Operation Sports at 2K Sports Part Two: The Misconceptions About Game Development

[nova91]

Oh please...2K17 is a bad game, period. Y'all can sugarcoat it, soft sell and white knight it all you want. 2K17 DID NOT live up the quality that 2K has established and quite frankly it has been diminishing for a while now. Just because we don't work in gaming doesn't mean we can't recognize when a game is bad; most of us have been playing video games for decades and most of us are sports games enthusiasts, but more importantly we're NBA basketball fans and this game, at times, does not even come close to resembling an NBA game at all when it comes down to oncourt gameplay. From a gamer aspect, loading times that take seemingly forever, game modes/features not working as advertised, poor servers etc are extremely frustrating. We know it's not easy and most of us aren't saying it is, but come on, this is getting ridiculous.

[psydefx]

i was incredibly disappointed with the overall quality of this year's game. it just seems incomplete and poorly tested. new gameplay features that were never properly implemented that ended up hurting the balance of the game, along with legacy issues like fast breaks and poor ai defense thatf for some reason went unaddressed. fundamental things like servers that don't work (i don't even play online) and ai ball handlers running out of bounds. 2k was clearly ahead of their skiis last year - i just hope they shape up and make a quality game come next year. already, a lot of people refuse to pre-order or buy on release until a fair amount of time has passed and things become clear. 2k just needs to get their **** right, and dirk needs to get a job in the promo department.

[BegBy]

It's good to see more people express discontent. Just because they made a video that basically shout outs OS and explains that they have awesome jobs (that they find rather difficult) shouldn't excuse this year's release.

It's a bad game from a simulation standpoint. Letting them know will hopefully push them to make a better game.

We know it's possible, as they have released better iterations in the past, so I doubt they couldn't get back to the standard we expect.

Next year will be the first NBA 2K title I haven't either pre ordered or bought first day since the very first game they released. Until I get confirmation from OS reviews that legacy issues are fixed and the overly physical gameplay and complete lack of physics are also fixed, I am done giving them my money. It's sad that I don't play a basketball game, and basically haven't in 2 years, but I refuse to give them any more money. I'd like to see more people go the same route because 2K will have no choice but to change.

[NateDogPack12]

All, this thread has generated some substantive and probative discussion, but let's keep it friendly. Tension has risen in the thread and snarky comments have been lodged. I don't want to intervene further. Thanks.

[ChaseB]

Quote: Originally Posted by Retropyro

Are you serious? If the game took 1 minute to load, I'd be very happy. I can't start this game without a minimum 10 minute wait just to get to the main menu. That is beyond ridiculous. I'm not alone, just go on the 2K Twitter support. Never mind that 2K support is an absolute joke, completely useless. How can you seriously say that something like this is OK? NBA 2K is the ONLY game with this problem. The post by BegBy below is spot on. And yes, I would pull engineers off others things, because if my consumers can't even get into the game in a reasonable time (again, we're not talking 1 minute here but 10, minimum) what use is there in fixing anything else. You don't construct a building with a flimsy foundation and put your best people to work on making the apartments look pretty.

Quote: Originally Posted by RainZ

Chase must have been talking about the "standard" load times when its not bugging out of like 1 min or 30 seconds. I doubt he meant the glitched load times of 10-15 minutes are acceptable.... Also, no way that is going to be allowed to happen next year lol. They would have seen the backlash no doubt and some a$$ would have been kicked about it...

Ahhhhh, sorry if I caused unneeded turmoil here. Retro, I thought you were just talking about loading into game, that is, like, from when you select your team to when you get on the court. I was saying that sort of loading can be hard to shorten etc. because of what I was describing -- what 2K has done in that department is rather dope overall. In terms of the game itself loading and bugs and all that, yeah no, it's not okay for it to take 10 minutes obviously. My fault for the confusion!

Quote: Originally Posted by BegBy

All these videos do is showcase that hiring people without experience is unsurprisingly, a bad idea. Hiring people with little to no experience and as a result producing less than standard (a metric set by them) product shouldn't be shocking to anyone. What's shocking is consumer acceptance of their "We're trying, but it's hard" statement. Every industry is filled with new talent/apprentices/greenhorns, etc, but they are also surrounded by experience as to not detract from primary goals. ........... Keep the less experienced staff on. Use their passion and basketball knowledge as it's not something to balk at. However, surround them with more people who can help translate their intangibles into actual code that makes the game good again. Or be transparent with the community and admit that 2K's focus has been and will be online modes that generate cash as opposed to NBA simulation basketball.

You walk your own comment back within your own post, and you have in follow-up posts as well. I know others harped on it as well, but this is a confusing line of thinking as you sort of try to play both sides here in a way that doesn't work (plus you don't really have much insight into who is actually on staff etc.) You say don't hire people with no experience, then say keep them on. But then you've also said surround them with better people and that you never said there weren't experienced people there etc. in another post. In short, I'm sort of perplexed what the beef you have here is beyond saying you think the game has stagnated (fine opinion to have) as your tips on how to fix it sort of go against each other. I guess what you're trying to say is have veterans around them to keep their desire to do good in check and focused, which is fine, but you really took a weird way to get there.

Quote: Originally Posted by BegBy

Next year will be the first NBA 2K title I haven't either pre ordered or bought first day since the very first game they released. Until I get confirmation from OS reviews that legacy issues are fixed and the overly physical gameplay and complete lack of physics are also fixed, I am done giving them my money. It's sad that I don't play a basketball game, and basically haven't in 2 years, but I refuse to give them any more money. I'd like to see more people go the same route because 2K will have no choice but to change.

I don't think you should pre-order a game even if you think 100 percent it's going to be dope. It just doesn't make much sense to me. Just buy it day one if you think you're going to like it, why pre-order? But hey, I agree with the physicality and physics stuff, I wrote a lot on them for the last version and a lot of it I still think holds up, and so a different article is linked in each word below:

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[Retropyro]

I think I've gotten tired trying to ask 2K support about, so I obviously didn't make it clear what I meant in my first post.

Honestly, I'm just fed up with the way 2K seems to brush off this kind of thing. They know what it is, hear from so many having the problem. But when you contact support, they play dumb. It's just very frustrating.

As people have said, just vote with your wallet. Sadly I will. I've never not bought a copy of NBA 2K as at it's core, I adore the game immensely. But the support or lack of the last few years, I just can't do it anymore.

While I do understand how complicated a process it is to create a game, especially one so deep, I think there is a disconnect the other way. I think many of these developers have forgotten what it's like to be the consumer.

[Black Bruce Wayne]

Quote: Originally Posted by nova91

Oh please...2K17 is a bad game, period. Y'all can sugarcoat it, soft sell and white knight it all you want. 2K17 DID NOT live up the quality that 2K has established and quite frankly it has been diminishing for a while now. Just because we don't work in gaming doesn't mean we can't recognize when a game is bad; most of us have been playing video games for decades and most of us are sports games enthusiasts, but more importantly we're NBA basketball fans and this game, at times, does not even come close to resembling an NBA game at all when it comes down to oncourt gameplay. From a gamer aspect, loading times that take seemingly forever, game modes/features not working as advertised, poor servers etc are extremely frustrating. We know it's not easy and most of us aren't saying it is, but come on, this is getting ridiculous.

Yet you keep buying the product and keep talking about a product you just said is bad. Why? Are you just trolling at this point? For what? If it is this bad as you say, then cut your ties and walk away. Why can't you do that I wonder...

[Black Bruce Wayne]

Quote: Originally Posted by BegBy

It's good to see more people express discontent. Just because they made a video that basically shout outs OS and explains that they have awesome jobs (that they find rather difficult) shouldn't excuse this year's release. It's a bad game from a simulation standpoint. Letting them know will hopefully push them to make a better game. We know it's possible, as they have released better iterations in the past, so I doubt they couldn't get back to the standard we expect. Next year will be the first NBA 2K title I haven't either pre ordered or bought first day since the very first game they released. Until I get confirmation from OS reviews that legacy issues are fixed and the overly physical gameplay and complete lack of physics are also fixed, I am done giving them my money. It's sad that I don't play a basketball game, and basically haven't in 2 years, but I refuse to give them any more money. I'd like to see more people go the same route because 2K will have no choice but to change.

I dont undertand the point of being here if you havent bought the game in two years. You dont add anything. And why would you like to see people go the same route? Everyone doesnt share your mindset. No offense, but tI dont understand guys like yourself and others, who continue to come to the forum for a product that they dont support or like anymore.

I've seen many of your posts and I get it. How long are you going to keep telling us the same thing over and over? Why not divorce yourself completely from 2K? Alot of us still like the game and like to have conversations with others who do. I've been critical and yes there are flaws, but you have completely denoucned the game. Thats fine but why still be here? I just dont understand that, especially when you dont even want to help.