NCAA Designers Step Up to the Plate

Feature Article

Submitted on: 07/21/2008 by Erik Westfall

In a growing trend around the internet, a number of video game developers and designers are making their presences known on various community forums. EA Sports has done this for a number of years, most notably through Ian Cummings and more recently Phil Frazier. Well we have a newcomer to the arena - Adam Thompson (OMT on the OS forums).

Thompson is one of the designers of the NCAA Football series. In light of Ian’s success at both the Operation Sports and MaddenMania forums, the folks at EA Sports decided to have Thompson fill those shoes for the NCAA franchise.

http://www.operationsports.com/forum...-q-thread.html

With the release of NCAA Football 09 having been only days past, Thompson has already faced a barrage of excited fans as well as disappointed ones. His question and answer thread in OS’s NCAA Football forum alone has over 2,000 replies since its beginning back on June 3.

Most of the questions have centered on a glitch in the ability to name rosters and the game freezing or crashing upon changing names in the rosters. Of course being a designer working on graphics, it’s hard for him to respond to these questions, but he has done a good job thus far keeping up with the barrage of questions on the subject.

Thompson has even brought a sense of humor to his responses – something rarely seen when somebody is officially representing their company. Thompson’s response to one forum member’s question about whether the addition of a new team to the database, such as Western Kentucky, could have caused the glitch was one such display.

http://www.operationsports.com/forum...post2038500103

“That is my hypothesis,” said Thompson. “Western Kentucky broke the game.”

Of course he’s not making light of the game. In fact most of his responses have been quite helpful and insightful.

http://www.operationsports.com/forum...post2038499912

“Actually,” said Thompson, “we have an automation tester who writes scripts for the game to do repetitive tests like [inputting massive quantities of names into the rosters]. I asked him to write a script for [NCAA Football] 2010 that will name every player on every team so this issue will get caught next time. That's one of the things about testing video games. Every year you learn of a new test that you should have done, and from then on it is tested.”

In fact, he went so far as to address the process of patching a sports game.

http://www.operationsports.com/forum...post2038498338

“The process is just like a game cycle but compressed,” said Thompson. “We have a list of things to patch, figure out when the patch should come out (if there are very serious bugs, we make it come out sooner). Based on when we want it done, we figure out how long everything will take and cut stuff accordingly to be able to schedule it out and get done in time.”

Despite this being his first foray into the Operation Sports forums, Mr. Thompson is holding his own and not cracking under the pressure. Sure there are of course questions he won’t be able to answer, but by and large he’s made a concerted effort to answer as many questions as possible in a way that will help those in need.

NCAA Football 09 Videos

Member Comments

# 61 Ralnakor @ 07/22/08 06:51 PM

I'm reading all this negative feedback, claiming we're kissing EA's *** and really wondering about certain things. The first and foremost statement I must point out is that nowhere in this article was it said that I thought the game was great. My thoughts on the game itself are completely separate of this article to the point that I still have yet to weigh in on the issue.

Beyond that, a simple reading of the article shows I never said the patching of the game and the like have been great. To those who argue I felt we should be happy Adam is posting on the boards, we really should be. They don't have to take the time to respond to us. Regardless of what many would argue EA's motives may be behind their presence on the OS forums, they are still doing more than they have to.

Objectivity doesn't necessarily mean agreeing with a certain opinion. Sure, some of you may think he's done a horrible job, and some would say he's done a flawless job. I merely proposed that my personal opinion is that he's done a good job staying active and at least making an attempt to respond to criticisms about bugs in the game.

Given how much people could do little more than rip on him for what you may or may not think is the best game EA Sports could have released, he has in fact not given in to complaints and hasn't merely written off the fans of the game as not worth his time.

No matter whether you agree or disagree with the quality of the game and the reviews we've posted on the site, we mustn't forget that Adam doesn't still have to be here.

# 62 countryboy @ 07/22/08 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ralnakor


	I'm reading all this negative feedback, claiming we're kissing EA's *** and really wondering about certain things. The first and foremost statement I must point out is that nowhere in this article was it said that I thought the game was great. My thoughts on the game itself are completely separate of this article to the point that I still have yet to weigh in on the issue. Beyond that, a simple reading of the article shows I never said the patching of the game and the like have been great. To those who argue I felt we should be happy Adam is posting on the boards, we really should be. They don't have to take the time to respond to us. Regardless of what many would argue EA's motives may be behind their presence on the OS forums, they are still doing more than they have to. Objectivity doesn't necessarily mean agreeing with a certain opinion. Sure, some of you may think he's done a horrible job, and some would say he's done a flawless job. I merely proposed that my personal opinion is that he's done a good job staying active and at least making an attempt to respond to criticisms about bugs in the game. Given how much people could do little more than rip on him for what you may or may not think is the best game EA Sports could have released, he has in fact not given in to complaints and hasn't merely written off the fans of the game as not worth his time. No matter whether you agree or disagree with the quality of the game and the reviews we've posted on the site, we mustn't forget that Adam doesn't still have to be here.

Excellent, excellent post.

# 63 malek05 @ 07/23/08 12:44 AM

Anybody remember this?

http://sports.espn.go.com/videogames...ory?id=3028549

On second thought, i think i will wait about a week before i download the patch (if they ever release it). I already have to worry about random RROD everytime i turn my 360 on...

I remember my friend complaining about this. He called me up like "Man, I just dl this patch for madden and now the game won't even boot."

Bonus points for no one EVER finding out what that update did...

5 stars for this powerful post...
*****

# 64 malek05 @ 07/23/08 01:01 AM

Actually, out of the three ncaa forums i visit, this is easily the one that kisses the EA dev's *** the most... Not even close

At ncaa strategies,for example, if someone says something negative about ea or the dev's...nobody really cares. A few people might pile on...but nobody really steps in and says "that is not being constructive, that is not being conducive, these guys work hard and deserve a break". Because nothing they say is a lie... And eventually, people just stop talking about it, and the thread gets back on course. Don't really even see to many EA sucks threads over there. I think people post them here just because they know it will get a reaction out of someone. This is the only place that I see the dev's keep posting at...I wonder why?

At any rate, all threads here crash and burn into the same thing...

1. Guy 1 says "Oh my god this is fubared. EA is dumb...blah blah blah...

2. Guy 2 says "It may be broken but it is still fun...blah blah blah

3. Guy 1 says "What do you mean it is fun? How can it be fun AND broken?"

4. Guy 2 panics here and doesn't know what to do. Begins to talk about how guy 1 is being disrespectful and doesn't understand how hard it is to make a game.

5. Guy 1 could give a flying **** about what it takes to make a game. He sites other sim games that come out every year (fifa, nhl, nba2k) that are just fine, so why not ncaa?

6. Guy 4, 5, 6, jump in to defend guy 1

7. Guy, 7,8, 9, jump in to defend guy 2

8. As some point one of the dev's says something completey pointless. Like, if 12 people post about how the cpu makes 50 yard field goals with ease, a dev will pop up and say "I just had the cpu miss a 40 yarder against me last night." Everybody thinks...wtf...but doesn't say anything.

9. Rinse and repeat for 20 pages...and the thread is locked.

The games got some major issues...they need patching...by a company...who released a patch that made the game literally not boot...the DEV guys are just giving you spin...people need to stop complaining because it is not going to spur EA to move any faster...people need to stop defending EA because they released a game that is broken everywhere...realism...sliders...rosters...online dynasty...that pretty much covers the entire game...

Get over it...this isn't the first time EA duped you out of 60 bucks (NCAA 07 anyone?) and it won't be the last time they dupe you out of 60 bucks (Madden 09 anyone?)

Five stars for this powerful post
*****

# 65 GoVols1985 @ 07/23/08 01:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by malek05


	Actually, out of the three ncaa forums i visit, this is easily the one that kisses the EA dev's * the most... Not even close At ncaa strategies,for example, if someone says something negative about ea or the dev's...nobody really cares. A few people might pile on...but nobody really steps in and says "that is not being constructive, that is not being conducive, these guys work hard and deserve a break". Because nothing they say is a lie... And eventually, people just stop talking about it, and the thread gets back on course. Don't really even see to many EA sucks threads over there. I think people post them here just because they know it will get a reaction out of someone. This is the only place that I see the dev's keep posting at...I wonder why? At any rate, all threads here crash and burn into the same thing... 1. Guy 1 says "Oh my god this is fubared. EA is dumb...blah blah blah... 2. Guy 2 says "It may be broken but it is still fun...blah blah blah 3. Guy 1 says "What do you mean it is fun? How can it be fun AND broken?" 4. Guy 2 panics here and doesn't know what to do. Begins to talk about how guy 1 is being disrespectful and doesn't understand how hard it is to make a game. 5. Guy 1 could give a flying about what it takes to make a game. He sites other sim games that come out every year (fifa, nhl, nba2k) that are just fine, so why not ncaa? 6. Guy 4, 5, 6, jump in to defend guy 1 7. Guy, 7,8, 9, jump in to defend guy 2 8. As some point one of the dev's says something completey pointless. Like, if 12 people post about how the cpu makes 50 yard field goals with ease, a dev will pop up and say "I just had the cpu miss a 40 yarder against me last night." Everybody thinks...wtf...but doesn't say anything. 9. Rinse and repeat for 20 pages...and the thread is locked. The games got some major issues...they need patching...by a company...who released a patch that made the game literally not boot...the DEV guys are just giving you spin...people need to stop complaining because it is not going to spur EA to move any faster...people need to stop defending EA because they released a game that is broken everywhere...realism...sliders...rosters...online dynasty...that pretty much covers the entire game... Get over it...this isn't the first time EA duped you out of 60 bucks (NCAA 07 anyone?) and it won't be the last time they dupe you out of 60 bucks (Madden 09 anyone?) Five stars for this powerful post ***

man, it must've taken you forever to write that. I've written term papers that weren't that long lol, but you really did hit the nail on the head. That's pretty much how the pattern seems to work around here. I'm guilty of falling into it a time or two myself.

# 66 Security Device @ 07/23/08 06:24 PM

You people are funny. I'm just waiting patiently for the patch and in the meantime enjoying the parts of the game that do work properly. I'm in no hurry. I have a life outside of video games, so I can find other things to occupy my time. But when this patch does drop, lookout, I'm gonna tear it up.

# 67 fistofrage @ 07/23/08 06:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ralnakor


	I'm reading all this negative feedback, claiming we're kissing EA's *** and really wondering about certain things. The first and foremost statement I must point out is that nowhere in this article was it said that I thought the game was great. My thoughts on the game itself are completely separate of this article to the point that I still have yet to weigh in on the issue. Beyond that, a simple reading of the article shows I never said the patching of the game and the like have been great. To those who argue I felt we should be happy Adam is posting on the boards, we really should be. They don't have to take the time to respond to us. Regardless of what many would argue EA's motives may be behind their presence on the OS forums, they are still doing more than they have to. Objectivity doesn't necessarily mean agreeing with a certain opinion. Sure, some of you may think he's done a horrible job, and some would say he's done a flawless job. I merely proposed that my personal opinion is that he's done a good job staying active and at least making an attempt to respond to criticisms about bugs in the game. Given how much people could do little more than rip on him for what you may or may not think is the best game EA Sports could have released, he has in fact not given in to complaints and hasn't merely written off the fans of the game as not worth his time. No matter whether you agree or disagree with the quality of the game and the reviews we've posted on the site, we mustn't forget that Adam doesn't still have to be here.

Once again, he is getting free market research, free game testing and building "good will" by being in here. There could be alot of motives why he's here. But the main reason would be to promote future sales of the game. For all I know tthe brass at EA could be telling him to pander to the sports websites.

If a salesman sold you a lemon of a car which you couldn't get your money back for then the company that manufactured had a representative call you, wouldn't you give him a piece of your mind.

If a representative didn't call you and you had this POS lemon car with alot of faults wouldn't you spread the word to your friends and others what was wrong with the car, what it would take to make it right?

Bottom line, its cool that he seems to care, but I just want the game fixed. Whether he posts on here or not, just fix it. You got my money. You'll get it next year if you fix this. If not you won't. And EA may not care, but I'll be damned if I'm going to bow down and be greatful because someone comes in and talks to me after I've spent my money on a product that has broken features. And I played the demo, and they broke the Kick off coverage since then, so as a consumer, the demo misrepresented the game. So at minimum they "owe" me to fix that because it was misrepresented.

# 68 Security Device @ 07/23/08 06:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fistofrage


	Once again, he is getting free market research, free game testing and building "good will" by being in here. There could be alot of motives why he's here. But the main reason would be to promote future sales of the game. For all I know tthe brass at EA could be telling him to pander to the sports websites. If a salesman sold you a lemon of a car which you couldn't get your money back for then the company that manufactured had a representative call you, wouldn't you give him a piece of your mind. If a representative didn't call you and you had this POS lemon car with alot of faults wouldn't you spread the word to your friends and others what was wrong with the car, what it would take to make it right? Bottom line, its cool that he seems to care, but I just want the game fixed. Whether he posts on here or not, just fix it. You got my money. You'll get it next year if you fix this. If not you won't. And EA may not care, but I'll be damned if I'm going to bow down and be greatful because someone comes in and talks to me after I've spent my money on a product that has broken features. And I played the demo, and they broke the Kick off coverage since then, so as a consumer, the demo misrepresented the game. So at minimum they "owe" me to fix that because it was misrepresented.

If you buy a car for $60, it will be a Lemon. Irrelevant comparison.
And Kickoff coverage isn't broken. I've never had a kickoff returned on me in 09 playing the CPU or Online. An no, I don't play on weak difficulties. Try staying in your lanes and break down before you tackle. Don't complain about the new features if you can't figure out the minor adjustments that they made.

# 69 malek05 @ 07/23/08 06:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Security Device


	You people are funny. I'm just waiting patiently for the patch and in the meantime enjoying the parts of the game that do work properly. I'm in no hurry. I have a life outside of video games, so I can find other things to occupy my time. But when this patch does drop, lookout, I'm gonna tear it up.

I've got this '86 Cadillac, but only "parts" of it work...

Would you be willing to buy it from me for the full price of the car...instead of the parts...say...$13,000?

# 70 fistofrage @ 07/23/08 06:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Security Device


	If you buy a car for $60, it will be a Lemon. Irrelevant comparison. And Kickoff coverage isn't broken. I've never had a kickoff returned on me in 09 playing the CPU or Online. An no, I don't play on weak difficulties. Try staying in your lanes and break down before you tackle. Don't complain about the new features if you can't figure out the minor adjustments that they made.

Apparantly there is more than 1 EA representative "stepping up to the plate". Kick-off coverage isn't broken? Punt coverage isn't broken? you have already lost all credibility. Next thing you'll be telling me the sliders work.

Apparantly you don't understand comparative reasoning. It doesn't matter how much I paid for a new product $5 or $500,000 if the thing has flaws, they need to be fixed. Until its fixed, I'll air my grievances and point the flaws out to others so they can make informed decisions.

# 71 Security Device @ 07/23/08 07:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fistofrage


	Apparantly there is more than 1 EA representative "stepping up to the plate". Kick-off coverage isn't broken? Punt coverage isn't broken? you have already lost all credibility. Next thing you'll be telling me the sliders work. Apparantly you don't understand comparative reasoning. It doesn't matter how much I paid for a new product $5 or $500,000 if the thing has flaws, they need to be fixed. Until its fixed, I'll air my grievances and point the flaws out to others so they can make informed decisions.

Saying they're broken isn't explaining why they're broken. Please explain yourself. Next time I play, I'll be more open to see what you're talking about. For someone to make a truly informed decision, they should be presented with the Pros & Cons, not just one side.

And no, the Sliders don't work. I never argued that point.

Are you saying you would rather have a percentage of your money back and be stuck with a broken game ?? Or would you like those resources spent on a crew focused on fixing those issues ??

# 72 Security Device @ 07/23/08 07:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by malek05


	I've got this '86 Cadillac, but only "parts" of it work... Would you be willing to buy it from me for the full price of the car...instead of the parts...say...$13,000?

Nope, not if you tell me the whole thing doesn't work before I buy it. Don't you think if EA knew all of this before the game came out, they might not have released it ?? Not to mention that this must have slipped past M$ and Sony. EA isn't the only company at fault here. Majority, yes. All, not quite. I would assume there was people put in place to detect these issues before the game came out. Since they didn't, I am lead to believe that there is also people put in place to fix after ship issues.

All I'm saying is have patience. These problems probably weren't created overnight. Can we really expect em to be fixed overnight ??

And no, I'm not an "EA Rep stepping up to the plate." I'm just not as pessimistic as most others.

# 73 fistofrage @ 07/23/08 08:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Security Device


	Saying they're broken isn't explaining why they're broken. Please explain yourself. Next time I play, I'll be more open to see what you're talking about. For someone to make a truly informed decision, they should be presented with the Pros & Cons, not just one side. And no, the Sliders don't work. I never argued that point. Are you saying you would rather have a percentage of your money back and be stuck with a broken game ?? Or would you like those resources spent on a crew focused on fixing those issues ??

OK, next time you play watch the coverage team on the kickoff is doing. The men on the wings will run straight down the sidelines, but not break at the ball carrier until he is past them. Now look at the other coverage members, they get blocked too easily and don't shed these blocks. In the event they don't get blocked, they run very slow. You literally don't see a defender until you reach the 30. 1 or 2 moves and you are gone. In previous versions the defenders would Sprint down the field and converge on the ball.

Punt coverage, the gunners get tied up and the rest of the team doesn't sprint down the field.

I would rather have a complete game, but if they can't do that, then yeah, I guess selling this game at a discount price of $19.99 to $39.99 instead of $60 depending on what's broken would be a good compromise.

# 74 BIG CAROLINA @ 07/23/08 08:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Security Device


	Nope, not if you tell me the whole thing doesn't work before I buy it. Don't you think if EA knew all of this before the game came out, they might not have released it ?? Not to mention that this must have slipped past M$ and Sony. EA isn't the only company at fault here. Majority, yes. All, not quite. I would assume there was people put in place to detect these issues before the game came out. Since they didn't, I am lead to believe that there is also people put in place to fix after ship issues. All I'm saying is have patience. These problems probably weren't created overnight. Can we really expect em to be fixed overnight ?? And no, I'm not an "EA Rep stepping up to the plate." I'm just not as pessimistic as most others.

I would have to say no, they would have gave it a go anyway.This is nothing new from EA Sports,every year we go through the same thing with either Madden or NCAA on next gen.
When have you seen a Next Gen EA Sports Football title pushed back because they found issues that have to be addressed before being released and the release date was pushed back?
I find it hard to believe that with some of the issues that are in this game were NOT seen by testers, when most of us could clearly see them on day one.

# 75 Security Device @ 07/23/08 08:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fistofrage


	OK, next time you play watch the coverage team on the kickoff is doing. The men on the wings will run straight down the sidelines, but not break at the ball carrier until he is past them. Now look at the other coverage members, they get blocked too easily and don't shed these blocks. In the event they don't get blocked, they run very slow. You literally don't see a defender until you reach the 30. 1 or 2 moves and you are gone. In previous versions the defenders would Sprint down the field and converge on the ball. Punt coverage, the gunners get tied up and the rest of the team doesn't sprint down the field. I would rather have a complete game, but if they can't do that, then yeah, I guess selling this game at a discount price of $19.99 to $39.99 instead of $60 depending on what's broken would be a good compromise.

I'll try that. On most occasions, I play as the outside guy and usually kick to on side or the other. I'll try using some middle people too. I usually play contain and force the returner inside towards my guys. It also sounds like it might be a personell issue. Maybe placing too many big men on kickoff, which I know we have no control over. I think, by what you're saying, is that too much may have been tweaked here. In 08 (my experience) players were bunching up or converging too quickly and making it somewhat easy to run around everyone with a speedy player.

As for punts, I'll just have to see if I can see what you see. Right now, I have now reason to believe you or not to believe you.

I think everyone would agree with a discounted price game.

# 76 Security Device @ 07/23/08 09:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BIG CAROLINA


	I would have to say no, they would have gave it a go anyway.This is nothing new from EA Sports,every year we go through the same thing with either Madden or NCAA on next gen. When have you seen a Next Gen EA Sports Football title pushed back because they found issues that have to be addressed before being released and the release date was pushed back? I find it hard to believe that with some of the issues that are in this game were NOT seen by testers, when most of us could clearly see them on day one.

Yeah, you're right. they probably would try to push it out anyways. Only reason I could see for them not pushing back is due to it's licensing. It may be a date they MUST ship by. That's pure speculation on my part though.

I agree totally with you though. Testers or someone should have seen this before the general public. It's a pretty big problem(s). Hopefully it's all hashed out shortly.

# 77 brk1078 @ 07/24/08 12:06 AM

Its good that they are now deciding to talk to us the gamers. Its hard to always keep in touch with us. They are probably working on the roster patch now, and that takes a lot of work.

# 78 Security Device @ 07/24/08 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fistofrage


	OK, next time you play watch the coverage team on the kickoff is doing. The men on the wings will run straight down the sidelines, but not break at the ball carrier until he is past them. Now look at the other coverage members, they get blocked too easily and don't shed these blocks. In the event they don't get blocked, they run very slow. You literally don't see a defender until you reach the 30. 1 or 2 moves and you are gone. In previous versions the defenders would Sprint down the field and converge on the ball. Punt coverage, the gunners get tied up and the rest of the team doesn't sprint down the field. I would rather have a complete game, but if they can't do that, then yeah, I guess selling this game at a discount price of $19.99 to $39.99 instead of $60 depending on what's broken would be a good compromise.

I tried what you said. I also just let people run on their own with no user input. I can see where you're coming from. Most people are too slow. Also, the Contain guys are too fast, not in speed rating, but just that they seem to sprint in a straight line instead of slowing up and forcing the action inside no matter what. I totally see where you're coming from. I don't completely agree that it's busted or broken. It does need some tuning, but it still works IMO.

Punts, on the other hand, seem ok to me. I messed around with this in practice though so I could face different types of returns and coverages. If my gunners were doubled, I had a tough time getting them through. If I did a Max Cover Punt, I could get decent coverage. When they bring the punt Block, it's easy for the gunners as long as you get the punt off. Single coverage worked fine for me.

I was primarily using Big Ten teams when I was looking at this. Let me know if you think I should try some other teams. Or let me know if, I'm just rambling and you really don't care. Just trying to find the good and bad and hopefully next year they can make some improvements based on our observations. I think we really need to take advantage of EA's increased presence here.

# 79 fistofrage @ 07/24/08 02:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Security Device


	I tried what you said. I also just let people run on their own with no user input. I can see where you're coming from. Most people are too slow. Also, the Contain guys are too fast, not in speed rating, but just that they seem to sprint in a straight line instead of slowing up and forcing the action inside no matter what. I totally see where you're coming from. I don't completely agree that it's busted or broken. It does need some tuning, but it still works IMO. Punts, on the other hand, seem ok to me. I messed around with this in practice though so I could face different types of returns and coverages. If my gunners were doubled, I had a tough time getting them through. If I did a Max Cover Punt, I could get decent coverage. When they bring the punt Block, it's easy for the gunners as long as you get the punt off. Single coverage worked fine for me. I was primarily using Big Ten teams when I was looking at this. Let me know if you think I should try some other teams. Or let me know if, I'm just rambling and you really don't care. Just trying to find the good and bad and hopefully next year they can make some improvements based on our observations. I think we really need to take advantage of EA's increased presence here.

One other thing that is broken is the fact that if you call a punt block formation, They stay in and block, noone gets down field. You literally have 30 yards of open space. Try that.

Sometimes on the punt coverage has been OK, but I have never ever seen gunners get down quick enough that I would be forced to call for a fair catch. The Linemen never get down field so 1 juke and you are in the clear even if the gunners get to you. It just feels broken to me, but Adam said they are looking into it, so I look forward to that.

# 80 rudyjuly2 @ 07/24/08 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fistofrage


	One other thing that is broken is the fact that if you call a punt block formation, They stay in and block, noone gets down field. You literally have 30 yards of open space. Try that.

That is bad but you know what - I don't call punt block anymore because of that. Rather than get annoyed and start getting angry, I just use a simple house rule that allows me to enjoy the game. I realize some gamers won't be able to accept the game for some of its flaws but simple solutions do exist (even if they shouldn't be necessary in the first place). The punt return game is bad but I just use some house rules to allow me to see past it.

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