What's Hot and What's Not With Madden NFL 25

Feature Article

Submitted on: 06/03/2013 by Matthew Coe

We've been bombarded with tons of information on Madden NFL 25 in the last week. While a lot of what we are hearing sounds great, such as the return of Owner Mode -- we are not seeing any real gameplay up to this point.

It's doubtful the Madden team is hiding a red herring in the form of atrociously bad gameplay, but most Madden fans want to see what this year's game is bringing to the table with the new 'run-free' feature as well as the second iteration of the 'Infinity Engine.'

Here's what we're excited about and what gives us pause for this year's edition of Madden NFL 25 heading into E3:

Owner's mode is back, and not a moment too soon!

What's Hot

The return of Owner Mode and full 32 team control. This is truly not a moment too soon, Madden is getting a much needed infusion of depth in it's franchise mode. Full 32 team control is an underrated feature for those who like to keep their NFL world running realistically as well.
NCAA Draft Import is back! A very unpopular decision to remove this feature from Madden NFL 13 has been rectified for Madden NFL 25. While yes, this feature should have never been removed, it is nice to see the feature's immediate return after a one year hiatus.
More depth to the commentary in Madden NFL 25. Jim Nance and Phil Simms should have more lines recorded and hopefully more relevant information for Madden 25. Stitching should be better and the commentary should be more specific to your world.
More authentic audio. Supposedly the Madden team has been hard at work adding more team chants, first down and stadium sounds. Also promised is more authentic tracks from various stadiums and redone referee audio. All of this 'sounds' good. We'll see how it plays out when we see some in-game footage.
Trey Wingo and Adam Schefter at the NFL Draft. The NFL Draft is a huge NFL event in real life and in Madden 25 the team aims to make it feel more alive and real with branching storylines and new audio. New this year, draft guides should be rendered less effective since the same draftees won't boom or bust in every draft class.

The big problem: WE WANT TO SEE MORE GAMEPLAY!

What's Not

No news on improved late game AI, game planning, and other weak points of Madden NFL 13's gameplay. We haven't heard anyone acknowledge the issues with the awful single player late game AI, play calling, and roster management. I think we're all looking to hear and see that these things have been fixed.
No PC version of Madden NFL 25. News broke recently that Madden 25 will not be headed to the PC. There was some initial hope that there might have been a PC version in the works, but no dice this year and the outlook doesn't look great going forward.
Owner Mode restrictions. In Madden NFL 25, we're finding out that we don't have all of the freedom that we had in Madden NFL for last-generation consoles. We're restricted to relocating to a select 17 cities and we still have some player editing restrictions. It's great that Owner Mode is back, but it might be another year away from greatness.
"Exclusive" content for XBOX ONE. We don't quite know what this means, but EA has made some kind of deal to bring exclusive content to the XBOX ONE version of many of it's next-gen games. What does this mean for Madden NFL 25? There's too much vagueness going on here currently.
We need to see some actual gameplay. I'm sure EA Sports is holding off on gameplay for E3, but it would really help assure the restless Madden fans if we could see some gameplay footage showing improved blocking, Infinity Engine 2.0, and much improved AI decision making.

What are you looking forward to most with Madden NFL 25 and what are your top concerns as we head into E3?

Madden NFL 25 Videos

Member Comments

# 21 The_Rick_14 @ 06/04/13 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by secondsolution


	I think the lack of videos is due to them wanting to show off the game on the next gen consoles. Its a bit of a concern for the current gen versions.

Did we get gameplay videos before E3 last year? I feel like E3 is usually when we finally stop getting screen shots and start seeing video but I could be wrong.

# 22 jpdavis82 @ 06/04/13 11:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The_Rick_14


	Did we get gameplay videos before E3 last year? I feel like E3 is usually when we finally stop getting screen shots and start seeing video but I could be wrong.

The only video we got before E3 last year was that one where it showed the Steelers and Bengals kick return during the presentation webcast and the physics were "leaked".

In that webcast they mentioned how normally you wouldn't see any kind of actual gameplay videos that early. I think last year spoiled us. This year is no different than the years prior to Madden 13 as far as information being revealed, except that we haven't seen a official presentation reveal yet. I do expect one soon though, in the form of a video instead of a blog based on what Mike Young said, possibly by Friday. At the latest, during E3.

# 23 sdfdvghzhao @ 06/04/13 11:33 AM

Want something in Madden added or fixed?

# 24 The_Balm @ 06/05/13 08:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeuceDouglas


	Wasn't sure where to put this but I thought it was relevant to being 'hot' right now at least in terms of being a good sign. If you didn't see, this is an in-game fighter render from EA's UFC game: Spoiler I would say it looks just as good, if not a bit better than the CGI trailer we saw at the XBOX One reveal. Spoiler Obviously, not trying to put too much into it but I think that it could be a good sign that Madden looks very similar to what we saw, visually, in that trailer. As far as movement is concerned there's really no way of knowing until E3 but the good thing is that it's right around the corner.

It would be awesome if Madden looks like this! But I doubt we'll see it this good looking for a few years, because UFC is two guys in a ring not 22 guys on the field.

# 25 Armor and Sword @ 06/05/13 08:40 PM

Everything feature wise looks great.

It's all about fully functional sliders, penalty system, fully functional autosubs, formation subs sticking every week, CPU AI at a minimum back to M12's capability, and of course IE 2.0 far better tuned and working.

Lots of ifs and ?.

Hope it all works and we finally get the best NFL
game this gen.

# 26 Trick13 @ 06/05/13 09:08 PM

Hot; player position changes (only because the limit to offseason and CPU is going to do it too, fingers crossed that CPU does it well), changes to audible system that work for both offense/defense

Moderate; custom playbooks useable in CFMs, owner mode returns finally, "footplanting" looks to be universal (can't be hot until they show me)

Not; no custom sub packages, still no in-game saves, no word on ability to skip/sim practice and still have backups get some XP, OL/DL wasn't completely overhauled, WR/DB interactions not even mentioned by EA, no word from EA about routes being hard coded/ route based passing 100% of the time (pass lead changing routes is dumb dumb dumb), zone defense(was it addressed at all?) no word on double team plays being back in playbooks - same with contain plays - where did they go and why?
Custom game plans - can you lock them to CPU teams in multi-user online CFM? Are they even in the game at all? AI play call logic - huge M13 issue and barely mentioned by EA

I could go on and on, but the more I think about it, the more NOTs there are at this point - not that it means much, maybe some is just not "news" worthy in EA's POV, but color me worried at the moment.

# 27 Trackball @ 06/05/13 10:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by infemous


	The 'what's hot' list strikes me more as 'what's tepid'... Not too excited about seeing things we expect to be in the game returning as 'new features' again.

I'm so sick of hearing this.

Maybe if someone from EA said "Okay, we admit it, we screwed up with Madden 06" (and they DID screw up, I admit that), maybe these comments will stop.

Or not. Some people are never happy, throwing out the donut because of the hole.

# 28 infemous @ 06/05/13 11:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trackball


	I'm so sick of hearing this. Maybe if someone from EA said "Okay, we admit it, we screwed up with Madden 06" (and they DID screw up, I admit that), maybe these comments will stop. Or not. Some people are never happy, throwing out the donut because of the hole.

Why are you so sick of hearing this?

Is it not true?

Were the vast majority of these features not included in Maddens from less than 2 years ago?

Why are you taking exception so specifically to my opinion?
You're acting as if I should be grateful they took out a bunch of features I and many others enjoyed, only to put them back in and market them to us like they're innovative.

Am I missing something? I'm genuinely confused.

# 29 cowboy_kmoney @ 06/06/13 01:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Step2001


	What's not: The lack of in-depth info for presentation and Franchise/CCM. Thought May 20th was going to be the day for ALL of the info to be dropped. Some, but not all......... Now we get a little more, but have to wait for details on certain aspects of the info released. Still waiting for: 46 man Gameday Rosters (a weekly NFL decision) (NFLHC 09 had this) 8 Man Parctice Squads (all teams use the P.S.) Injuries - Can they carryover to the next year? (NFLHC 09 had this) Can injuries happen during practice? Can they happen during the offseason (player fell off a ladder while working at home). Overall Audio, will it change year to year? Will my QB who was in his 10th year NOW be in his 11th year. Will a team be called the Defending Super Bowl Champs. Will the presentation have stat overlays and audio on that player. Will keys to the game be talked about? Injuries to players & Injuried players (key players) be shown on sidelines in streets (w/stats up on screen), then move to his replacement (w/stats on screen). Just a touch of the details everyone wants & CAN BE DONE, should already be in the game. News Center fixes: Went for my 2nd Super Bowl and it was saying that I was going for my 1st Super Bowl? Yeah........ It's the little things, if it's a bug, then hopefully it's fixed Will trades be more detailed when posted, Especially during the draft! Key little thing. Why do teams trade up? Had a team trade up into the 1st rd (giving up next years 1 & this years 5rd). They selected a safety.........2 years later in my CCM that safety does not start for that team. smh. Checked rosters in Pre-Season. Some teams carrying 3 QB's, a few carrying 4, the rest carrying 2 and ONE team carrying one QB. It's pre-season, teams usuallyhave 3-4 QB's How the AI/CPU handles the roster in Pre-Season is key.......becomes a mess. Starters still playing in the 2nd half at different positions. Fixed?

The little things are the key to it all in making the game have replay value. Like now a nit fir me is It doesnt record probowls superbowl or superbowl M.V.P's won by player in there award history.It should say Superbowl Champion and the year it was won as well as probowls with the year that player made it. Yeah its a over lookedthing because ppl like the Team just play and dont go deep into the players careers like my self.

# 30 Skyboxer @ 06/06/13 02:28 AM

A good Madden on PC would sell plenty enough to justify the release IMO.
Release a crappy game and yeah it won't sell.
With the next gen closer to PC type specs getting a PC version should be easier but we'll never see it.

# 31 DorianDonP @ 06/06/13 02:41 AM

I'm glad they limited the options for city relocations, especially with team specific commentary and storylines in franchise. I'd much rather have realistic choices like Brooklyn with realistic commentary than the ability to move the team to Gotham City with generic commentary.

# 32 Trackball @ 06/06/13 04:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by infemous


	Why are you so sick of hearing this? Is it not true? Were the vast majority of these features not included in Maddens from less than 2 years ago? Why are you taking exception so specifically to my opinion? You're acting as if I should be grateful they took out a bunch of features I and many others enjoyed, only to put them back in and market them to us like they're innovative. Am I missing something? I'm genuinely confused.

Let me clarify.

First off, no, I didn't mean that to be an attack on you personally. I apologize for that.

It's just that it comes across as really miserable and ungrateful--plus I keep seeing it over and over, people saying "So, Madden 2005 then. Gotcha."

Even if that wasn't your intention, if it's INTERPRETED differently, then it doesn't matter what your intention was--perception may not be reality, but it does count for a lot. Just ask the NBA's Roy Hibbert.

What I'm saying is that I'm thankful so much is changing for this year, and that has me really excited for Madden 25. Heck, I actually paid the five bucks earlier today to preorder it at Gamestop--five years ago, I NEVER thought I'd do that for an EA game.

Then again, I didn't play Madden 12, but did get Madden 13--I even started a topic once, asking which I should get, since I hadn't played a Madden game since Madden 2004.

And looking back, yeah, I should have gotten 12. I can see people's problems--but I still find 13 a fun game. Heck, one of my favorite PS1 games has a bug in it that can crash the game if you're not careful (Star Ocean: The Second Story, thankfully fixed in the PSP port). But I still had tons of fun with it.

Look, all I'm saying is that I want people to look on the bright side of this. If you think we should have had these things since Madden 2005, then play Madden 2005.

But how many people are doing that? Really?

Or maybe I just want to pay EA back for the excellent customer service they gave me a few months ago. Who knows.

# 33 MrSerendipity @ 06/06/13 09:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big FN Deal


	I usually don't comment on, what is imo, the misplaced humility of others but I am this time. EA Tiburon making a solid football game and/or providing you with excellent customer service is not some accolade or should be treated like something extraordinary, it's their reasonable service. It's not like EA dropped the price of M25 to $29.99 or customer service gave you a free DLC, that I am aware of, something unexpected like that to truly be humbled by. By their own admission, it's poor design and form to be taking out features, so when they correct that some years later, that's not the stuff of gratitude. I can see being glad they are back, even acknowledging the fact, "glad Tiburon added this stuff back" but not on the level of acting as if Tiburon went some extra mile for the consumer. With the exception of physics, we aren't talking about reinventing the wheel here or innovation, this is stuff that people had become accustomed to having in other football games and past Maddens, being added in 2013, that even IF it works, won't raise the bar, won't even get the game back to even because so much other past stuff is still missing, it's just "another step in the right direction". Tiburon seems to really have some consumers twisted up that working long hours and putting out a feature filled game is somehow beyond the call of duty, it's not. To state the obvious, you are entitled to feel however you want about whatever you want but don't try to act like others that don't place Tiburon on a pedestal for getting Madden to where it's at, are ungrateful.

I see your point and I agree with a lot of it. Heck, I probably agree with most of it. But while we can't pretend that EA/Tiburon is doing groundbreaking work with these Maddens. We can't pretend that they're doing nothing but taking steps back either. People constantly complain about how there hasn't been a good Madden on the current gen. Personally, I would have to disagree with that. I think Madden 12 was one of the better Football games I've played. I think people are just so bummed about the inaccuracies, glitches and so forth in past years games that they've begun to exaggerate how well done Maddens on the past gen really were.

I think Madden has seen some progression in the past years with a greater understanding of detail, graphics and aesthetics. Visually, has the game ever really looked better? Are you not impressed that rather than moving your team to some small town with a generic logo, generic uniforms and no special commentary, now you'll get a professionally made logo with legitimate uniforms and commentary devoted specifically to your team and it's business decisions? Is the draft not more detailed with player-specific backgrounds and stories? Is the draft not also more visually appealing? Those are just a few examples of how the game has progressed just in the last three years alone.

I'm not taking EA or Tiburon's defense, as I also believe we should be getting a better product by now. And I wish that EA/Tiburon would take a good look at how The Show has been made. There is still plenty of room for EA/Tiburon to grow in the way they're making this games. But let's not discredit their entire work by summing up these improvements to game modes as recycling and repackaging.

# 34 infemous @ 06/06/13 09:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trackball


	Let me clarify. First off, no, I didn't mean that to be an attack on you personally. I apologize for that. It's just that it comes across as really miserable and ungrateful--plus I keep seeing it over and over, people saying "So, Madden 2005 then. Gotcha." Even if that wasn't your intention, if it's INTERPRETED differently, then it doesn't matter what your intention was--perception may not be reality, but it does count for a lot. Just ask the NBA's Roy Hibbert. What I'm saying is that I'm thankful so much is changing for this year, and that has me really excited for Madden 25. Heck, I actually paid the five bucks earlier today to preorder it at Gamestop--five years ago, I NEVER thought I'd do that for an EA game. Then again, I didn't play Madden 12, but did get Madden 13--I even started a topic once, asking which I should get, since I hadn't played a Madden game since Madden 2004. And looking back, yeah, I should have gotten 12. I can see people's problems--but I still find 13 a fun game. Heck, one of my favorite PS1 games has a bug in it that can crash the game if you're not careful (Star Ocean: The Second Story, thankfully fixed in the PSP port). But I still had tons of fun with it. Look, all I'm saying is that I want people to look on the bright side of this. If you think we should have had these things since Madden 2005, then play Madden 2005. But how many people are doing that? Really? Or maybe I just want to pay EA back for the excellent customer service they gave me a few months ago. Who knows.

No worries man.

I think that we have a right to be miserable, and we are being grateful doesn't come into it. We are customers, we pay for a product. If the product is not up to the standard we would expect considering the price paid, then we reserve every right to complain in any and every way we wish.

In my opinion, EA is ungrateful for continuously putting out a sub par product, lying to us in their promotional pursuits, nickel and diming us with micro transactions (or trying to), removing and then re-installing old features and continuously putting out a bug laden game.

My first Madden was Madden 03 on the PS2. I never needed to buy another Madden until I got a PS3 and got Madden 10. I really enjoyed it, especially Online Franchise, and having been heavily involved in many different leagues, I have felt compelled to buy every Madden since. (Btw. I have not bought a FIFA since FIFA 11, despite how good the new games are.)

It is my choice whether to buy the game or not and I choose to. This then gives me every right to air out my opinions if I am dissatisfied with the product.
At first it was the small things that struck me as being the difference between Madden 03 and 10 - things like the helmets not popping off, how in stadium effects and commentary had substantially regressed, how there was a distinct lack of signature running styles (and how bad the animations looked in general)... Then, as I started playing more and more Online Franchise and was confronted with 'cheesers' I had to learn how they were able to cheese... Exposing a whole dearth of AI, physics and animation glitches.

Having found out about Backbreaker and then playing the Demo, I realised what was achievable on the PS3 and did not accept the awful 'features' being given to us on Madden when there were such FUNDAMENTAL issues with the game that really detracted from its enjoyability.

Funnily enough, this also coincides with the limitations placed upon us by EA to play the game 'their way'. The constant roster updates over or underrating players, not being able to edit a roster and import it into a career mode... the said career mode being empty and full of useless elements (non working IR, the remnants of Owner Mode etc. etc.)

All this, and oh yeah! Online Franchise was untouched in 2 years. Completely ignored. Not one addition to it.

I was delighted when CCM was announced and was very excited for Madden 13. I have played the game since it was released non stop, but that does not mean that I am not frustrated by all the bugs that make Offline CCM unplayable, the horrendous AI and game management by CPU teams, the stupid glitches like the RT being awful no matter the ratings (in fact, most ratings being useless), the inability to press cover, the overpowering of Man Coverage (and the continued presence of psychic DBs), the awful uniform errors, the stale commentary and presentation, the absence of a realistic injury system, the absence of any sort of morale or team management etc. etc. etc.

I was also pissed to learn that features I did really enjoy, such as Player Roles on M12, were removed.

If I can write a list as damning as that in under 5 minutes, then there is a serious issue with either the game or its developers.

To not even see vital elements of a Career Mode such as Player Roles added onto CCM, but instead see Owner Mode (packaged with lies about Authentic Nike uniforms) with the only other additions being features removed from M12 (and their likely haphazard re-introduction) I feel more than every right to be disillusioned, aggrieved and annoyed.

I am now, finally, potentially, going to pass on Madden and miss out on being included in some of my leagues unless I am sure that the game will not be a source of anger and frustration the way M13 has been.

Being a generally positive and optimistic person, I have placed all of my hopes for Madden in the next generation, meaning that I am likely to spend a great deal of my hard earned cash on a new machine and the next gen Madden straight away - under one condition: That they deliver on some of their promises for once.

If I have to contend with yet more of the same issues, despite having been promised a revolutionary physics and AI system, you can be damn sure I won't be buying another Madden, and you can be damn sure I'm gonna let them know through Operation Sports and any outlet I can.

This is after all, the only way I can play with my beloved Rams and play my favourite sport.

# 35 infemous @ 06/06/13 09:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrSerendipity


	I see your point and I agree with a lot of it. Heck, I probably agree with most of it. But while we can't pretend that EA/Tiburon is doing groundbreaking work with these Maddens. We can't pretend that they're doing nothing but taking steps back either. People constantly complain about how there hasn't been a good Madden on the current gen. Personally, I would have to disagree with that. I think Madden 12 was one of the better Football games I've played. I think people are just so bummed about the inaccuracies, glitches and so forth in past years games that they've begun to exaggerate how well done Maddens on the past gen really were. I think Madden has seen some progression in the past years with a greater understanding of detail, graphics and aesthetics. Visually, has the game ever really looked better? Are you not impressed that rather than moving your team to some small town with a generic logo, generic uniforms and no special commentary, now you'll get a professionally made logo with legitimate uniforms and commentary devoted specifically to your team and it's business decisions? Is the draft not more detailed with player-specific backgrounds and stories? Is the draft not also more visually appealing? Those are just a few examples of how the game has progressed just in the last three years alone. I'm not taking EA or Tiburon's defense, as I also believe we should be getting a better product by now. And I wish that EA/Tiburon would take a good look at how The Show has been made. There is still plenty of room for EA/Tiburon to grow in the way they're making this games. But let's not discredit their entire work by summing up these improvements to game modes as recycling and repackaging.

"SOME" progression.

I'd just like to ask you, what do you expect from 3 years of development?

Is that all you expect?

Playing on PS3 it should be a given that the graphics are improved.
It should also be a fundamental fact that physics would be improved and animations would be more diverse and true to life. With these expectations, we'd also expect a degree of quality in this. We'd want these animations to play out accurately and realistically, we'd expect the physics to determine outcomes in diverse and natural ways.

Quite simply put, we haven't see anything remotely close to this.

Instead, in these 3 years (not counting the previous years on PS3/Xbox) we have seen gameflow (ask madden), gameplanning (removed), run free (who knows how this will work), only one year of a reasonable physics engine, the inclusion of Online Franchise and the ignoring of it for 2 years, the inclusion of CCM and now the addition of owner mode.

All the other 'features' that have been 'new' have been recycled from previous Maddens or have already been removed awaiting future re-introduction.

Would you say, considering the resources available to EA Tiburon, the exclusive license and the in built market for the game, that that handful of progressions in 3 YEARS is acceptable?

Now I'd like you to compare that with a 3 year span of either last gen Madden or any other sports franchise available.

I'm not discrediting their work at all, seeing as I still buy their game (for now) but the fact remains that no-one is indebted to EA in any way, nor is there any reason to be satisfied with the ways in which we, as customers, have been treated.

It is up to each individual's discretion whether they wish to see beyond the flaws of the game or not, the same way it is up to each individual's discretion whether or not to voice how they feel about the game.

# 36 DeuceDouglas @ 06/06/13 09:50 AM

Man, I can't wait for E3...

# 37 MrSerendipity @ 06/06/13 10:01 AM

Hold up, you can't just choose a single paragraph in my three paragraph long response and single it out. Especially when my first paragraph and third paragraph both show a different outlook than the lone 2nd paragraph you chose to breakdown.

As I stated, I don't think what they've done is enough. And I do think that they're deserving of some criticism. I also stated that we aren't getting the game that we should be getting at this point. The progression that they've made isn't enough and I wish they'd look at what other games (I mentioned 'The Show' as an example) are doing so they can look at what they could do better. My only statement as I clarified in my first paragraph, is that we can't claim that there haven't been any improvements or progression because there has. Is it enough progression? No. Are there enough improvements? No. Is the game where it should be at this point? No. Have there been improvements and progression? Yes. Have I seen evidence that some of the developers know what they're doing? Yes. That is all that I was claiming when I made that statement.

As for commenting on the games in the last gen, were there noticeable improvements in the yearly releases? Sure there were. Have there been noticeable improvements in the yearly releases on this gen? Yes there have. I think one of the most popular improvements over the past few years would be pass trajectories which weren't as prominent and accurate in any of the last gen games. CCM is also an improvement over Franchise and Superstar mode, despite it's glitches. Lets not pretend that Franchise Mode and Superstar Mode didn't come with their faults in the last gen. I'm not saying the last gen games weren't good. I'm simply stating that they weren't as good as people on these forums build them up to be. It's like when you date a girl who knows every button to set you off. Just because she's annoying, doesn't mean that last chick you were ****** was any less of a hag. But because that new girlfriend is bugging you so much, you start seeing that last girlfriend a bit more fancy. Madden 2005 and ESPN NFL 2k5 both came with some faults too.

# 38 MrSerendipity @ 06/06/13 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bucky60


	That's opinion. I thought it was a big step backwards. Missing features, bad AI, unrealistic progression system. They would have to return the missing features and have them work correctly and fix some major AI snafu's for me to say CCM is an improvement. CCM can be an improvement, but it isn't yet.

The missing features were a loss but I don't think such a loss that it made CCM inferior to it's former counterparts. The AI was bad throughout the entire game, not just CCM. So you can't hang the AI on CCM alone. The progression system actually worked decent for me but I know it didn't for others, so yes that's a matter of opinion. I think after you factor in Game Face, Story-Arch, Specific Draft Classes and the revamped Free Agency, CCM comes out better. It was their first year with the revamped mode, we couldn't expect them to have everything perfect that first year. The only issue that I think you're very valid on is the AI which took a step back. But it took a step back throughout the entire game, not CCM alone.

# 39 infemous @ 06/06/13 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrSerendipity


	Hold up, you can't just choose a single paragraph in my three paragraph long response and single it out. Especially when my first paragraph and third paragraph both show a different outlook than the lone 2nd paragraph you chose to breakdown. As I stated, I don't think what they've done is enough. And I do think that they're deserving of some criticism. I also stated that we aren't getting the game that we should be getting at this point. The progression that they've made isn't enough and I wish they'd look at what other games (I mentioned 'The Show' as an example) are doing so they can look at what they could do better. My only statement as I clarified in my first paragraph, is that we can't claim that there haven't been any improvements or progression because there has. Is it enough progression? No. Are there enough improvements? No. Is the game where it should be at this point? No. Have there been improvements and progression? Yes. Have I seen evidence that some of the developers know what they're doing? Yes. That is all that I was claiming when I made that statement. As for commenting on the games in the last gen, were there noticeable improvements in the yearly releases? Sure there were. Have there been noticeable improvements in the yearly releases on this gen? Yes there have. I think one of the most popular improvements over the past few years would be pass trajectories which weren't as prominent and accurate in any of the last gen games. CCM is also an improvement over Franchise and Superstar mode, despite it's glitches. Lets not pretend that Franchise Mode and Superstar Mode didn't come with their faults in the last gen. I'm not saying the last gen games weren't good. I'm simply stating that they weren't as good as people on these forums build them up to be. It's like when you date a girl who knows every button to set you off. Just because she's annoying, doesn't mean that last chick you were ****** was any less of a hag. But because that new girlfriend is bugging you so much, you start seeing that last girlfriend a bit more fancy. Madden 2005 and ESPN NFL 2k5 both came with some faults too.

Apologies for that, its bad etiquette. I didn't comment on the other two paragraphs because I agree entirely.

I also agree in general with what you're saying.

It seems that the difference lies in how vocal we are about the lack of progression. It would be idiotic to deny that there have been improvements, but the improvements are not relative to the rest of the gaming landscape. The business practices of EA put a sour taste in the mouth, meaning it is hard to even want to appreciate the improvements.

For me, it comes down to whether or not there is a valid excuse for the progression we've seen vs progression from other titles or even previous gen Madden and quite frankly, there isn't.

CCM is indeed an improvement on Franchise and Superstar, but a marginal one. For the inclusion of CCM (and the melding of Franchise, Superstar and now Owner modes) we have seen the continued absence of an injury system, player morale, notable draft improvements etc. etc. Superstar mode within CCM has seen the same neglect that it always has, completely ignoring the opportunities for an immersive mode. Franchise within CCM likewise. Now we get a 'deeper' Owner mode while the other modes are still shallow as ****.

I like the idea of CCM, especially that it enables the same features for a 32 team Online Franchise as it does for a single player Offline one and I can understand the idea of implementing it so that one mode can be fixed and improved upon, directly impacting all the other modes.. Thats smart and something you don't often see from EA.

The issue lies in the inclusion of a 'splash' feature like Owner mode, which definitely has a market, but that its inclusion is at the expense of a deeper version of the other two, arguably more important, game modes.

It seems that the Madden after Madden 25 will be the barometer to really gage the success of CCM and this dev team. If, on the next gen, CCM is gone or bare bones and then Madden 15/26 (whatever the ****) is only going to re-establish what we get now, public attitude towards EA will continue to sink into the depths of the abyss. They would be indicating a nigh on criminal reversion to the same tactics of 5 steps backwards, 2 steps forward and I would hope that someone with some legal knowledge and a great deal of cash would sue them to high hell for it.

# 40 MrSerendipity @ 06/06/13 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by infemous


	Apologies for that, its bad etiquette. I didn't comment on the other two paragraphs because I agree entirely.

Not a problem, I was likely a bit more defensive than I should have been.

Quote:


	It seems that the difference lies in how vocal we are about the lack of progression. It would be idiotic to deny that there have been improvements, but the improvements are not relative to the rest of the gaming landscape. The business practices of EA put a sour taste in the mouth, meaning it is hard to even want to appreciate the improvements.

I can understand this but you'd have to see it from my perspective I guess. I've spent year after countless year complaining about this game and the poor handling of the basic details and intricacies by EA/Tiburon. And quite frankly, I just get tired of it. I get tired of constantly feeling so negative about their work on a game that I should love. So every year when the new game comes out, rather than spend my time criticizing them over what I think they should be doing, I wait until I play the game myself and then I come to a conclusion. It's just a lot less exhausting that way. And if I do it that way, I don't already have a negative outlook on the game when I start playing it.

Quote:


	For me, it comes down to whether or not there is a valid excuse for the progression we've seen vs progression from other titles or even previous gen Madden and quite frankly, there isn't.

I think you're absolutely spot on with this. My point was more evolved around the fact that there has been some progression. But your point that the progression in the specified date range isn't adequate is spot on.

Quote:


	CCM is indeed an improvement on Franchise and Superstar, but a marginal one. For the inclusion of CCM (and the melding of Franchise, Superstar and now Owner modes) we have seen the continued absence of an injury system, player morale, notable draft improvements etc. etc. Superstar mode within CCM has seen the same neglect that it always has, completely ignoring the opportunities for an immersive mode. Franchise within CCM likewise. Now we get a 'deeper' Owner mode while the other modes are still shallow as ****.

I agree, CCM still has a ton of room to grow. Hopefully we'll see that growth over the next few games.

Quote:


	I like the idea of CCM, especially that it enables the same features for a 32 team Online Franchise as it does for a single player Offline one and I can understand the idea of implementing it so that one mode can be fixed and improved upon, directly impacting all the other modes.. Thats smart and something you don't often see from EA. The issue lies in the inclusion of a 'splash' feature like Owner mode, which definitely has a market, but that its inclusion is at the expense of a deeper version of the other two, arguably more important, game modes.

I think we're mostly in agreement on this one. With that said, I don't think they've completely left CCM alone. I expect we'll see many of the issues we had last year fixed, given that they're so simple to fix.

Quote:


	It seems that the Madden after Madden 25 will be the barometer to really gage the success of CCM and this dev team. If, on the next gen, CCM is gone or bare bones and then Madden 15/26 (whatever the ****) is only going to re-establish what we get now, public attitude towards EA will continue to sink into the depths of the abyss. They would be indicating a nigh on criminal reversion to the same tactics of 5 steps backwards, 2 steps forward and I would hope that someone with some legal knowledge and a great deal of cash would sue them to high hell for it.

I couldn't agree more. I'm honestly surprised that they're implementing anything new this year. Next year when new gen has been out for a year is when I expect them to set the mark for what this franchise is going to be. Madden 15/26 will be the make or break game in the Madden series.

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