they should. Also, people will not be able to jump 8 feet to pressure a shooter. If you're caught doubling and don't get back fast enough, the shooter will have an open 3. Like real life. Helps with the spacing. Just a matter of annoying things I was determined to eliminate. Seeing Redick block Kobe and KG is just unacceptable.
Use Sizeup Moves: 50/100 (Increased the CPU from 55 just so they'll do more to create space for jumpers and involve stars who have the great moves more. It does allow for the ridiculous idle Globetrotter-esque stuff, but I'm willing to live with that for the greater good.

The tendencies here are the most important, cuz they tie into certain ratings, and also they force the CPU to start playing like a fallible human being. Most HUM tendencies are obviously at default just because you have your own tendencies when you play. But some, like Finish Strong Inside and Contest Shots, aren’t a matter of personal play style, but what your player does when you press a button. With Mid-Range maxed, the CPU will take what you give them, but also will shoot off screens, shoot over you, or even pull up on you sometimes. Take 3PT Shots at 55 so the CPU will take it when they have it, but won’t just chuck 3’s, especially with the Mid-Range so high. I found that it seems to matter how much separation there is between tendencies, for example if I had Mid-Range at 75 the computer would sometimes prefer the 3 or keep going inside. With this though, they’ll look inside still, but with the Passing Lanes, Blocking, and Defensive Awareness so high, they’re reluctant to risk the backdoor cheat, and reluctant to just attack the rim with reckless abandon, so it seems they start trying to just get an honest bucket through the offense, or going to work on you with superstars. On-Ball steals are not pulled off too often, and with the Steal Success Slider so low, these will result in fouls not steals, so pretty much steals will happen most often the way they do in real life, off errant passes. Hooks at 0 becuz, when’s the last time you saw an NBA player do one? lol. Use Sizeup Moves raised so the CPU will try to create space and sometimes pull up on you. Fadeaways at 65 so they will actually use it once in a while. Contest Shots as I said ties into Blocks, but its lowered so that people aren’t blocking 3’s, which NEVER happens in real life. But in the lane, where it’s generally more congested with defenders, there’s more of a chance that someone will get a hand on it, even before the shot and knock it away. Blocks have to be at least 70 though, cuz for some reason I’ve seen balls going thru defenders hands that shoulda been blocks.

There ya’ll go, my contribution to this amazing community. I hope these sliders help you get things looking as good as what I’m seeing here. Still in my season with the Cavs, got seeded 1st with a 42-16 record (Lebron got the MVP 23-7-6 & 2 on the season), and am now in the Finals versus the Lakers after a grueling Conf. Finals against the Celts. Wish me luck I will need it against Kobe lol.
Keep in mind I only have experience with HOF level and my quarters are 8 or 9 minutes. You can probably play more or less and get realistic stats by slightly adjusting Game Speed though. These have wiped out the backdoor BS, the unfair Off Rebs, the high FG%, the constant CPU PIP, and the “Big Z catching Tony Parker on the break” issue, and makes the CPU generally play a more realistic game (even using the mid-range sometimes). Doesn’t make this extremely difficult game much easier, but at least now when Kobe lights you up for 40 you feel like he did it honestly.

Any comments please feel free! I think with the patch and these tweaks we are almost there!

[jrose57]

all i need to know about this slider is, does it solve the cpu's pip issue, if yes, this set is mine, becuase i tried everything here, there are lots of good things ppl did here, but none can solve the problem of pip, it should only be around 1/3 for both user n cpu, not 2/3!

[HOLLIDAY1183]

The PIP issue has all but vanished for me. Try it and see.
But even if they're still going to the paint too much, there's room to adjust the close shots and look for post even lower.
I just was too afraid if I dropped it to 0 or 5 that they wouldn't ever look for someone like Duncan or Shaq. Actually I'm playing the Suns in practice right now and Nash is jackin 3's a bit. Soon as he has space he's tossing it up. But they're going to Shaq too, and Nash even pulled up for a few midrange J's just now. May have to bring the 3PT tendency down, maybe to like 45

[pbz06]

thank you for your efforts, i will most definately check them out. I've been trying many sliders and each one seems to be a million times better than default, but at the same time they each seem to have one glaring issue that kills it for me, or some work only with certain rosters/profiles/tweaks etc. some are just for xbox, others are for PS3 but different rosters....it's just confusing putting the pieces together to make everything work in uniform.

I'll try these out on Pro and All-star too, since i get the feeling i will get murdered on HOF.

Anyway, I have roster edits and coach profiles (from nogster/razr on PS3)....do you think those will still work well? I really like his roster edits a lot more than the 2k versions

[pbz06]

p.s.- any reason why you put the "real free throw" to "off"? isn't it better to vary depending on the player's rating? just curious

[mvpdirk]

Holliday,
These sliders look great! You certainly seem to have put a lot of work into getting them just right. Like you I have read these forums and the ones on the 2K site and have tried a lot of remedies to the deficiencies of the game right out of the box. I am by no means a great player of this game, but I do love it and want the most realistic sim I can get. For this reason, I am wondering what you think these sliders will do on All-Star. Which elements do you think would need tweaking from your sliders to make more sense one level down?
Other than that, I will be trying these as soon as I get offline.

Cheers.

[HOLLIDAY1183]

Hey you're welcome! Yeah that was the main issue for me too, there was always something that still was glaring, so I set out to try and figure out a good set for me personally. I'm on 360 and never tried any roster or coaching edits, but maybe someone can try them with these and see. I've noticed some ridiculous ratings (my boy killed me with the Brent Barry of the Rockets, turns out 2K thought he should have a 98 3PT rating, WTF)

And yeah, you can def try them on All-Star or Pro, I think the main stupid thing with HOF that may not be an issue on lower difficulties are the cheats like the CPU being simply WAY faster than you, makes shots you can't make, and grabs every off. reb. I tried with these to counter those. And yeah, I still get murdered by every good team, lol

Oh, the FT thing is a good point, I may edit this and start playing with it on Real FT% for the reason you named, and plus the inexplicable frame drops that cause misses. Yeah, I'm gon change that and start playing like that, thanks