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NBA Elite 11 News Post

REAL PHYSICS IN NBA ELITE 11
Jul 30, 2010

Hello everyone,

My name is Geoff Harrower and I’m a Software Engineer working on EA Sports NBA ELITE 11. I’m very happy to have the opportunity to write a blog about the Real Physics engine we’ve developed this year. The term “Real Physics” can mean different things to different people, so my hope is that this blog gives you a very clear understanding of what we’re doing, why we’re doing it and ultimately what impact Real Physics will have on the game.

The physics in NBA ELITE 11 impacts several different areas of the game in very different ways. I’ll go into detail on each one separately.

No More Two Player Animations

The number one reason we wanted to move towards Real Physics was to eliminate the two player animations that were commonplace in NBA LIVE.

One of my biggest frustrations in playing last year’s game was how often you lost control over your player due to these two player animations.

Some common scenarios in NBA LIVE 10 include:

-when driving the lane you could get pulled into a two player dribble bump animation or a two player jostle animation
-when playing defense against someone you could get pulled into a beat animation through no fault of your own
-when playing defense you could get pulled into a dunk on animation before you had a chance to attempt a block
-when going up for a rebound you could get pulled into a two player animation where the player who would get the ball was already decided before the animation started

Although these animations looked really good while they were playing back, they did not respect your momentum on the court, did not respect user input and had a negative impact on the gameplay experience.

Our solution to this problem in NBA ELITE 11 was to remove all two player animations from the game completely, and replace them with systems that allowed the user full control over their character and where a physical simulation determined the outcome on the court.

Physical Defense

As soon you remove the two player animations from NBA LIVE, there is a very glaring hole in defense which makes it completely ineffective. It became clear that the gameplay engine was relying on the these two player animations to prevent the ball carrier from getting to the rim. We realized that we’d have to start from scratch and rebuild the defensive systems in the game from the ground up.

In order to accomplish this, we built a one on one mode for testing purposes. The goal was to make playing defense fun and effective when you were one on one with your opponent without taking away control from the ball carrier.


The first stage was to take a look at our collision system. Like many sports games it was built to keep players from passing through each other, and encouraged players to pass by each other when in collision.

Under the hood, there were collision cylinders anchored at the players position. Because of the shape, if the dribbler collided with the defender he would just slide around him. This made it pretty much impossible to stop the dribbler.

Our solution for NBA ELITE 11 was to completely change the collision system and introduce something that would allow the defender to stop the dribbler by positioning himself between his opponent and the basket.


I’ve been using an analogy to describe the changes which involves ping pong balls and a pop can.

Take two ping pong balls and put them on a table. Now move them around as if they were two players in the game, one on offense and one on defense. Try and stop the offensive ping pong ball from getting past the defensive one. Not so easy right? They just slide by each other.

Now replace the defensive ping pong ball with a pop can and do the same thing. It’s quite clear that with these collision shapes defense is much more effective.

Things are obviously much more complex in the game, but essentially we have built two “pop cans” for the defender which are positioned along the shoulders and hips respectively. The offensive player has a “ping pong ball” positioned at his chest and hips.

The result is a much more realistic and effective collision system built for playing defense. You really feel like you have a physical presence on the court and have the power to stop the dribbler dead in his tracks.

Locomotion

Effective physical play isn’t of any use if you don’t have enough control over your defensive player to stay between your man and the basket. That’s why we scrapped our old locomotion system and implemented something new that is driven entirely using physics.


What this means is that you’ll get a level of responsiveness like you’ve never experienced before in a basketball game. Because the player is a particle in our physics simulation with a mass and forces applied to him, what he does will always respect momentum and will have a very consistent feel. We’ve tuned the momentum to give you just the level of responsiveness you need to stay with your opponent if you concentrate and react quickly to what your opponent does.

The physics implementation also makes it easy to give different players a different feel based on their player ratings.

Steals, Block and Rebounds

As mentioned above, steals, blocks and rebounds were implemented (at least partially) using two player animations in last year’s version of NBA LIVE. In NBA ELITE 11 we leverage the physics system to give you something completely different.

The biggest difference is that we’re now layering dynamic, physics driven animations onto the player who’s performing these actions as opposed to playing a canned animation. This means that you can steal while you’re moving around (because the steal animation is layered only on the upper body), you can reach in a 360 degree volume around your player, and where your player is reaching to can change dynamically while the animations are playing back.

For steals, this means not losing control of your player while you perform the action. It also means we can use proper physics and collision detection to determine if you got the ball, what direction it will be deflected, and whether or not it was a foul. On offense, it means you really need to protect the ball at all times and position yourself accordingly if you don’t want to lose the ball.

For blocks and rebounds, it means the outcome is not determined before the animation is launched. Players can adjust mid air to counter a dunk adjust or react to a change in direction of the ball mid flight. The physics system also allows us to collide with players mid air and alter the outcome on the court dynamically based on the physics simulation. Bigger, stronger players will be less likely to get bumped off their flight path making them feel stronger in the game.

Releasing the ball to physics

In NBA ELITE 11 you’re going to see a lot more variety in what the ball does, and because so much of the game is simulated through physics you’ll get a much more emergent gameplay experience.

In previous years, when you were passing a ball you’d pick the reception animation first, and throw the ball to that animation. Passes were rarely deflected because the system for picking up a ball that had been released to physics wasn’t very reliable.

This year, the reception system has been overhauled with the goal of always being able to get to the ball in a realistic and responsive way. This will apply to passing/receiving, chasing down a loose ball and rebounding.

Because of this we are now free to release the ball into physics at any time, and the game will respond intelligently.

This means in NBA ELITE 11 you’ll see tips, deflections, missed rebounds, lost dribbles, dribbles bouncing off opponents if you don’t protect the ball. All of this simulated using real ball physics.

Opening up the gameplay this way has made things much more dynamic and unpredictable, just like real NBA basketball.

The Ugly Duckling

One thing I want to be very clear about is that we did not integrate Real Physics into NBA ELITE 11 as a gimmick or as eye candy. We were very deliberate about where we chose to apply physics and to what degree. Every step of the way our goal was to improve the gameplay experience and the feel of the game. At times our animation visual quality may have taken a slight hit in favor of a better feel or more dynamic response. This tradeoff is deliberate.

In a video, a two man mocap animation is always going to look better than a dynamic, physically driven animation because it can be presented in the exact same context in which it was captured. When things change and the situation is different every time, that’s where our system shines. Until you actually play the game and feel the controls and the way the game responds to physics you will not be able to appreciate the tradeoffs we’ve made.

My hope is that everyone who reads this blog will download the demo when it’s released and judge for themselves.

The Bottom Line

Integrating physics into NBA ELITE 11 has had a huge impact on the gameplay experience. The animation system is much more dynamic and responsive to both the physics system and the user’s input, defense has been made both fun and effective by giving control to the player and releasing the ball to physics has created a game with emergent behavior where anything can happen.

This combined with our new controls and the countless additional gameplay improvements the team has worked so hard on this year makes NBA ELITE 11 the most realistic, dynamic and responsive basketball game I have ever played.

And it’s really, really fun.

Source - NBA Elite 11 Blog

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Member Comments
# 21 Tha_Kid @ 07/31/10 12:33 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2kfanatic
REanimator, will the real physics affect how bad an injury is? Will it sometimes cause the player to lose the ball after a collision or something?
Injuries aren't determined through physics. That is as much an answer as we've gotten about injuries.
 
# 22 Rocboyz101 @ 07/31/10 12:39 AM
This was a good blog, nice and detailed..
 
# 23 richmo @ 07/31/10 01:04 AM
In regards to the player strength, like stated with mid-air collisions and the outcome based on the strength of the player, I'm assuming it applies to perimeter man-to-man defense as well? If I have Earl Boykins guarded by Chauncey Billups for example, will Billups make it harder to Earl to move around and especially get to the basket, without the use of pick and rolls? On the flipside, can bigger ballhandlers muscle smaller ball handlers beyond the perimeter?
 
# 24 myownsun @ 07/31/10 01:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bballdude17
sounds good
Agreed sound great! I cant wait for the demo.
 
# 25 scottyp180 @ 07/31/10 01:58 AM
This article got me excited and skeptical at the same time. The physics sound like they will really add realism to the game; however he basically told us that their animations will not look as good as 2ks. I understand what he is saying because watching a 2k game the animations play out very well and move realistically; however once you have the controller in your hand you can see how the animations limit the control of the user. I love that Elite gives the user more control, but I would hate if the animations make the players look lifeless. The article really stresses the advantage of physics over canned animations, clearly going at 2k, I just hope that they back their talk. Im more of a 2K fan, and will probably pick up 2k11, but i always give Live(Elite) a chance. Live 10 was the first Live in about 8 years that I considered getting so I am looking forward to trying out the demo for Elite.

Hey rEAnimator can you give us any clue as to when we will be able to play the demo?
 
# 26 wrigleyville33 @ 07/31/10 02:04 AM
Can't wait for the demo.
 
# 27 mrclutch @ 07/31/10 02:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wrigleyville33
Can't wait for the demo.
Ditto. Good blog. I was really afraid it was going to be about control gain.

Live has my hopes up. Let's hope they did some work to improve some of the game modes as well.
 
# 28 DGMikeBarker @ 07/31/10 06:27 AM
"Bigger, stronger players will be less likely to get bumped off their flight path making them feel stronger in the game"

I like
 
# 29 BDM313 @ 07/31/10 08:17 AM
Really Nice Blog Man, Elite Is Shaping To Be **** Yeah ill Be Buying Both Games But Its Like The More Info Elite Releases The More Excited I Get Like I Know What To Expect From 2K But Elite Is Bringing Alot Of Competition And Thats What I Like Alot.
 
# 30 Muzyk23 @ 07/31/10 10:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by rEAnimator
No worries, that's what demos are for.

My point was that a mocap animation is 100% true to real life. Absolutely perfect.

When you simulate physics, especially in a video game, it's not going to look 100% perfect.

So if you release a video of a two man move, a mocap animation is always going to look better than something that was simulated in a video game.

You can't look better than real life

But where a physically simulated system looks better is when you see it in many different situations, and when you feel the impact is has on the control of your character, because it adapts to the situation and is more organic. In this case a canned animation will feel stiff and repetitive.

My point was that it's really hard to get that across in a video, and we are not going to try and fool you by releasing videos of canned animations.

I think you have every right be skeptical. If you're going to check out the demo for yourself that's all anyone can ask.
so it means that every game with real time physics will never look perfect animation-wise?

my gripe is that previous iterations have had terrible animations even though they were mo-capped, so does it mean that with physics now nothing changed or got even worse? in my book EA sports basketball absolutely had to better the animations part of their titles as the lack of proper number of them kills the experience imo
 
# 31 FearlessKaz @ 07/31/10 11:45 AM
Good blog man. Appreciate the in-depthness of it.

I'm really looking forward to the new physics system. I just hope the trade off between animations isn't something that stands out.

Based off of Live's animations in the past, I'm just not sure animations are something that can be sacrificed when they were pretty weak to begin with.

We'll see though.
 
# 32 rEAnimator @ 07/31/10 01:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Muzyk23
so it means that every game with real time physics will never look perfect animation-wise?

my gripe is that previous iterations have had terrible animations even though they were mo-capped, so does it mean that with physics now nothing changed or got even worse? in my book EA sports basketball absolutely had to better the animations part of their titles as the lack of proper number of them kills the experience imo
Are you worried about the quality level of individual animations or the number of animations in the game?
 
# 33 dexvex @ 07/31/10 01:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by rEAnimator
Are you worried about the quality level of individual animations or the number of animations in the game?
I for one am more concerned with the latter. That is one of the trumps 2k has had for a while and while live has made significant gains in other areas there is still alot to be desired in the animation pile.....
 
# 34 Nokstar @ 07/31/10 01:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dexvex
I for one am more concerned with the latter. That is one of the trumps 2k has had for a while and while live has made significant gains in other areas there is still alot to be desired in the animation pile.....
Do you understand the more animation...the less control you have tho? Would u rather have more animations and less controll?
 
# 35 PH1LLYSFINEST13 @ 07/31/10 02:21 PM
I get both games every year. heres my question... Whats the difference between this real time physics and the one that 2k is trying to implement in their game? And what are the advantages if its a different engine?
 
# 36 krazyboy225 @ 07/31/10 02:39 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nokstar
Do you understand the more animation...the less control you have tho? Would u rather have more animations and less controll?
not quite true... the number of two player canned animations, the less control you have.. but having 1000 dunk animations as supposed to 100 does not reduce the amount of control you possess. Same thing with signature animations, giving d-will a different dribbling package from iverson does not reduce the amount of control you have but it does distinguish both players from each other.
 
# 37 dexvex @ 07/31/10 03:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nokstar
Do you understand the more animation...the less control you have tho? Would u rather have more animations and less control?
I have no idea about ea's animation system but in general that would be false. Its more like the longer the animation the less control. Think of it as a video tape. In 2k the reason you have so little control because when you pressed play(shot button) to say go for a layup you had to wait for the animation to play out. I still don't know alot about ea's system but I doubt ea is generating animation on the fly ala Euphoria and still using a "video tape" system so varying the animations shouldn't have an effect on the control.....
 
# 38 rEAnimator @ 07/31/10 03:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by krazyboy225
not quite true... the number of two player canned animations, the less control you have.. but having 1000 dunk animations as supposed to 100 does not reduce the amount of control you possess. Same thing with signature animations, giving d-will a different dribbling package from iverson does not reduce the amount of control you have but it does distinguish both players from each other.
This is correct.

Now, part of where the tradeoff comes in is in terms of variety.

(the numbers I'm about to use are in no way correct, I'm just using them to make a point)

Last year we may have had 50 rebound animations. Each one looks completely different, but there's not enough coverage to be able to catch the ball in every possible situation so you may have to warp the ball, and you'd be locked into the animation once it starts, making it impossible to change what you're doing if the ball is deflected.

This year, we may actually have 60 animations in the game, but they are used in a completely different way. We have many animations that look similar, but have subtle differences to meet the requirements of the physics system. We also have animations to support the collision system, and altering the players action while he's mid flight.

So technically we have more animations, but many of them have the same general look to them but have functional differences to support the physics system.

And because our animations are blended together, have IK applied to them, and are driven by physics, they are more reactive and technically look different every time.

But whether that difference reads as variety to you is a very subjective thing.

Makes answering questions about animation variety much more difficult than before.

I hope that makes sense.
 
# 39 mario_2324 @ 07/31/10 03:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by rEAnimator
This is correct.

Now, part of where the tradeoff comes in is in terms of variety.

(the numbers I'm about to use are in no way correct, I'm just using them to make a point)

Last year we may have had 50 rebound animations. Each one looks completely different, but there's not enough coverage to be able to catch the ball in every possible situation so you may have to warp the ball, and you'd be locked into the animation once it starts, making it impossible to change what you're doing if the ball is deflected.

This year, we may actually have 60 animations in the game, but they are used in a completely different way. We have many animations that look similar, but have subtle differences to meet the requirements of the physics system. We also have animations to support the collision system, and altering the players action while he's mid flight.

So technically we have more animations, but many of them have the same general look to them but have functional differences to support the physics system.

And because our animations are blended together, have IK applied to them, and are driven by physics, they are more reactive and technically look different every time.

But whether that difference reads as variety to you is a very subjective thing.

Makes answering questions about animation variety much more difficult than before.

I hope that makes sense.
Makes alot of since.....You may have a number of animations that may look the same but occur in a diff way due 2 physics and situation....hmmmm sounds good. I like the trade off
 
# 40 rEAnimator @ 07/31/10 03:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Young Murder
So signature moves would'nt be driven by physics?
No, signature moves use the same system as all the other moves.
 


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