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What NBA 2K Needs to Do to Step Up Its Online Game

Looking Back -- What NBA 2K needs to do to step up its online game, Part One Of Two: Why I'm Keeping Pest Control on Speed Dial

I love basketball, and perhaps just as much, I love a good, competitive online game; in fact, when it comes to sports games, the online mode is about the only part that I spend my time with these days.

That’s why my body forced me to vomit up the stinky, moldy cheese that Visual Concepts tried to feed me when it came to NBA 2K8 ranked online games: as an online experience, it was neither good nor competitive –- at least, not in the "fair" sense of the word –- and while I came in expecting sustenance, I left with a bad case of food poisoning.

To be honest, I probably would have never noticed these issues had I just stuck to playing OSers and the A.I., but I just had to go and play random people in ranked matches.

Visual Concepts' most recent entry (until tomorrow), NBA 2K8, was particularly discouraging, in that, the series was beginning to show symptoms of a serious pest-control problem, making the game more or less unplayable for those of us who just wanted to hop into a lobby and play a "real" game of basketball without being bothered by the tireless squeaking of rodents.

Rattus Norvegicus, colloquially refereed to as “lobby rat.”
But when developers choose to leave that same cheese sitting out in the open, year after year, your company has no one to blame but itself for not only letting all the rats in, but also, creating an environment in which those rats can thrive.

Perhaps, then, it’s a bit of poetic justice that those rats are the ones who, with the growing popularity of Visual Concepts' flagship series and of online play in general, have ripped 2K's online play to shreds, clawed out its eyes, feasted on its flesh, and left behind a bloody, skeletal mess, barely recognizable as belonging to the genus of online hoops. Did I go too far with that image?

WARNING!

The videos you are about to see contain graphic, disturbing images of exploitation and sadistic torture.

Any resemblance to the National Basketball Association or the sport of basketball as founded by James A. Naismith is purely coincidental:


The Holy Trinity of Cheese:



Exhibit A) The Running Dunk Through Traffic


NBA 2K8 online: too much like Mike


Note to Visual Concepts: this is the NBA, not an AND 1 tour, or a Nike commercial.

And in the NBA, dunks like the exploit in the above video are exceedingly rare (I see two or three a year, max), not a source of easy points every time down the court online.

Exhibit B) Lead pass + Standing Dunk


Warmups, a.k.a., about the only time you’ll ever see a standing dunk attempted during an organized basketball game.


"Lead passing" – it certainly sounds like something that belongs in a basketball simulation. But that’s before you step onto one of 2K’s poorly spaced courts, and realize that “lead passing” is ridiculously difficult to defend against online.

As if your opponent being able to “lead pass” his way through traffic wasn’t bad enough, when you couple lead passing with the unblockable “standing dunk,” the feature goes from being moderately annoying to the key ingredient in an unstoppable, game-breaking money play.

Exhibit C) Constant Pressing and Double-Teaming

Apparently, the NBA 2K online fraternity only accepts graduates from the Rick Pitino School of Coaching:

 


Because Pitino wills it: full-court pressure on every possession, with double-teams coming constantly, one after another.

Considering how coach Pitino's playing style –- and thus, his professional coaching career –- completely self-destructed in the “real” NBA, I think it's no stretch to say that these kind of tactics have no place in a game that aims to emulate the NBA experience.

This is not to say that users shouldn't be able to choose from these defensive options, only, that they should be properly penalized for doing so, just like Pitino's Celtic teams were, accumulating 102 wins and 146 losses from 1997 to 2001.

Those losses came in part because Pitino’s brand of pressure defense gives up fast breaks, wide-open shots, and uncontested layups to teams who can find and hit the open man, which full-court pressure and double-teams naturally generate.

Note that when I say, "teams who can find and hit the open man…" this encompasses virtually every team in the NBA.

You see, Pitino's defensive system failed in part because NBA players can tear pressure defenses apart with a degree of speed, court vision, and passing skills that few college teams possess.

NBA 2K fails to live up to its end of the "simulation" bargain online, because it makes every NBA team handle full-court and double-team pressure like a bunch of high school underclassmen. Let's list the issues that occur in these aggravating online situations.
  • Players run away from trapped teammates instead of running towards them.
  • Ball-handlers get "sucked into" double-team animations and are unable to do much of anything while in the animation.
  • Passes in general are slow and floaty when they should be sharp and crisp in the backcourt.
  • On the few occasions where the pass actually makes it into the breadbasket of an open teammate, that teammate often stands there and lets the ball bounce off him like a bullet off the chest of The Incredible Hulk.
  • Throwing long-intermediate passes is akin to playing a game of Russian roulette with a revolver full of turnovers.


These idiosyncrasies delight cheesers everywhere because they realize they can still cuddle with their copies of Success is a Choice and proudly salute the Double Team poster hanging from their parents' wall.

If you have one of these somewhere in your house, consider yourself an enemy of the people.


Even if Visual Concepts can fix all those pressure-related gameplay issues, there is still one other major factor that, after nine years of 2K basketball games, needs to be accounted for: Teams who play a “high-pressure” style of defense need to fatigue at a much faster rate than teams who are playing more "relaxed" styles of defense.

Going back to my "real world" example, part of what made Rick Pitino’s pressure defense so effective at the University of Kentucky was the fact that his teams would use at least a 12-man rotation to wear out the other team's seven- or eight-man rotation over the course of the game.

And yet, in NBA 2K, you don't even need a rotation online at all! I mean, why bother to take out your star players when they never get tired enough to warrant a substitution? Especially when a simple timeout or the end of a quarter/half will have those star players coming out of the huddle feeling just as fresh as they were in the first minutes of the first quarter.

But there is more afoul in the game’s online fatigue system than its failure to account for various styles of defense. There is also the issue of individual effort, specifically, how hard gamers choose to push the players who are under their control.

Even though the NBA is a much more deliberate game than what you will find on the average collegiate basketball court, most NBA 2K gamers push their players like virtual Bob Knights, making the players they control go all-out, playing at full-speed for virtually every second of the game.

The NBA 2K series continues to allow these speed freaks to run their players ragged online, and if NBA 2K wishes to better-simulate the sport of pro basketball, it must penalize these lead-fingered felons, and force them to exercise a modicum of restraint.

Sadly, sprinting, pressing, and double-teaming are but the tip of the iceberg when it comes to "things that should -- but don’t -- tire out NBA 2K players online.

In addition, there are actions like the repeated use of isolation dribbling, long three point shots, fancy dunks, jumping around like a team of jack-rabbits on defense, taking a lot of contact in the paint, etc., all of which should come with some kind of fatigue penalty, but do not.

But, if it is too much work for the developers to go through the game and program new fatigue values for all of the above actions, why not just incorporate the type of "turbo bar" that games like NBA Jam, NBA Hangtime, NBA Street, et al. have used to keep people from going overboard with the turbo, dunks, and special moves?

Why not give us a bar that partially depletes any time an "aggressive" move is triggered, then have the amount of "bar" that’s available impact the type/amount of "aggressive" moves that a player can do?

For example, if a player is expending all his effort on defense (example: Paul Pierce guarding Kobe Bryant in last year’s NBA Finals), it should make that player less effective on offense, such that he has a significantly limited ability to use "aggressive" moves while he's recovering energy on the offensive end of the court.

The opposite scenario could apply for someone like Kobe Bryant, who might -- as he was in those same NBA Finals -- be expending all his effort on offense, forcing him to play way off his man on defense so he could conserve "energy" by playing a kind of sagging, roaming help-defense.


But with that in mind, this is where part one of the journey ends. Join me Tuesday for part two, as we look forward to some of the new features that may enhance the online experience in NBA 2K9.


NBA 2K9 Videos
Member Comments
# 61 PaulZweber @ 10/07/08 05:39 PM
Great Example DaVe! People like that will never see it our way, and therefor will never play the game it was meant to be played. This is a game, it is meant to be fun. You don't have to win every time, and in fact, I would rather lose a close game than win a blowout, it makes for a much more entertaining and dramatic game. I do not want to score 50 a game with someone just because it can be done, or because I will win a VIDEO GAME. Bottom line, it's a game, winning isn't everything. Mature gamers realize this, and hopefully the younger ones eventually will.
 
# 62 LETS BALL @ 10/07/08 07:00 PM
stop playing those weak lobby games and join a real league..og i forgot most people dont know how to play real sim********
 
# 63 Defense Wins Games @ 10/07/08 08:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by -DaVe-




^So that's the kind of double team exploit you want me to pull?
When you face crap like that you don't feel like you're being cheated?

And lol@ you getting so angry about this thread.
So easily avoidable. You can see him planning to do that a mile away. That's not really an exploit. And anyone that falls for it deserves to lose.
 
# 64 Defense Wins Games @ 10/07/08 08:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sum1
Yes, it is about winning. But it's also about playing the game the right way. Not about giving the ball to Kobe and running back and forth (like a ******) and bumping into defenders until the dunk animation kicks in.

Hope I never ever come across you online. You have no idea how to play the game the way it should be played.
"Playing the game the right way" is a cliche you're misunderstanding. People always utter those words because usually it does lead to winning. So really in essence, playing the game the right way means playing to win. Who are you to say what's right and what's wrong? A person purchases the game to play it however he wishes.
 
# 65 Defense Wins Games @ 10/07/08 08:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sum1
You understand why some people do that because you are a fellow exploit abuser. Do you think that in a real game, when a FT could determine the game, that someone can just push a pause button and the person will miss? No, you leave it up to how much arc the person puts on their shot, whether or not the ball doesn't slip out of their hands, etc. So many things can go into a real game FT being made or not.

Not that I would expect you to understand that. You think the double team exploit is a legit defense.
Nope. How the hell do you know how I play? Double teaming is part of the game. If you can't fight through it, settle for an easier game like NBA Live. That's the game for amateurs like yourself. Tired of you pansies that whine about every little thing. Nothing is unstoppable. Just because you can't stop it doesn't mean it's unstoppable. It just means you either don't try hard enough or you just suck. Period. End of discussion. Return the game.
 
# 66 Defense Wins Games @ 10/07/08 08:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulZweber
Great Example DaVe! People like that will never see it our way, and therefor will never play the game it was meant to be played. This is a game, it is meant to be fun. You don't have to win every time, and in fact, I would rather lose a close game than win a blowout, it makes for a much more entertaining and dramatic game. I do not want to score 50 a game with someone just because it can be done, or because I will win a VIDEO GAME. Bottom line, it's a game, winning isn't everything. Mature gamers realize this, and hopefully the younger ones eventually will.
You couldn't even score 50 a game on me with an entire team much less one player. From all your complaining, I can tell you're one of those whining 15-17 year olds that thinks he's among the "older" crowd. Why the hell do you play a ranked competitive game if not to win? If you want to play for fun, you play offline or you play an unranked game. You don't get it. Some people are weak and soft. They can't rough it up with the best. You're one of these people. Your mind is so weak you can't bring your game up to our level. Just physically impossible. So you just whine and whine and whine hoping the developers will hear you and cater to your every whim. If you don't want your opponent to score with one player then send all 5 damn players at him. Double team him. Let someone else score. See you're playing 5-on-5 defense and you expect your opponent not to utilize his best player when he's only being guarded 1-on-1? If LeBron received 1-on-1 coverage all game in real life, he'd probably average 50 a game.

60 bucks says none of you even read my whole post. Because I've said numerous things over and over again that you "Sim" players still haven't responded to or acknowledged.
 
# 67 PaulZweber @ 10/08/08 10:33 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Defense Wins Games
How do you know how I play? You have never seen me play. I use strategies that I know my opponent will have difficulty stopping. I use different strategies depending on the team I play against and the person I play against. THAT's SPORTS. You use all the tools available to you in the game. If you want to blame someone, blame the developers. It's not like I'm using some sort of 3rd party hack to get an upper hand. You have every tool I have. If you want to stop the dunks, GUARD THE FCKN PAINT. See all you people do is whine because you want to play how you see it on TV. Well that will never happen. If the defense allowed LeBron to dunk on every play, he would in real life. And that's what I do in the game. Until you shut down the drive (which you can do, believe it or not, but you probably don't cause you suck), I'm gonna keep driving. If you can clog the driving lanes or send double teams, I'm gonna have to adjust my game plan and start raining 3's. You're one of those slow-thinkers that can't stand a fast-paced game. Gives you headaches because you have slow reflexes and you think slowly and narrowly. You don't know how to work around things. You don't know how to analyze a problem and find a solution. You think basketball is just the basketball you see. There's X's and O's behind the scenes you don't know about. Check Bowen out. In real life, if the ref doesn't call flagrants or techs on the antics he does, he's gonna keep doing them. Look at Shaq. He threw those elbows at the defender for years and got a dunk every time. Until the refs started cracking down on it. And now it's an offensive foul. Look at the flopping. I've seen Ginobili run behind Garnett and intentionally fall down. And the foul was called on Garnett and he wasn't even moving. See, in real life, people do what they can to win. Even the best of them, Jordan pushed off Russell to get free for his final shot as a Bull. Kobe would elbow his defender after he shoots the ball until he got suspended for it.

I play AND watch basketball. People will do all kinds of things to win. Those are things a game can't capture. So they leave things a little more loose. See people like you want a slow-down game because you can't keep up with a fast paced game. You're both too stupid and just physically incapable of keeping up with the best.
You tell us how you play, you tell us you use exploits and do whatever it takes to win. Ever heard of sportsmanship? Nope, didn't think so. Ever hear of playing a video game for fun? Nope, didn't think so. You can't stop dunks by planting someone in the paint, it doesn't work that way. If the D allowed Lebron to dunk every time, he wouldn't. He would get bored and want a challenge, like all great competitors. Why do you think he worked on his jumper so much? So he isn't another ONE DIMENSIONSAL PLAYER. I can't stand a fast pace game, now you know me and how I play? I love to use a fast pace team against my roomates, when we specify a cheese game. I have slow reflexes? Ok dude. To say that there is Xs and Os behind the scenes I don't know about is laughable. Dude, I played basketball my whole life(24 years-AAU, High School, College), I refereed for 3 years, and I have been coaching the last 4, and I don't know the Xs and Os? Honestly, I think you need to go back to school, because if you don't know the difference between mental and physical then you got a tough road ahead of you in life. You have proven your (lack of) intelligence over and over, leave it be.
 
# 68 PaulZweber @ 10/08/08 10:34 AM
By the way, offense wins games, defense wins championships.
 
# 69 PaulZweber @ 10/08/08 01:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by A real gamer
That's what's up paul lol. when i graduate i will be coaching too and btw how u like coaching?
Coaching is the most rewarding thing I can do. I am able to mold players into young men, and seeing how our town has a drug problem at the high school, it keeps them from doing that. You have to play mental games to get the kids to do what you want them to, and to get them to do what they want to do. Motivating people is hard work sometimes, especially with a stuborn kid who's parents are telling him he is the best, and he doesn't feel like he should play defense. It is a HUGE amount of time, travel, and sweat involved, but it is a lot of fun.
 
# 70 unseen03 @ 10/20/08 08:54 PM
i would like to comment that if you know how to play d game its actually easy to deal with your problems, i mean not just playing the game virtually , like playin the actual sport for you to counter react to what the other team, there are people who are cheesing, but come to think of it, there are ******* coach in the game of basketball..... but there are quite a few stuff 2k needs to fix and they should do that soon
 


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