I have also played the game and my experience was a little different. There are also people who have watched video's and say they spacing seems improved.
The problem is that in a real game spacing get's messed up all the time but people expect that. In a video game one guy doesn't do what you want ALL the time and we proclaim spacing is bad.
There are actual NBA sets where guys are not all exactly 15 feet apart. LOL basketball can be ugly sometimes.
Here is another issue IMO. Some people what the AI teammates always moving and always cutting and never standing still. They consider that great spacing.
Others want the AI constantly maintain 15 feet separation and let them create and play off of them.
These ideas are at odds with each other so one person's see's spacing and another person feels like hey there is not enough cutting for visa versa.
The system to create spacing is in there and it was adjustable when I played how i played it seemed to work nicely.
Also I'm sure there are just as many examples of good spacing that one could point out but if were wanting the AI to be perfect then there will always be (in this game anyway) examples where it could be better. That does not mean it has not been improved.
Now either they messed it up after I left LOL, or something else is going on.
Czar, firstly I just want to say.... HUGE fan of your work. Appreciate the acknowledgement.
Its hard to argue your points..... one thing that I did take from it was when you said real basketball can be ugly. I totally agree with this..... but I cant help but think about this highlighting human error. Human error does happen in the NBA, but I can't help but be sceptical about its existence coded into a video game.....then you said something about a system in there to allow for spacing to be created. This was very interesting to myself and perhaps a few others. Is this like what we have seen in previous versions? (I must admit I didn't play with those sorts of options as much as I should have). Or is this a new tweaking ability you speak of?
I suppose my preference would be (in the instance of Chalmers cutting into Anderson's attempt to post, for example) for less to happen. Sometimes I think less is more and I guess I would prefer to have the ability to control a cut (ala NBA 2K11's send a player to the basket ability) than to have it happen on its own and be out of my control......I guess that's my preference and I am just one guy though..... so fairs fair.
The other point about that would be, if it were a hard cutter, slasher who did it as opposed to Chalmers - surely his tendencies would see him ready to catch and shoot instead......
But you made a valid point about how these are only some instances I suppose.
I look forward to some of the insights - hopefully they will highlight a bit more of what's done. I don't dispute improvements have been made, I guess they just aren't as apparent in these vids as I would like....
Without going into specifics Da-Czar, have you played a next gen build ? And if so, did it really draw your attention besides graphics ? Again, dont need specifics, dot want you to get into trouble, as we will get them around octuber I guess.
Also, since you have been related to the development process, do the next gen consoles really enhance and ease the adding of more content ? like more tendencies, ratings, sliders, settings, animations, signature, playbooks, sounds, modes, etc ?
Momentarily, could we finally be in for just adding to the game instead of taking things out or doing exchanges, based solely on memory space (ram & hard drive) ? Given that the 2 next gen consoles are now featuring blue ray discs, more than quadruple the amount of ram and other features, one could guess 2K could really put more content, but leaving aside 1 year cycles and getting used to new technology, have they been/were (I assume they would eventually be) able to do so ?
Sorry for derailing the thread a bit and would understand if an answer cant be given due to the uncertainty surrounding the nature of my post.
I have, as you would imagine with Beluba trolling me I can't say much about it. They are still pushing current gen.
The dev's are definitely breathing a deep sigh of relief with the added headroom on next gen. There much fewer... in fact I don't recall hearing any of the usual questions or concerns about capacity it was all about what can they accomplish with the time they have.
Dudes were feeling creative. It just a matter of how they finish. Can they leave it in the over long enough ? Do they leave it in too long and burn it ? Do they over salt it ? Will they properly taste test it ?
All the ingredients were there is just a matter of how they cook it.
So this should be a really fun generation of games because I like were they decided to start from in year one. As with anything more time with any system is going to yield better results but your getting a full effort on both consoles this year. IMO.
What I played is at least 6-8 weeks old and that is plenty of time for things to change greatly in either direction.
Czar, firstly I just want to say.... HUGE fan of your work. Appreciate the acknowledgement.
Its hard to argue your points..... one thing that I did take from it was when you said real basketball can be ugly. I totally agree with this..... but I cant help but think about this highlighting human error. Human error does happen in the NBA, but I can't help but be sceptical about its existence coded into a video game.....then you said something about a system in there to allow for spacing to be created. This was very interesting to myself and perhaps a few others. Is this like what we have seen in previous versions? (I must admit I didn't play with those sorts of options as much as I should have). Or is this a new tweaking ability you speak of?
I suppose my preference would be (in the instance of Chalmers cutting into Anderson's attempt to post, for example) for less to happen. Sometimes I think less is more and I guess I would prefer to have the ability to control a cut (ala NBA 2K11's send a player to the basket ability) than to have it happen on its own and be out of my control......I guess that's my preference and I am just one guy though..... so fairs fair.
The other point about that would be, if it were a hard cutter, slasher who did it as opposed to Chalmers - surely his tendencies would see him ready to catch and shoot instead......
But you made a valid point about how these are only some instances I suppose.
I look forward to some of the insights - hopefully they will highlight a bit more of what's done. I don't dispute improvements have been made, I guess they just aren't as apparent in these vids as I would like....
First off thank you.
Secondly take every I say about this system with a grain of salt because I had a hand in bringing it in and I'm subject to thinking it's better than it actually is .
Until they release some information I can't go into it because it takes the thunder out of any dev insights (IF they do those) Or video's or whatever. But after they announce it I can talk about it and answer questions to the best of my ability.
This I can say, is that the spacing stuff is ALL new! That alone doesn't guarantee it works but it does guarantee that any problems you see will be new to this system, Not that those problems weren't in the old system they just might appear in new ways if that makes any sense ?
As for the bold part above I wouldn't say that its made to mimic ugly hoops or coded to do so. I would say though, that as a concept, IF any part of the system depended on user movement, and user movement was erratic, that might produce an ugly result.
And that is all I can prob say for now. There was a thread on spacing here on OS I used as my sounding board to flesh out the community desires for spacing. Reading that might give you more insight on at least the information that went into the creation of the system.
And again that doesn't mean it works worth a dam. LOL it just means it should LOL.
EDIT: this video Goffs found is much better in regards to spacing IMO and in this game they player actually played descent hoops. I think that correlation will remain constant.
Secondly take every I say about this system with a grain of salt because I had a hand in bringing it in and I'm subject to thinking it's better than it actually is .
Until they release some information I can't go into it because it takes the thunder out of any dev insights (IF they do those) Or video's or whatever. But after they announce it I can talk about it and answer questions to the best of my ability.
This I can say, is that the spacing stuff is ALL new! That alone doesn't guarantee it works but it does guarantee that any problems you see will be new to this system, Not that those problems weren't in the old system they just might appear in new ways if that makes any sense ?
As for the bold part above I wouldn't say that its made to mimic ugly hoops or coded to do so. I would say though, that as a concept, IF any part of the system depended on user movement, and user movement was erratic, that might produce an ugly result.
And that is all I can prob say for now. There was a thread on spacing here on OS I used as my sounding board to flesh out the community desires for spacing. Reading that might give you more insight on at least the information that went into the creation of the system.
And again that doesn't mean it works worth a dam. LOL it just means it should LOL.
EDIT: this video Goffs found is much better in regards to spacing IMO and in this game they player actually played descent hoops. I think that correlation will remain constant.
Thanks Czar, that vid (good find Goffs) is actually one I hadn't seen. This one was definitely one of the better user played vids and I've noticed the Euro vids seem crisper and cleaner than the Heat v Spurs vids....
The other area which I hear a lot about and don't see a world of is the help defense. I also read in DaWolf's hands on that it is very one dimensional still this year. I am dying for a second stage and third stage rotator to force extra passing.... I even recall NBA 2k8 having this to a degree and it was just beautiful to execute..... I'd like to see a rotate already where they need to be (pro-active rather than reactive) but I understand this may be asking for too much..... capacity etc. Next gen maybe?
Your points about next gen sound very exciting and one has to be optimistic about where sim ball can go with the new capacity of next gen development....
Anyhow, your points about a new system in place which you had input in sounds very interesting. Sounds like (if anything) the blow will be softened to a degree (if its not perfect). And perfection is a big demand (especially on current gen).
2K8 definitely had some of that because it was actually possible for an above average player like myself to use a team like the Kings and, with smart defense and the OP version of Ron Artest that was in that game, driving to the bucket could become a total non-option for opponents most of the time.
Small upgrades to the last years game compared to the full price they expect from us gamers to pay. I will not buy this game, as I could just continue to play 2K13 with the updated roster (custom), or go for the next-gen version (when I buy PS4) if it's going to be anything better, and I hope it will be. Maybe they have to put some extra effort on the next-gen version 'cause they got competition there, while on current-gen there is none.
Small upgrades to the last years game compared to the full price they expect from us gamers to pay. I will not buy this game, as I could just continue to play 2K13 with the updated roster (custom), or go for the next-gen version (when I buy PS4) if it's going to be anything better, and I hope it will be. Maybe they have to put some extra effort on the next-gen version 'cause they got competition there, while on current-gen there is none.
I totally understand if people plan on buying it only for next gen. Myself, come October 4th, when it's released here in Sweden, I know I couldn't keep myself away from buying the current gen version when I know there's a new NBA 2K out there.
I'll personally be getting it both for current gen and next.
i quit watching after the backcourt violation... ill wait for another gameplay vid >.>
Look at what the CPU is doing instead. Doesn't matter that much to me that the human player isn't very good. I'll be mostly playing offline Association so seeing how the CPU plays gives me a good sense of what we'll be facing once the game drops.
Me either...I appreciate nostalgia in sports....I'm up watching NBA tv classic games...the chi vs bos 2009 playoff game 6 epic overtime battles...a rookie D rose with an athletic bulls young bulls team...2K should do some modern classic teams like 08 celtics, 06 heat, 2011 Mavs, 09 lakers, 04 Pistons, 01 Lakers, 97 Heat, 98 Pacers
what a classic series that was, shaved about 3 years off my life expectancy. gordon vs allen, crazy shot after crazy shot.
can't wait until all these current gen games get released so we can start seeing the next gen media come out...thats all im interested in at this point...
appreciate it, Czar. And yes... I plan to keep the Pro Stick, as it is in 2K14, in tact for several years to come. With the obligatory annual refinements of course.
Hey Mike, how does NBA 2k13 advertise drose like this but he ends up like this now this for NBA 2k14 what's going on? Sample pic 1 sample pic 2 sample pic 3 I see your bulls profile pic at least get it into the next-generation version.
Do my eyes deceive me? I afraid to say it but the gameplay looks good. I won't mention the player models because I could care less. They can leave it the same, but the gameplay looks smooth, the passes are moving faster than the players (just like in real life), and the contact seems appropriate. 2k can have my $ twice (this gen, and next) if they get the gameplay right. On a side note, did ya'll see Labron's eyes at 7:47 LOL. He looked like a damn crack head.
One more thing I failed to mention, post game. It's too much swing man action going on with 2k13. I don't know if the post game got any attention but it could sure use some. Without a post game you can't simulate the nba. Also, I want to give the player the benefit of the doubt. I'm sure he wasn't purposely playing like a 3 yr old. He was probably nervous because he knew that recording wasn't permited.