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Sliders: I Don't Get It

I guess I just do not get it. Where does this incessant obsessive-compulsive need to fiddle with a bunch of sliders come from? Why are sliders mostly only in sports games and not other games? Why are sliders taken as seriously as politics and religion when it comes to some people?

Have you noticed the incessant obsessive-compulsive need sports gamers have when it comes to adjusting everything in their sports games; from the color of the fans’ shirts to the degree of bounce and carry on a fast green? I have, and I just do not get it. Indulge me if you will by reading this hypothetical Family Guy-like moment.

"OK, Mr. Arone, we are going to perform neurosurgery to remove that annoying brain tumor of yours. First, a few questions: To what degree would you like my hands to be shaking while performing this surgery on your delicate pea-sized brain? Zero percent would give me steady hands of steel, cool as a cucumber and 100 percent would make them shake more than Michael J. Fox on a roller-coaster."

Umm, hello McFly? I will just trust in the neurosurgeon’s ability and training that he will do his best, thank you very much. This is exactly my point when it comes to sliders in a sports game. I have not spent 10-plus years developing games, writing code, learning collision impact scenarios, and everything else that goes into a game that I know nothing about. So why on earth would I want to go behind the scenes and change the elements and physics of a game that the development team worked so hard to get just right?

Maybe that is the problem. Maybe sliders are a crutch -- an easy way out for developers. They only have to stack the bricks and it is up to the gamers to supply the mortar to make it solid. Is that what I do not understand? That sliders are a way to fine tune the intricacies of a sports game further than what the developers provide? Again however, I think it is a slippery slope of lackadaisical effort if developers consider sliders and user manipulation to be a part of the foundation of a game. Consider the hypothetical problem in Tiger Woods: While testing the game, it seems that the golf ball rolls too far based on the percentage strength of the putt. Due to sliders, developers choose not to touch the game engine knowing that the end-user will use the sliders to correct the issue. However, without sliders developers have to correct the issue in-house and in-game to make the physics of the golf ball realistic, accurate and reliable instead of depending on players to adjust sliders appropriately. How is the former a benefit to any of us? I do not get it.

Except for fine-tuning graphics and processing requirements (or something like aim assist in a FPS) you do not see too many sliders for other games. Why is that? I mean sure, there may be general difficulty level sliders such as easy, moderate, hard, and ludicrous. You do not, however, see sliders for the amount of damage a monster with an axe can do as opposed to the amount of damage a monster with a spear can do. You can not dial down the speed of monsters in an adventure game or mess with how high you can jump.

Why are we allowed to do this in a sports game? Perhaps because the "other" games are developed on a 2-5 year cycle; therefore, the developers have the time to address every nuance in the game and how it reacts to all other elements in the game. The yearly cycle of sports games must make this improbable if not impossible. So sliders came along to allow users to change the physics of the game and correct issues that were not addressed by the engineers -- while also adapting all of this to your difficulty level. "Other" games require you to adjust TO the difficulty level of the game rather than allowing you to adjust the level of the game via sliders. I do not get it.

Yes, I have opened the gates to hellfire and brimstone by writing an article about beloved sliders -- I realize that. Sliders are like politics and religion to sports gamers. In other words, there's no use debating or analyzing the subject because there is no solid foundation to base an argument. Like the sliders themselves, the topic is a continually fluid and personality-based conundrum of self-evaluations and preferences. There is no right or wrong when it comes to sliders. There is simply my way and your way, and your way is always wrong. Much like politics however, sliders need to be handled with an extreme amount of responsibility and observation. It is the sports gamer's responsibility to not be dependent and blinded by the sliders to the point where he or she only addresses the effects, instead of the causes.

Sliders are a shameful downward spiral of inadequacy. Developers use them to make programming easier, and sports gamers use them because they are there. Too lazy to put in the practice to excel in the game as it was designed, gamers slide the almighty sliders to adjust to their individual whims. They do not realize that if they were proud and held themselves accountable for their gaming that developers would no longer be able to use sliders as a development crutch.

But somewhere, at some time, sliders appeared mysteriously, and now they will remain while each side blames the other for the existence of sliders; neither side taking any steps to address the issue much less resolve it and admit culpability so that they can move past the point of needing the slider pacifier.

Nighty-night slider fanatics, I will leave the night-light on for you and sing you a lullaby while mumbling under my breath, "I do not get it."


Member Comments
# 1 adembroski @ 10/16/08 10:36 PM
Sliders appeared when developers realized they had another option to put in the users hands. I don't see why people who don't like them want to whine about them... don't use 'em! I will, and we'll both be happy.

As far as being a crutch... are you saying that in 1997, games were more realistic out of the box than they are now? Madden may have it's issues, but there are dozens of other examples of games that are peaking right now. Outside of American football and baseball, I don't remember a time when sports games were better.
 
# 2 allstar3970 @ 10/16/08 11:42 PM
i think you misunderstand how sliders are used.....sliders are used because out of the box the game is tuned to often be fun for the "average gamer" or 95% of the people who buy the game. This is often NOT realistic, but meant to be fast and arcade-like (especially in the case of say, NHL 09). So the developers give the other 5% (most here) the option to tune the game to their more realistic tastes. The reason why a game like say...Halo doesnt have a huge amount of sliders is because its not like any of us have experience fighting interstellar war so we can tune it right. We know how the sport is supposed to be; the developers dont set the defaults this way (i would assume on purpose...again for the masses, which is fine, they have to do what they have to do)

Horrible, completely uninformed article.
 
# 3 mgoblue @ 10/16/08 11:54 PM
I don't get how "slider gurus" can play 4 games and automatically know enough to tweak a billion sliders, play one more game and then tweak again. Every individual game has so many unique moments due to chance that you really can't get a good baseline without a crazy amount of games.

Feel free to use sliders, I just feel it's a never-ending game and you just keep being frustrated that it's "not perfect" and "only 1 slider change away". I sometimes wonder if the hardcore slider guys even have fun with games or if they're too busy counting all the little things and bitching.
 
# 4 Trevytrev11 @ 10/17/08 12:32 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mgoblue
I don't get how "slider gurus" can play 4 games and automatically know enough to tweak a billion sliders, play one more game and then tweak again. Every individual game has so many unique moments due to chance that you really can't get a good baseline without a crazy amount of games.

Feel free to use sliders, I just feel it's a never-ending game and you just keep being frustrated that it's "not perfect" and "only 1 slider change away". I sometimes wonder if the hardcore slider guys even have fun with games or if they're too busy counting all the little things and bitching.
It's because if you see their name enough times with sliders, you will just assume they are a guru. I love the fact that people have slider versions 2.1.0.1A....obviously if it took you this many versions to get them right, you didn't quite know what you were doing the first 50 times.

It's kind of like developers these days. They put out a set to get it out and then tweak it for a month until it's right instead of just waiting a month to put it out.
 
# 5 rom3 @ 10/17/08 09:49 AM
Sliders have been a great addition to sports games because it allows you to customize the game to your style and difficulty. Most people enjoy playing a game that is challenging and fits that skill level. If I have to set "house rules" to play a game against the CPU to make it competitive I am not going to be playing it very long without losing interest. In my opinion most games that use the sliders settings have done a very good job at creating games that allow the user to customize the game to a skill level that makes it enjoyable and fun.
 
# 6 militia23 @ 10/17/08 11:09 AM
Ok I have playing sport games for quite awhile. I found the sliders out of box were to easy. So I started playing with sliders and going online to find sets. The problem though is I can never get the game to my liking. So i spend all my time adjusting and readjusting. Which has slowly taken the fun out of playing. This years madden 09 has a great idea of having ai adjust to you. Needs work but it should bring the fun back to sports games. So hopefully this is the decline of sliders in sport games.
 
# 7 asu666 @ 10/17/08 11:54 AM
Is the point of this article that developers should strip even more options away from the people who purchase their games? Waste of space imo.
 
# 8 KG @ 10/17/08 12:56 PM
"Sliders are a shameful downward spiral of inadequacy. Developers use them to make programming easier, and sports gamers use them because they are there. Too lazy to put in the practice to excel in the game as it was designed, gamers slide the almighty sliders to adjust to their individual whims. They do not realize that if they were proud and held themselves accountable for their gaming that developers would no longer be able to use sliders as a development crutch. "

Yes and no. Sliders are the users ability to tailor the game to their unique playing style. The reason why they are so popular on OS is because most of us consider ourselves to be "sim" players so we're looking for the most realistic gaming experience. We use them to help make the game mirror it's real life counterparts.

As a guy who uses sliders I am 100% for companies putting them in. Without adaptive AI, games become stale and predictable. If a game has good sliders (NBA 2K/College Hoops/FIFA), you can tweak the way certain teams play to ensure that the gaming experience is unique to that team. If you play the Warriors in an NBA game and they play the same was at the Spurs then you have a major problem in my eyes.

I don't view them as the developers being lazy or as a crutch in any way. I applaud them for giving us the choice to customize our game. Hell, a lot of us want the ability to edit/customize everything.
 
# 9 DubTrey1 @ 10/17/08 01:14 PM
I love having the option myself. If you like the game out the box - then good for you, but I like having the option to set the game up to my liking. And if Madden 09 is any indication of this with the "My Skill" mess, then we all know one thing, it ain't goin away.....
 
# 10 Steven547 @ 10/17/08 02:11 PM
Sliders aren't a bad idea, but as one poster said, you can spend the entire time tweaking and not enjoying the game. Sometimes, too much of something is not a good thing. And, one can look at this in two ways: 1: User has the option to adjust the game to their liking...or 2: The developers have become lazy over the years and decided to just let us do most of the work now. It goes both ways. Personally, I get tired of constantly tweaking sliders because as someone posted, the game changes each time. I'd rather spend 3 hrs playing the games, then tweaking the sliders.
 
# 11 Purplepower @ 10/17/08 02:18 PM
What gets me also it that you have guys the have all of these Versions 2.0, 2.1, etc. How much time have they spent playing the game vs testing. Glad these people have time to do this, but with everyone having different stick skills, one persons results are different from the next. I'am sure it helps some. For my self, I had this system I changed the sliders for every team I played. Play against a great QB...the slider reflected that, each team was different, different game each time.

However, I'am glad they do have them...because no game is gonna be very good out of the box...its a game...not the NFL.
 
# 12 kbshowtime @ 10/17/08 02:55 PM
I'll keep it short.....I love that fact that there is sliders and seeing that theres only one NFL game I wish it had more options I can tweak to my likings......This article is a waste and if the author has a problem with sliders done use them but don't bitch just to hear yourself bitch.
 
# 13 markprior22 @ 10/17/08 03:54 PM
I think there have to be sliders in sports games if you want each user to have a chance to get somewhat realistic results. I'm 45 years old and don't have the dexterity of my 14 yr old son when it comes to using the controller. The options are 1) say that I suck and just don't buy the game because it obviously wouldn't be much fun or 2) have some sort of system available where I can tweak things to be closer to my skill level (without being stuck with predetermined levels that are always too easy or too hard).

Two things about sliders though:

First of all, I do agree that developers are using them to cover inadequacies. That obviously shouldn't be the intent.

Secondly, sliders should work as advertised. If there is a fumble slider, the player should fumble EVERY TIME on one extreme and NEVER on the other with variance in between. That would truly give a big window to allow the user to set up the game in the manner they wish to play. It only seems to make sense that the players would play right at their rating when the sliders are right in the middle. Honestly, I don't see what is so hard about that.
 
# 14 OU81206 @ 10/17/08 04:00 PM
This is the dumbest article I have ever read on OS.
 
# 15 rudyjuly2 @ 10/17/08 04:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by asu666
Is the point of this article that developers should strip even more options away from the people who purchase their games? Waste of space imo.
Exactly. The writer is obviously clueless. To assume we adjust sliders just to make it easier for ourselves is laughable. Everyone's tastes and skills are different. To assume we all neatly fit into each default difficulty level is a joke. One of my biggest complaints with NCAA this year is trying to get the cpu to run the ball better. I guess I should just live with that I suppose rather than adjust anything? Please. And I'm 36 and grew up without sliders. Sliders are a great thing and should never be removed.
 
# 16 fistofrage @ 10/17/08 04:28 PM
Have you watched Madden Nation?

This is why we need sliders. Default games are meant to be cheese festivals now and appeal to the masses. If you want to try to get a more sim like experience you have to use sliders.

What happens when the hardest level isn't hard enough? Use sliders.

Unfortunately it does lead to excessive compulsive disorder because there isn't enough time in a lifetime to test every single thing. I mean you could play a game or 2 that could be total anamolies and then if you try to change sliders based off that, you end up digging yourself a hole straight to slider hell.

Overall, I am glad there a re sliders especially now that the developers love "Wide Open" Gameplay.
 
# 17 Likwidkewl @ 10/17/08 04:39 PM
markprior22 is spot on. That is exactly how sliders should work.
 
# 18 nolan273 @ 10/17/08 04:56 PM
In my younger days (I'm 35), I thought that people who tweaked sliders were unskilled idiots trying to make the game easier. Over the past few years, may way of thinking has drastically changed. Sliders' in many cases, make the games more playable.

As one poster stated earlier, these games are set to the most "accessible" level when you buy them. Sim sports game are regularly set to arcade gameplay by default. Most sports fans/gamers want to play a game that's as close to the real thing as possible. Really, how much fun is it to blow out USC' s football team with Duke when you KNOW that would never happen or to get totally pasted by the New York Knicks?

Sliders are absolutely necessary. Default difficulties are either far too easy, extremely difficult (with a little cheese on top for the CPU) and in most instances, absolutely unrealistic.
 
# 19 SloeyEZ @ 10/17/08 05:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by asu666
Is the point of this article that developers should strip even more options away from the people who purchase their games? Waste of space imo.
After reading all the posts here, I'm quoting this one because I can answer this question. I was going to quote the post that said "This is the dumbest article I have ever read on OS." but that would have been too much fun.

First, I am Joey, the uninformed author of this article and I have no problem admitting that. The title of the article tells you, "I Don't Get It." Some of your posts were very informative and I appreciate that. Some of your posts were not so informative. lol.

I should tell you about my gaming background as that will also help you understand why I don't get sliders. I'm a sim freak. I've never been a fps or button mashing guy. For example. I pre-ordered Madden CE, went to the midnight party at my local GameCrazy and took home a 2 litre bottle of pepsi and a wee plush football. I have not taken the Madden 09 disk out of its bed once. Not one single time. I bought Madden CE for Head Coach. My comrades in the Head Coach forum know me quite well lol, and my distaste for sliders.

When I open a game, any game, I want the confidence of knowing that this is the best possible game the developers could have made. Now I realize that the "business" of gaming makes that a pipe-dream, yet I still dream.

Which leads me to ASU's question. He asked what the point of the article was. The point, actually the question I want answered is don't you feel like if there were not sliders, then the developers would be forced to make the game as realistic as possible before shipping it? That is what I worry about. That instead of putting the realism (and if I'm reading all your posts correctly THAT is why you change sliders, to make it more realistic, challenging) in our, the gamers hands, would not having sliders force the developers to make the near-perfect game?

I'm not a programmer. I don't want to have to spend the countless hours of "tweaking" sliders to make the game realistic and challenging. One of the other posts made a great point about the variances in sports games. There are too many variables in football especially, but I'm sure all sports, to even know what the "base-line" is. Then where are you? Do you have to change the sliders every time you play a different team like mentioned in another post? When does it end? Why do we have to do it in the first place?

That is what the point of the article is.

Flame on
 
# 20 cinders @ 10/17/08 06:14 PM
First, this is far from the worst article I've read on OS.

Second, I think you raise some very interesting points, but those points are perhaps presented in a way which (intentional or not) will get most sports gamers upset. Here's why I think most of the comments to your article are negative.

When the "next gen" of sports games were introduced they lacked the extreme customizability of the last generation of games. Players had come to expect that they could create the team or player or franchies of their dreams. Now, with next gen sports gaming just begining to recover, players are reluctant to give up any sort of customizability in their games. Systems like the "my skill" system are novel but ultimatly anger the diehards when they don't life up to the hype. When someone suggests that sliders are a "crutch" for developers, it deviates from the percieved notion of sliders as a feature for the more dedicated sports gamers.

I agree that one sould not have to spend hours of time tweeking sliders and gameplay just to make the game enjoyable, and for some games this has become a reality. But to take away sliders now would ostrasize the very people who give meaningful feedback to developers on games. You or I may not enjoy it, but it is the people who spend hours and hours tweeking sliders who perhaps know the games the best.

So I agree that this discussion is necessary and I understand your concerns, but persenting your arguments in a way which are clearly meant to incite riot is perhaps not the best way to get a level headed discussion started.
 

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