Madden NFL 25 News Post

Will People Adjust to the Pocket in Next-Gen Madden?

10:33 AM - November 7, 2013 by RaychelSnr

RGIII is dangerous running the ball, but only because he is a rare talent.

One of the Madden franchises' most glaring issues in past versions of the game has been with its offensive and defensive line interaction.

The gamer never got a realistic representation of an incredibly important part of football in the line play. We ended up seeing the same two or three animations that didn�t portray any kind of realism.

Madden 25 on next generation systems is touting a new �War in the Trenches� feature which promises to not only give overhauled offensive/defensive line play, but more importantly, it promises to change the way we play the game.

Read More - Will People Adjust to the Pocket in Next-Gen Madden?

Game: Madden NFL 25Reader Score: 5/10 - Vote Now
Platform: PS3 / PS4 / Xbox 360 / Xbox OneVotes for game: 54 - View All

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# 41 CT Pitbull @ 11/07/13 03:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roadman


	Casuals should be able to adjust to a real pocket.

Agreed..... BUT this should read

"Casuals should be forced to adjust to a real pocket."....Why?

Because that's FOOTBALL!

# 42 roadman @ 11/07/13 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheBuddyHobbs


	If they were pushing for simulation as hard as you say then Rex would have never brought up tournament players when asked about bad snaps.

By the way, it was Clint that mentioned that part.

Just an FYI.

# 43 CT Pitbull @ 11/07/13 03:37 PM

The whole issue with tournament play and other nonsense should not even be brought up in development at Tiburon. You are making an NFL simulation game (supposedly). Not a head to head game loosely based on NFL football (which is what we have right now). I was excited about things until that interview when I heard the reasoning behind no bad snaps. "What if you are in a tournament for 100k you lose on a bad snap?". Give me a break. Things haven't changed there as much as they say they have. I don't hear Mike Wang saying that they've removed missed jump shots in NBA 2k.

---the above is why there should be a "sim" mode where its no holds barred anything can happen, bad snaps included along with any other zany outcome the game of football can create. "Arcade" mode could be for the tournaments and extra cheese casuals.

# 44 hanzsomehanz @ 11/07/13 03:37 PM

Its not a perfect pocket that I want to see hedged in every pass play.

The problem existing now is that linemen are programmed to step into their blocks on pass plays instead of dropping back and receiving the rush.

The linemen should be responding authentically (not proactively synced) to the defensive angles of pursuit as they retreat to create a hedge for the QB. Where we should see the average lineman (naturally) struggle is against the stunts and blitz.

Linemen with poor footwork should be plagued on the edges against quicker defenders. Linemen with poor footwork technique should also loose battles due to poor footing.

Imo, it is footwork that needs to be emphasised more in the trenches and pursuit paths by defenders. Poor footwork will negate any linemens ability to hold their ground no matter how strong they are.

If folks can still use a qb or kicker or punter in the trenches then we will know the system is still founded on the wrong functions.

Too much neuturing. They ought to give these men back their brass balls if we are to ever see a "war" in the trenches. Cut the patty-cake peace treaty that was established years back.

Sent from my SGH-I727R using Tapatalk

# 45 wordtobigbird @ 11/07/13 03:42 PM

They should take out fumbles. What if youre in a 100K tournament and your RB fumbles?!

# 46 xCeeTee @ 11/07/13 03:46 PM

This would improve everything with me, I hate being blitzed on every play whilst all of my recievers being stalked on every play. I actually think this might help me play!

# 47 hanzsomehanz @ 11/07/13 03:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wordtobigbird


	They should take out fumbles. What if youre in a 100K tournament and your RB fumbles?!

The list of random outcomes is undoubtedly long - I dont side w them regarding why botched snaps dont exist.

In this game alone I have lost control attempting thorws and tackles and catches and picks only to have the AI not respond or respond opposite to the command I am giving or especially so on tackling where its even worst: The computer literally takes position of my defender and I have absolutely no control over steering him - this is the bullcotti that needs to be cut out.

We will never see seemless animations for as long as we have warped assistance controls like hit stick, ball hawk and heet seaker. Nor will we have seemless user control for as long as these training wheels exist - never.

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# 48 wordtobigbird @ 11/07/13 04:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hanzsomehanz


	The list of random outcomes is undoubtedly long - I dont side w them regarding why botched snaps dont exist. In this game alone I have lost control attempting thorws and tackles and catches and picks only to have the AI not respond or respond opposite to the command I am giving or especially so on tackling where its even worst: The computer literally takes position of my defender and I have absolutely no control over steering him - this is the bullcotti that needs to be cut out. We will never see seemless animations for as long as we have warped assistance controls like hit stick, ball hawk and heet seaker. Nor will we have seemless user control for as long as these training wheels exist - never. Sent from my SGH-I727R using Tapatalk

Training wheels is right. I use to LOVE user picking. It was one of my favorite aspects. I use have people quit online after throwing too many interceptions because I'd be running around the middle of the field with a Safety. You had to get yourself into position and you had to time your jump but it made it rewarding imo because you can just as easily give up a huge play. Which I did many of times. They took away the human error. They shouldn't even call it a user pick anymore because it isn't. The CPU is doing everything for you.

# 49 Captain Obvious @ 11/07/13 07:34 PM

casuals play on rookie and pro, sims play on all pro and all madden. everyone will be happy

# 50 RexDEAFootball @ 11/07/13 08:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by unfriendlyghst


	IMO, This is just a graphical update and not a mechanical one. I think the pocket is being formed artificially and that it has no bearing on the gameplay.

I can assure all of you the new pocket collapse system has a direct and immediate impact on gameplay.

Here are a just a few of the ways it changes the game:

1) It is now critical to read blitzes pre-snap, as slide protection is now a big component of protecting yourself against the blitz.

2) With 5 man protection, you can only block 5 defenders. If they send 6, one will get through. This makes hot routing TE's and RB's in to block another key strategy in running an effective offense.

3) Understanding the concept of a 'hot read' receiver with a short curl, hitch or smoke screen route is often necessary against the blitz.

4) Less time in pocket means less time to go deep. Expect to adapt and hit your check down routes like shallow drags and RB's leaking out into the flat.

There are also huge upgrades in pass defense, making it more important than ever to make good reads.

Rookie and Pro are still pretty safe for the casual, but for everybody else the hope is that they change their play style and employ real football strategies to adapt to the change in direction.

# 51 TeeDogg @ 11/07/13 09:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RexDEAFootball


	I can assure all of you the new pocket collapse system has a direct and immediate impact on gameplay. Here are a just a few of the ways it changes the game: 1) It is now critical to read blitzes pre-snap, as slide protection is now a big component of protecting yourself against the blitz. 2) With 5 man protection, you can only block 5 defenders. If they send 6, one will get through. This makes hot routing TE's and RB's in to block another key strategy in running an effective offense. 3) Understanding the concept of a 'hot read' receiver with a short curl, hitch or smoke screen route is often necessary against the blitz. 4) Less time in pocket means less time to go deep. Expect to adapt and hit your check down routes like shallow drags and RB's leaking out into the flat. There are also huge upgrades in pass defense, making it more important than ever to make good reads. Rookie and Pro are still pretty safe for the casual, but for everybody else the hope is that they change their play style and employ real football strategies to adapt to the change in direction.

on madden CG the cpu A.I. has burned me when I blitz by throwing screens behind the blitz and into the flats/ I don't recall the cpu doing this before. I also love the A.I. for Fbs and RBs picking up the blitz when kept in to block. this was sorely missing for a long time. good job guys, I look forward to seeing you guys continue to implement your vision next Gen. it gets wild in here but some of us are seeing the results of your efforts, even on CG.

# 52 MontagueBall @ 11/07/13 10:49 PM

It's about time. But we'll have to see if this promise pans out. History hasn't shown that to be the case with 'realism' in Madden. If the casual gamer has problems, then good. Go find an arcade game to play and leave football to those that understand the game.

# 53 Sausage @ 11/08/13 01:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SA1NT401


	Honestly.... The pocket and DL/OL interaction is the ONLY thing I like. And I LOVE the fact the arcade crowd will probably HATE THE HELL OUT OF IT!!! ^ that makes me happy.... Seriously ... **** the casuals, the SIM crowd put madden on the map!!!

Same here about your comment on the "pocket", but I have a feeling its mainly cosmetic and it won't have any variety or effect any QBs laser accuracy and delivery to the magnetic hands of receivers and TEs. Hope I'm wrong for the sake of those of us who are tired of the same dog and pony show.

# 54 razorkaos @ 11/08/13 02:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by josef


	I think when you boot up the game, it should ask something like: "Are you a casual gamer? Or hardcore football simulation guy?" It would then be set for "Arcade" or "Sim." (obviously, you could change this setting at any time). And then the game should play VERY differently on the different settings. Arcade would have less penalties, be easier to pick up and play (default to Gameflow play calling), have a faster game speed, all players would have crazy end zone celebrations, there would be less injuries, etc, etc. "Sim" would have realistic # and occurrences of penalties and injuries, slower game speed, realistic pocket, more realistic stats, etc. etc. There is no reason they couldn't get the game to work for both audiences. They may even have this setting already (I haven't played Madden in a few years), but the difference b/w an "Arcade" type mode and "Sim" should be very noticeable.. so they could cater to both crowds.. that is my point. All that being said, I'm very excited for this year's Madden. I like some of the steps they've taken to try to improve the gameplay. [EDIT: Big FN Deal is right on. Beat me to it.]

There is a big problem here. Most casuals think they are hardcore, just because they play 300+ games a year, so they would choose the hardcore option. I see this from another perspective. I know its a different game, but the audience has more or less the same mindset. A massive part of the FIFA community believe they are hardcore FIFA players, including those players on the first 100 positions in the rakings and the guys who play the FIWC. But in reality, they keep playing with assisted controls, cheesing, exploiting the games flaws, and they often don't care about realism, cause most of them don't even know how the sport is. And the similarity can be extended to other games, like BF (cheaters everywhere), COD, NBA2K (3 pointers should not fall that easy, and people exploit it everytime) and why not, Madden. Like in FIFA, the so called hardcore players (not the real ones, i'm talking about the cheesers and AI exploiters) will keep abusing the QB sneak on the 1yd line that ALWAYS result in a TD, and every exploit or glitch they can.

If we had an option to make the game more sim or more arcade, as you said, believe me, a lot of people would choose the hardcore option, and they would get frustrated with the game, and guess what will happen? As they did with FIFA, they will storm the official forums with the old talk about how the game is broken and how they will never buy a Madden game again. And what the guys on EA will do? Yes, they will soften the game, we will see more "accessibility" and our dreams of a realistic game are gone.

# 55 kdenson1283 @ 11/08/13 03:37 AM

This is going to be an interesting experience. Madden 25, will be at it's best with this feature due to the fact that rolling out of the pocket with a DE on your trail will limit the pass on the run and those uncalled for INT's. No reason why, a QB should throw 5 picks in a game, and then still have 5 TDs in one game. Not Simulation football. 2 weeks until we get to find out. 1 week for you Playstation gurus.

# 56 TeeDogg @ 11/08/13 08:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CigarCityBandit


	Interesting comments...This is why Ive played Madden on Very Fast Game speed & Speed Threshold at 0 Since Madden 11. Forces you to Snap/Read/Throw. And pressures coming at the snap of the football. The new innovations are gonna make the game even better to me on my settings.

I don't play on fast but I love the lower speed threshold settings. It makes blitzes with DBs much more effective. If you don't pick up that blitzing corner he's gonna be on your arse.

# 57 TeeDogg @ 11/08/13 08:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jahswill


	The bottom line is EA needs to take a page from NBA 2K and implement different modes, casual, default and simulation. This is the only way to appease everyone! They could also throw in different lobbies for online play. This has been said on OS repeatedly!

Yes, and on top of that sliders and on/off options would handle any concerns about tourney players. Bad snaps - off. Holding - off, anything random let them dudes turn it off or set it to zero themselves.

Now to me bad snaps itself is not a big deal. But I would like to see high and low snaps where the qb has to reach. I'd also like to see roll out animations and more pocket manuevers mapped to the right stick along with the existing evade maneuvers.

# 58 SteelerSpartan @ 11/08/13 11:00 AM

If they would have included Tiered PlayCalling I would have believed that it was a lot more then just some window dressing.

It could still be an admirable effort though, but I would like to see it put through the test....

It probably still lacks the depth of animations and qb pursuit logic we want.....but at the very least I hope that they have it setup so that it adheres to the ratings....so that punters(Players with low ratings) are getting destroyed

# 59 jpdavis82 @ 11/08/13 11:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RexDEAFootball


	I can assure all of you the new pocket collapse system has a direct and immediate impact on gameplay. Here are a just a few of the ways it changes the game: 1) It is now critical to read blitzes pre-snap, as slide protection is now a big component of protecting yourself against the blitz. 2) With 5 man protection, you can only block 5 defenders. If they send 6, one will get through. This makes hot routing TE's and RB's in to block another key strategy in running an effective offense. 3) Understanding the concept of a 'hot read' receiver with a short curl, hitch or smoke screen route is often necessary against the blitz. 4) Less time in pocket means less time to go deep. Expect to adapt and hit your check down routes like shallow drags and RB's leaking out into the flat. There are also huge upgrades in pass defense, making it more important than ever to make good reads. Rookie and Pro are still pretty safe for the casual, but for everybody else the hope is that they change their play style and employ real football strategies to adapt to the change in direction.

Wow Rex actually responded on the forums. If THAT doesn't tell you he cares about what we think, then besides not seeing it in the game itself, I don't know how anyone could feel like the devs don't care what we say.

# 60 dghustla @ 11/08/13 11:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RexDEAFootball


	I can assure all of you the new pocket collapse system has a direct and immediate impact on gameplay. Here are a just a few of the ways it changes the game: 1) It is now critical to read blitzes pre-snap, as slide protection is now a big component of protecting yourself against the blitz. 2) With 5 man protection, you can only block 5 defenders. If they send 6, one will get through. This makes hot routing TE's and RB's in to block another key strategy in running an effective offense. 3) Understanding the concept of a 'hot read' receiver with a short curl, hitch or smoke screen route is often necessary against the blitz. 4) Less time in pocket means less time to go deep. Expect to adapt and hit your check down routes like shallow drags and RB's leaking out into the flat. There are also huge upgrades in pass defense, making it more important than ever to make good reads. Rookie and Pro are still pretty safe for the casual, but for everybody else the hope is that they change their play style and employ real football strategies to adapt to the change in direction.

can't wait to show a strong side blitz only to be sending heat from the weak side.

It will be nice to see some A gap blitz that isn't some nano cheese where the DT comes unblocked because someone is in spy.

Question: What happens if I only rush 5 they have a slide protect strong side but I send a weak side blitz and vice versa, does my guy have a chance to get through un blocked? Or will the Oline always pick up 5 man rushes?

2) Do you have any plans for impliment a delayed blitz option route. Simular to the HB block and release? I would like to see LBs be able to fake coverage at times and then blitz to confuse the QB.

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