NBA 2K16 News Post

Take-Two Interactive & Visual Concepts Sued By Tattoo Artists

08:16 PM - February 1, 2016 by jfsolo

Some of the tattoos seen on LeBron James, Kobe Bryant, Kenyon Martin, DeAndre Jordan and Eric Bledsoe are getting Take-Two Interactive and Visual Concepts into some hot water. Based off of articles from ESPN (Darren Rovell) and The HollyWoodReporter (Eriq Gardner), the makers of the NBA 2K series are getting sued for $1.1 million, because Solid Oak Sketches claims the tattoos are their copyrighted work.

Quote:


	Worried that they might be party to a lawsuit, the NFL Players Association told players in 2014 that, in order for their tattoos to be represented on merchandise, including video games, they needed to get waivers from the artists.

This is one of the main reasons other companies don't put tattoos in their game. Getting permission from the tattoo artist can take quite a bit of time. The Madden team had to go through that process to get the tattoos for Colin Kaepernick (Madden NFL 15) and Odell Beckham, Jr. (Madden NFL 16) in the game.

Quote:


	In a demand letter to Take-Two before the lawsuit was filed, an attorney for the plaintiff took the $22,500 award to Escobedo, and using information about NBA 2K16 sales, calculated that the value for the eight tattoos should be $572,000. But there was also the matter that two of LeBron James tattoos were featured on the cover of the videogame. According to the letter, "Given that those two tattoos are 'the face' of the 2014 game, their marketing and promotion value is, conservatively, at least four times the value of the rest of the tattoos." Thus, the claimed value of using all of the tattoo designs in question allegedly equals $819,500. That tattoo design company offered a perpetual license for a fee of $1,144,000.

You can read the full complaint at The Hollywood Reporter.

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Member Comments

# 101 redsox4evur @ 02/02/16 08:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaseIH


	This is ridiculous, people will sue at the drop of a hat anymore. I hope they get a judge that is just as sick of stupid lawsuits as I am, and 2k ends up not having to pay. And no Im not a fanboy buy any means, as its not like this company probably dont have it coming to them in some form with some of the BS they try to feed people over the years. Its just wrong to sue, I think there are a few legit reasons to sue, but something like this is as ridiculous as suing McDonalds over their coffee hot.

If he does that. The tattoo artist will appeal the decision and win. Honestly he/she can't rule in favor of 2K on this one. Because there is already precedent that the tattoo artist wins a case like this. And any lawyer knows this already.

# 102 bcruise @ 02/02/16 08:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roadman


	EA has already been sued over this and lost. They didn't take their cause to the NFL. I'm sure 2k won't take this won't and it won't sniff Silver's desk. I'm sure his office has better things to do than participate in talks with VC about them being sued. So, now the artist are going after 2k and VC. Sucks for gamers, it is what is and there isn't anything anyone can do about it. It's a slam dunk case because of outcome that happened with EA.

I feel like this will hurt 2k a lot more from the customer perspective, given how much more skin shows in the basketball game as compared to football or baseball. It's going to be jarring if 2k follows suit (no pun intended) and removes them for fear of getting sued again. The floodgates are open. One suit might not be a dent in even 2k's VC sales (much less total profit), but if every NBA player's tattoo artist sees this and thinks they can make a quick buck too...

That said, having grown up in a generation were players were 2D sprites or barely a step above 3D stick figures, I'll manage somehow even if they get removed.

Edit: Actually, saying it'll hurt 2k more is a little short sighted...you can bet EA is watching this go down and planning accordingly with Live as well.

# 103 redsox4evur @ 02/02/16 08:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bcruise


	but if every NBA player's tattoo artist sees this and thinks they can make a quick buck too...

I doubt that will happen...this is only the 3rd or 4th case about this sort of issue in the last decade. You had the EA one, this one and then the guy that did Tyson's face tattoo suing Hangover and maybe one more.

# 104 roadman @ 02/02/16 09:51 PM

By law, it's a copyright infringement of the tattoo artist.

Since that is law, the tattoo artist decides if it's ok to be in the game, not the player.

Here's is an excerpt from the Madden issues with the same thing regarding tattoos:

http://www.polygon.com/2014/6/5/5782...lin-kaepernick

It really comes down to a piece of art asset here that could be [copyrighted], frankly, as we've learned over time," Graddy explained. This problem came to light last year, when a tattoo artist sued EA and now-retired NFL running back Ricky Williams for copyright infringement. Williams had appeared on the cover of EA's 2004 title NFL Street with tattoos that the artist had inked, and the individual accused EA of using his work without his permission. The artist later dropped the case. (Update: Bloomberg Businessweek reported that following that lawsuit, the NFLPA began advising players to obtain copyright permissions for their tattoos as a preventive measure.)

As it stands, EA will only use real tattoos if the athlete himself first goes out and secures the permission of the artists. That's exactly what Kaepernick did, because he "takes his tattoos as a personal self-expression that he wants represented in any product or marketing thing that he's a part of," said Graddy.

# 105 KingMansaMusa @ 02/02/16 10:00 PM

Just pay these guys and get over with it plain and simple.

# 106 Vni @ 02/02/16 10:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KingMansaMusa


	Just pay these guys and get over with it plain and simple.

Would you happen to be a tattoo artist by any chance ?

# 107 seanie719 @ 02/02/16 10:28 PM

[This year's post about this] "Who cares. I hope 2k has to pay" "I don't play 2k for tattoos"

[Next year's post about this] "2k is a joke. Where are the tattoos?"

# 108 24ct @ 02/02/16 10:33 PM

I don't understand why ppl think it's ridiculous for the tattoo artists to be suing over their property. It's their work. Sometimes they're custom drawing stuff. It's actual physical property. Not the players body but the artwork is. Nothing ridiculous about them suing imo. I'm not a lawyer but it's pretty clear this is copyright infringement to some degree.

# 109 coolcras7 @ 02/02/16 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KingMansaMusa


	Just pay these guys and get over with it plain and simple.

did you read how much he is asking for, and this is one artist imagine how much the price tag will be when every tattoo artist request the same.

# 110 redsox4evur @ 02/02/16 10:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by coolcras7


	did you read how much he is asking for, and this is one artist imagine how much the price tag will be when every tattoo artist request the same.

Did you read the thread? They are going to have to pay them anyways...

# 111 The 24th Letter @ 02/02/16 10:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 24ct


	I don't understand why ppl think it's ridiculous for the tattoo artists to be suing over their property. It's their work. Sometimes they're custom drawing stuff. It's actual physical property. Not the players body but the artwork is. Nothing ridiculous about them suing imo. I'm not a lawyer but it's pretty clear this is copyright infringement to some degree.

What I don't understand is why people are rooting for 2k to lose the case, like they're getting a cut of the tattoo artists payout....all it does is hurt us as the consumer...

Mentality around here is completely jacked up

# 112 coolcras7 @ 02/02/16 10:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redsox4evur


	Did you read the thread? They are going to have to pay them anyways...

I know they will have to settle, but the point still stand that he is requesting a percentage of their sales and a waiver of over a million dollars

# 113 KingMansaMusa @ 02/02/16 10:39 PM

Yes just pay them, this is a non issue in my book whether it's morally right or wrong.

# 114 coolcras7 @ 02/02/16 10:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The 24th Letter


	What I don't understand is why people are rooting for 2k to lose the case, like they're getting a cut of the tattoo artists payout....all it does is hurt us as the consumer... Mentality around here is completely jacked up

yeah, people have this mentality that 2k deserves to lose because of an issue they are having with the game, as if a smaller budget next year or a bunch of players that are not accurate to their real life counter part is a good thing.

# 115 KingMansaMusa @ 02/02/16 10:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by coolcras7


	yeah, people have this mentality that 2k deserves to lose because of an issue they are having with the game, as if a smaller budget next year or a bunch of players that are not accurate to their real life counter part is a good thing.

Come on, 2k will pay or come to some agreement with said parties and the players will continue to be accurately displayed in game, there's no need for theatrics or even really discussion. We already know the outcome. Business as usual.

# 116 coolcras7 @ 02/02/16 11:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KingMansaMusa


	Come on, 2k will pay or come to some agreement with said parties and the players will continue to be accurately displayed in game, there's no need for theatrics or even really discussion. We already know the outcome. Business as usual.

You do realize that people are jerks and will try to take advantage of this situation, we will be the ones who loses. Can you imagine like MSG, EA/2K buying the rights to Tattoos and it's only available on one of the games.

# 117 ksuttonjr76 @ 02/02/16 11:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 24ct


	I don't understand why ppl think it's ridiculous for the tattoo artists to be suing over their property. It's their work. Sometimes they're custom drawing stuff. It's actual physical property. Not the players body but the artwork is. Nothing ridiculous about them suing imo. I'm not a lawyer but it's pretty clear this is copyright infringement to some degree.

In my mind, it's not the artist's property. The artist wasn't the sole creator of the tattoo, because he would have gotten input from the customer/player. Music is non debatable who created the music. It's not debatable who writes a play, novel, short story, etc. It's not debatable who creates a fashion line.

To me, you would have to convince me that tattoo artist truly "owns" the tattoo before I can consider it a copyright infringement. I look at tattoo artists as providing a service in the realm of haircuts, make up, fingernails, landscaping, painting buildings, interior decorating, etc. Basically, if you need input from the customer to create it, then to me you can't "own" copyrights to the end product.

# 118 roadman @ 02/02/16 11:27 PM

If it's a tattoo artist original creative tattoo, then yes, a tattoo artist will want to be compensated for the original artwork that is being used in some other format.

After EA case went to court, the NFLPA demanded from now on that if they want their tattoos in the game, they need to track down the tattoo artist to sign a waiver form.

Let's just hope it doesn't go down that same road, but we've already seen a blueprint from the EA fallout with tattoo artist.

# 119 HowDareI @ 02/02/16 11:36 PM

I used to draw and do sketches and portraits and all that...
I WANTED people to see what I did in my class. I wanted exposure and recognition; therefore I SIGNED my name under each picture...as you do, so people knew it was my work...it was by me.

A tattoo artist is merely there to please their customer. I have some tats, I been through it before. You talk about an idea, maybe show something close to what you want and they bring some of their own flair to the table and once you both agree on the sketch the work begins...

What I'm saying is, if they wanted to be recognized for their own original ONE-TIME pieces they should be artists not tattoo-artists.
You're putting your work on someone's body for the world to see for the rest of their life. You changed them, you have walking artwork at that point. Take a picture if you need to brag; but I feel like a tattoo artist's main goal is to make the customer happy how they look. Not make money in any other way.

These are like the musicians who get signed and switch their style up completely. You know they were in it for the money not the love of the art.

I wouldn't give these guys a penny; they made their money already idc what any laws say. You know they want $$$ not recognition for their art. If it was solely recognition they'd ask for some credits in the game manual or something not a milli lol

# 120 Junior Moe @ 02/02/16 11:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The 24th Letter


	What I don't understand is why people are rooting for 2k to lose the case, like they're getting a cut of the tattoo artists payout....all it does is hurt us as the consumer... Mentality around here is completely jacked up

Yeah man. I agree that if 2K has infringed (which it looks like they have) that they need to pay up or come to some agreement. But some of the stuff being said and the sly glee some guys seem to have about this happening to 2K is crazy. I have seen pot shots taken at NBA 2K over small stuff on other forums while the same people play devils advocate for everything in the other game. It's lame and uncalled for.

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