NBA 2K15: Tweet From Scott O'Gallagher Claims 1-3-1 and Charge Cheese Eliminated

[Sundown]

Quote: Originally Posted by 23

I'm talking online period. 2k or no 2k. Many games have the same problem. Just like a hacker. Block one thing they'll keep trying no matter what measures you take.

They'll keep trying but the best games are less and less hack able and more and more balanced. The worst games have overpowering hacks that are never addressed.

And offline 2k with friends has the EXACT same problem as online, because most peoples' friends are not sim players. Fix the exploits, and the game improves offline and online. Which is exactly what the team seems to be doing.

[BlackSheep2910]

Quote: Originally Posted by JerzeyReign

Honestly, if you want to play for FUN - play your friends or offline. Online is for competition gamers, not sim gamers hoping to find the most perfect basketball game known to man. Can't fault online gamers for doing something that works - don't hate the player, hate the game.

Your getting it all twisted. Sim players want to be able to use realistic BASKETBALL strategies. We expect this from a game with NBA printed on the front cover.

Online players should fail miserably when applying unorthodox silly strategies you wouldnt even find in little league basketball. Why is the same cheese applicable threw multiple yrs of development (and continues into a new gen)? This is inexcusable.

[23]

Quote: Originally Posted by Sundown

They'll keep trying but the best games are less and less hack able and more and more balanced. The worst games have overpowering hacks that are never addressed. And offline 2k with friends has the EXACT same problem as online, because most peoples' friends are not sim players. Fix the exploits, and the game improves offline and online. Which is exactly what the team seems to be doing.

You keep saying that but I don't disagree with you. I just don't think you'll ever have that perfect game.

[DaBoyBk]

Quote: Originally Posted by Sundown

They'll keep trying but the best games are less and less hack able and more and more balanced. The worst games have overpowering hacks that are never addressed. And offline 2k with friends has the EXACT same problem as online, because most peoples' friends are not sim players. Fix the exploits, and the game improves offline and online. Which is exactly what the team seems to be doing.

U are right the best games tend to be more balanced with a solution to every problem. I just think its so hard for sports game since they have a smaller window to develop games compared to other genres. I think offline play has just as much cheesers if not more than online. The thing is online cheesers pick it up from other players & youtube & etc. But there is also a Sim community with leagues to be developed like here at OS that offline players have never experienced and wont know exists. Learning to run an offense properly and setting rules in place to combat the glitches and non sim play helps.

Quote: Originally Posted by 23

You keep saying that but I don't disagree with you. I just don't think you'll ever have that perfect game.

Will they ever have the perfect game no they wont. Only time you would see something close to perfect is when companies do nothing more to a game other than edit rosters from a year to year basis and make a game with new features and etc every other year or more. And that wont be happening anytime soon. So you are correct about that.

I actually have a few tips for 2k as both of you guys who seem to have good b-ball knowledge to help make 2k a better Sim experience. It sucks that Sim ballers like us have to suffer with some of the things going on in NBA 2k when playing a random individual. Better player feedback system for in game, lobbies and a couple of gameplay changes can help this. It sucks that gamers such as @23 dont want to play online due to the fact it sounds as if he has been turned off by the cheesey gameplay. Lets team up and discuss some of these things with the community and grab only the real internal issues for the current gameplay to improve on that instead of a new engine and help make this experience better for everyone. Online play is the present and the future but gamers shouldn't have to turn away from it do to some user doing non realistic things during gameplay.

[Sundown]

Quote: Originally Posted by 23

You keep saying that but I don't disagree with you. I just don't think you'll ever have that perfect game.

That's true, but It can always get better and closer to perfection. And it can get way better than now. The only way that happens is by not hiding from an honest evaluation of the game design or discounting how it's played 90% of the time competitively (especially when the game is about a competitive activity). It's encouraging that the dev team agrees and sees that as a core driving philosophy:

Shot fatigue to curb hero ball chuck cheese.

Shot fatigue in traffic to curb paint spam cheese.

Intentional foul controls to curb steal spam.

Removal of 1-3-1 as well as addressing its root problem.

Addressing back court charge cheese.

Reduction of zig-zag cheese.

Now if all of these fixes are well implemented, it changes my experience both online and off, with strangers and friends. Yes, new exploits may be found, but they likely/hopefully won't be as overpowering as these six have been for years. And the reason these improvements are being made is because 2K is evaluating their design honestly and not just blaming its users.

[Sundown]

Quote: Originally Posted by DaBoyBk

U are right the best games tend to be more balanced with a solution to every problem. I just think its so hard for sports game since they have a smaller window to develop games compared to other genres. I think offline play has just as much cheesers if not more than online. The thing is online cheesers pick it up from other players & youtube & etc. But there is also a Sim community with leagues to be developed like here at OS that offline players have never experienced and wont know exists.

Yeah there are definitely places and resources to play sim. It's just that friends aren't necessarily interested, because what they do works better and is easier. But they'll be interested in sim play as soon as they stop winning with cheese, or will at least subconsciously play sim without knowing.

Or they can just suck, which is a result I'm perfectly fine with. Lol.

[spankdatazz22]

Quote: Originally Posted by Sundown

Real basketball makes rule changes to keep the game fair, to combat "exploits", and to produce the desired gameplay. Sim basketball should be no different. And the more well crafted and balanced a game, the less exploits there are. Chess has no exploiters.

Chess has no exploiters? Neither does checkers. Or tic-tac-toe. These are games that are very linear in design and shouldn't be compared to a sports video game. Online players need to temper these expectations that a videogame can play "perfectly". Real life isn't perfect. No matter the sport, you see players of that sport try to skirt the rules to gain a competitive advantage.

[Sundown]

Quote: Originally Posted by spankdatazz22

Chess has no exploiters? Neither does checkers. Or tic-tac-toe. These are games that are very linear in design and shouldn't be compared to a sports video game. Online players need to temper these expectations that a videogame can play "perfectly". Real life isn't perfect. No matter the sport, you see players of that sport try to skirt the rules to gain a competitive advantage.

Chess isn't very linear at all. There is an almost infinite variety of possible moves that confound the most powerful computers.

Point is rules and mechanics in all games determine behavior. If the behavior is unwanted, the rules and mechanics need to change. Just as rules are adjusted in real sports.