NBA Elite 11 News Post

NBA Elite 11 Gameplay Q&A with Novell Thomas (NLSC)

07:09 AM - August 26, 2010 by dragon4thQ

NBA Live Series Center has posted an interview with Novell Thomas, Gameplay Producer for NBA Elite 11.

Quote:


	"Can you talk a little about the post game in NBA ELITE 11? What changes have been made to the controls and available post moves? With the ability to control your feet and your hands we really wanted to make sure that came through in the post game. You can easily get into back to basket and backdown moves. From there you can perform jumphooks, sky hooks, drop steps, pro hops, running gathers from a backdown. With all of these controls you have all the tools necessary to pull off the moves you want to in the post. Is the game balanced between offense and defense? Is the Defensive Assist control still available to help users stay with their man? From a balance standpoint one of our goals was to make playing defense fun. We've had a lot of people say that steals feel powerful, blocks feel powerful, you can successfully stay with the ball carrier, CPU help defenders are more alert and aware of where the ball is and they will dig at the ball to knock the ball loose. So from a defensive standpoint you have the control available to you this year. We don't have defensive assist control this year but we have spent a considerable amount of time putting the player in a position that makes sense from a basketball standpoint and also from what the user is inputting on the control whether it be off-ball or on-ball."

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# 21 Epiffani @ 08/26/10 05:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by da ThRONe


	Maybe thats what RTP is doing. Fixing them to the point that there obsolete. Clearly the juror is still out but I have never been a big fan of (most) sliders. Why do I have to adjust the rate inwhich a player make lay-ups? Doesnt that player have a million ratings that impact his lay-up skills?

Again, people are all different, which in turn means that we'll all have our own likes and dislikes with a game. To think that real time physics is suppose to remedy the differences and contrast in style in which people preferably play with sliders is downright asinine, and in retrospect, you're saying that real time physics can potentially be the answer to everyone's problem with this game, and could replace sliders altogether, and that will never happen no matter how advance this system becomes and I don't need to have played this game to make such a bold statement. Backbreaker's real time physics engine is beyond anything that has been attempted in a sports video game, and they put in over 3 years of work making it, but yet if you look on their website forums or in the O.S BB wishlist thread, you'd see people clamoring and asking for sliders because no matter how awesome a game's physics is, there are bound to be problems, and those problems could be completely subjective and a matter of personal preference. The thing is, I'm not even a huge proponent of using sliders, but I do have enough respect for those who do to want their own personal experience out of a game by continuously tweaking, and editing. I don't see how anyone can have a problem with those who are concerned with viable options being taken away no matter how minuscule they appear to some.

A poster above pointed out that some of the sliders didn't work anyway and that still don't justify taking them out; again I'll say, MAKE THEM WORK NOW. Sounds like a bit of a cop-out IMO. As far as your question in regards to lay-ups and having a million other ratings dictating and impacting lay-ups, not really, and that's has always been something that has plagued this series, which is the lack of customization, and control given to users OFF the court. There hasn't been a lot of indepth rating tying into the gameplay in years past, and now people are suppose to take lightly that even more customization options may be being taken away? Makes no sense whether you're for or against the use of sliders.

# 22 da ThRONe @ 08/26/10 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Epiffani


	Again, people are all different, which in turn means that we'll all have our own likes and dislikes with a game. To think that real time physics is suppose to remedy the differences and contrast in style in which people preferably play with sliders is downright asinine, and in retrospect, you're saying that real time physics can potentially be the answer to everyone's problem with this game, and could replace sliders altogether, and that will never happen no matter how advance this system becomes and I don't need to have played this game to make such a bold statement. Backbreaker's real time physics engine is beyond anything that has been attempted in a sports video game, and they put in over 3 years of work making it, but yet if you look on their website forums or in the O.S BB wishlist thread, you'd see people clamoring and asking for sliders because no matter how awesome a game's physics is, there are bound to be problems, and those problems could be completely subjective and a matter of personal preference. The thing is, I'm not even a huge proponent of using sliders, but I do have enough respect for those who do to want their own personal experience out of a game by continuously tweaking, and editing. I don't see how anyone can have a problem with those who are concerned with viable options being taken away no matter how minuscule they appear to some. A poster above pointed out that some of the sliders didn't work anyway and that still don't justify taking them out; again I'll say, MAKE THEM WORK NOW. Sounds like a bit of a cop-out IMO. As far as your question in regards to lay-ups and having a million other ratings dictating and impacting lay-ups, not really, and that's has always been something that has plagued this series, which is the lack of customization, and control given to users OFF the court. There hasn't been a lot of indepth rating tying into the gameplay in years past, and now people are suppose to take lightly that even more customization options may be being taken away? Makes no sense whether you're for or against the use of sliders.

Agreed. No game will ever be perfect. But I do think that proper game design and proper AI can make some forms of sliders obsolete.

Besides they havent removed all the sliders. And we dont know which ones are gone. I think before you can really say either way you would need to know whats in and whats out.

# 23 �roke @ 08/26/10 05:55 PM

Well... shot percentages sliders for the users became useless, so... In fact, almost every slider related to the user is pointless if what the producers have been saying about controls and gameplay mechanics is true.

# 24 Epiffani @ 08/26/10 05:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by da ThRONe


	Agreed. No game will ever be perfect. But I do think that proper game design and proper AI can make some forms of sliders obsolete. Besides they havent removed all the sliders. And we dont know which ones are gone. I think before you can really say either way you would need to know whats in and whats out.

Siders in any fashion should never be "obsolete" in a sports game unless it's renown across all sorts of different spectrum's as being perfect, and being the pinnacle and apex that can not be passed by any other game within the same genre. The way I look at it, the more customization options (that includes sliders), the less complaining that people will have to deal with during the life of the title. Just look at NCAA basketball 10, and Choops for an example. It's amazing to me how a title made several years ago is still getting more burn than a title released not even a year ago, and that is in large part due to the level of customization in the older game. As long as people have their own preferences, and outlook on how a sports game should be played, there should always be sliders;the more options the better. I will say that I don't want developers believing that they can release any ole game because they have a wealth of sliders, but that is up to them to determine and it's out of my control if they have such a shrewd mentality towards their own product.

# 25 ccoaxum @ 08/26/10 07:33 PM

I think everything sounds good....but im still waiting on the demo...im grew up on this series and the pass years it hasn't been that gud but i still played it and 2k. I am wondering what other modes are on the game other then ones that were mention already. I would like to see the dunk contest, 3 point contest, etc....and street ball.....like one on one, two on two, three on three...like the old games use to have...thats some things that 2k kept up with that live or elite use to have.

# 26 coolcras7 @ 08/26/10 07:47 PM

I can't even remember the last time we got any real new info that did not come in written from, or a video from a really early build, it seems like every day we are getting a video or a insight from the other game this was something that in past year EA was famous for.

# 27 Epiffani @ 08/27/10 12:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kingpnp


	to say the above. you must not know how the sliders work. Sure people have their way of playing the game. but heres the deal. with certain sliders and on and off features. you could make a virtual nba james with any 2k11 or Elite 11 game. now ask yourself "are these games SUPPOSED to be more SIM like or more Arcade Like?" if the answer is SIM. then some sliders SHOULD be rendered obsolete by improvements in the AI as well as improvements in how we move around(RTP). and thats just one example of a customized slider that a lot of people use.

People are really trying to seriously make a case for less sliders/options under any circumstances. This is unbelievable and quite honestly, your example fail on many levels. Firstly, who's to say if there were in fact a speed slider that people would use it to play an archaic brand of basketball that would have them playing the game like NBA Jam? Maybe they'd use it to slow the game down, or try to lower the overall scoring output to get it to THEIR liking; You mentioned simulating real life speed. Now, if I were to lower or heighten the speed setting because its feels more simulation to me, and it is a better representation of real life to me, who are you to tell me that I'd be wrong just because we have a different preference in game speed? I think you should take a look at the Madden forum sometime, and see how many people have a discrepancy in the speed of the game (Normal/Fast/Slow.) And just because someone would mess around with the speed slider that wouldn't necessarily equate to playing "cheese" ball, and even if that were to be the case, what would it be to you if you enjoy the game as is as oppose to someone who would want to play a game like that? You say this game is suppose to be sim (that word in it of itself is unverifiable), but this game's job is also to reach an audience beyond "simulation" players, which is why they have multiple difficulties appealing to different groups. Heck, while we're at it and since I just mentioned it, why not get rid of the easier difficulties, and force people to "learn" to really play the game.

LOL @ this quote below:

Quote:


	there should be a speed setup out of the box that simulates real life in game speed. a speed slider should not be available for a SIM game. PERIOD. now until they get this perfected or close to it. then they DO need to provide a slider for it.

Thanks for disproving your whole point of your post, and aiding mine. Don't know why you waited until almost the very end though. There isn't a such thing as a one size fits all pair of shoes. More customization options, the better, PERIOD.

# 28 Jano @ 08/27/10 02:08 PM

I understand what you're saying Epiffani you look at sliders as a customization tool. Which in a lot of cases they are. But I gotta say certain sliders will become useless as the game's mechanics improve or change for example last year the game had a slider for on ball physical defense.

The higher it was the easier it was to for the AI to push up on you and make it harder for you to drive around them. Well now with the new RTP being introduced there's really no need for that slider because now if you want to be more physical you just have to manually get closer to the offensive player.

Its sliders like this I think the devs are taking out because the game's mechanics have changed so now you don't need that artificial help. You can just manually do it yourself.

Things like game speed, rebounding, on ball defense sliders are probably going to stay in because those things can always be something the user may not like. But in cases like the one I stated above I don't see why they should keep it in the game. Especially when the game now has mechanics that can make up for it.

# 29 TUSS11 @ 08/27/10 09:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Epiffani


	People are really trying to seriously make a case for less sliders/options under any circumstances. This is unbelievable and quite honestly, your example fail on many levels. Firstly, who's to say if there were in fact a speed slider that people would use it to play an archaic brand of basketball that would have them playing the game like NBA Jam? Maybe they'd use it to slow the game down, or try to lower the overall scoring output to get it to THEIR liking; You mentioned simulating real life speed. Now, if I were to lower or heighten the speed setting because its feels more simulation to me, and it is a better representation of real life to me, who are you to tell me that I'd be wrong just because we have a different preference in game speed? I think you should take a look at the Madden forum sometime, and see how many people have a discrepancy in the speed of the game (Normal/Fast/Slow.) And just because someone would mess around with the speed slider that wouldn't necessarily equate to playing "cheese" ball, and even if that were to be the case, what would it be to you if you enjoy the game as is as oppose to someone who would want to play a game like that? You say this game is suppose to be sim (that word in it of itself is unverifiable), but this game's job is also to reach an audience beyond "simulation" players, which is why they have multiple difficulties appealing to different groups. Heck, while we're at it and since I just mentioned it, why not get rid of the easier difficulties, and force people to "learn" to really play the game. LOL @ this quote below: Thanks for disproving your whole point of your post, and aiding mine. Don't know why you waited until almost the very end though. There isn't a such thing as a one size fits all pair of shoes. More customization options, the better, PERIOD.

Until we see the list of adjustable sliders and experiment with them, we can't be certain whether it's for better or for worse. Sometimes less is more.

# 30 Epiffani @ 08/28/10 06:11 PM

A lot of you guys really sure know how to implore the usage of selective reading or reading whatever you want to read without understanding the grand scope of what's being said.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jano


	I understand what you're saying Epiffani you look at sliders as a customization tool. Which in a lot of cases they are. But I gotta say certain sliders will become useless as the game's mechanics improve or change for example last year the game had a slider for on ball physical defense. The higher it was the easier it was to for the AI to push up on you and make it harder for you to drive around them. Well now with the new RTP being introduced there's really no need for that slider because now if you want to be more physical you just have to manually get closer to the offensive player. Its sliders like this I think the devs are taking out because the game's mechanics have changed so now you don't need that artificial help. You can just manually do it yourself. Things like game speed, rebounding, on ball defense sliders are probably going to stay in because those things can always be something the user may not like. But in cases like the one I stated above I don't see why they should keep it in the game. Especially when the game now has mechanics that can make up for it.

How can you say you understand what I'm saying and then in the very same post, do exactly what everyone else is doing, which is trying to make a case for less customization options in the form of sliders (in a game that has lacked customization options already when compared to other games)? I'm well aware of what "Elite" is touting this year with defense, and giving control to the user. Live 10 was good in this area before the patch as well. The point in the instance you've given is if I or someone else don't like the on-ball defense for ANY reason whether it's too overpowering, not powerful enough (meaning that I find as a user that its too easy for me to get beat by the opponent), or whether it's something that involves the brand of on-ball D the CPU plays, I or someone else, should have options to tweak it to my/their liking (especially since we are talking about a pre-existing slider from last year);

if I'm someone actually wants some assistance from the A.I, then where does that leave them without this slider? As crazy as it sounds, and I'm not in agreement with these people, but I know people who preferred the defense post-patch in Live 10 as they felt it was too easy to break down the defense off the dribble. In fact, that was one of the biggest complaints about Live 10 initially, which was the on-ball defense and how it felt like as a user, you're were on an island. Then they ramped up the on ball D for the patch, and then the invisible walls and force fields start happening at an alarming rate, but the point is, these were two distinct groups of people who had different ideas of how on-ball defense should play out. Now with the introduction of real time physics technology, if the slider were to exist in the upcoming game, that shouldn't mean that if someone messes with that particular slider that more suction would happen, it should mean exactly what the slider says it means, which is an increase of physical and more aggressive play on the ball by a defender.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TUSS11


	Until we see the list of adjustable sliders and experiment with them, we can't be certain whether it's for better or for worse. Sometimes less is more.

This type of mentality (towards something like customization, more options, and control given to the users OFF the court no less) speaks volumes.... If you don't like a multitude, and as many customization options possible, no one would be forcing you to use ANY of the tools. You are free to play the game as is and without any tweaks at all.

I'm not even sure why I'm responding to you (the post below) after your last post in here involving this topic, but I'll oblige no less.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kingpnp


	see i've been playing basketball video games since the first one they came out with. so i have an idea of what i was like presliders. and i'm telling you the one thing i never liked about sliders was that you have people 2ksharing or ealocker rooming darn sliders. or putting them on the net for us to see. guess what. 80% of the people are looking for the most "Realistic/sim worthy" sliders. if thats the case that means 80% of the people would surely like if the game was pre shipped with the correct gameplay from the get go. i dont want to customize something that effects sim ball. when in reality thats what should be happening from the jump.

Ok, so what if you've been playing basketball games since their inception, so have I and I've perfectly grasp the idea/aura around sliders, and I know that no one is forcing you to use anything that you don't like. That goes for EA locker, 2k share, Finn's editor or whatever. And again, the word "sim" is quite possibly the most subjective (and overused, but I digress) terminology used in sports video games today. You ask several different people to define what the word "sim" means to them, and you'll get several different answers, and you know why? Because we are all looking for different things in an sports video game that is suppose to represent real life as WE and only WE see and deem them. We may in fact have some similarities as to what we are looking for in a sim product, but have different methods and outlooks on how to get that something accomplished, and that's where the great thing about customization/sliders come into play (as much as I don't like to use them). It allows you in many respects to define what "simulation" means to you, and how a "sim" should play.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kingpnp


	more sliders= more lazy devs, believe me. they use it as a fall back. they dont have to set everything perfectly or super close because YOu the user will figure it out. or maybe a pastapadre or some 2k guy will figure it out and everyone will use those sliders. those people are not on EA nor 2k payroll. why is it up to them to bring you the most realistic experience. its up to guys like ReAn from EA to do that. thats their job. less sliders=they have to get it right or all hell will break lose since we cant customize it.

Aforementioned already by me, if a developer have such a mentality that more sliders mean that they can become complacent with their OWN product, that's on them and not me. Their the ones that whom are risking their own credibility in the form of low scores from reviewers, and rankings on metacritic, not me. Completely out of my control if a developer has that mindset, and it will potentially do FAR more harm to them than it could ever do to me on bad pub, and word & mouth alone. Chances are, if I consider a game to be garbage, I wouldn't even bother with it, and it will go on the shelf to collect dust, changing my outlook on the series, and have me questioning the people behind the game credibility. Less sliders= potentially less satisfied consumers because "getting it right" is not decided in an collectivist manner.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kingpnp


	see i've been on these boards when live went thru its darkest moments lol. and fanboys(i use to be one but never over the top) would lie to themselves and say "its a great game......Once you fix the......SLIDERS" uhh NO. it should be a great game out the box. once people are giving that ability to make that excuse. thats one more sale EA got that they didnt deserve. one more sale is what keeps mediocrity apart of the product. cause until sales slip, change is hard to come by. even if devs want to do a much better job.

Are you serious with this? Just reading your posts in here just smells of elitism. I'm not even sure what particular game that you are talking about, but who are/were you to say that people were lying to themselves if they enjoyed a game after THEIR OWN, or SOMEONE ELSES edits? Who are you to dictate whether EA deserved a sell or not if they provided the tools for people to fix the game, so THEY (the people) can enjoy it? I know people here, no matter how good or "sim" the game is on default, that will still edit the game to get it to play even better in their opinion.

Quote:


	now do you understand why i'm not a sliders fan?

No I don't understand, and this is coming from someone who try NOT to use sliders. It's truly amazing to me how people can be all for control on the court, but be against it off of it

(look at all of the half-cook reasons that people have come up with in this thread to take more control away from the users off the court). Simply befuddling and amazing all at the same time...

# 31 TUSS11 @ 08/29/10 01:48 AM

Wait for the game bro.

# 32 Jano @ 08/29/10 02:41 AM

Yep that's all he can do. He's just basically destroyed any argument I've had against him, I know when to quit haha!

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