NBA 2K14 News Post

The Tough Road of Being a Sports Developer, Featuring Mike Wang

06:48 PM - August 19, 2013 by Steve_OS

The grind of a yearly sports videogame can work the nerves in so many different ways. GameSpot has posted an interesting look behind the scenes with NBA 2K14 lead gameplay designer, Mike Wang. Make sure you give it a read, you might learn a few things.

Quote:


	Wang believes that developers given multiple years to fulfill their vision have an inherent advantage over those who work on a yearly schedule. "[Sports developers] don't have the liberty of a two- or three-year cycle," he said, "so you don't get to see these big jumps." Because there isn't an obvious technical leap from one entry of NBA 2K to the next, a layman may not recognize how dramatic the improvements are. But if you compare every second or third entry in the series--putting NBA2K on the same development timeline as other franchises--you can see a jump that's on par with its more respected peers. ..."If we're at that point where we feel we can't innovate any further, we can't take the game any further, then we shouldn't be here."

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Member Comments

# 41 VDusen04 @ 08/20/13 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RyanFitzmagic


	I'm not sure if you're saying this with a positive or negative connotation. I don't think 2K doing this would be bad-- it'd be faults that pretty much all of us already know exist. Plus, they're essentially doing the same thing (admitting shortcomings) when they release patches.

I was trying to portray it from a company's point of view. Even if it seems we all know about the shortcomings already, I think public acknowledgment and disclosure can sometimes be a little tricky. Again, I think 2K has seemed more willing to do this when it's an absolute issue affecting every single user in a clear fashion (online connectivity issues) or if they already have a fix coming down the pipeline (patches, new block system, etc.).

But if it's an issue they have no answer for, or something they don't plan on addressing for the time being, I can see how they might not want to publicly disclose their knowledge of said problem. As I said, as a consumer, I'd love full disclosure (ex: "Yes, we suck, we've totally ignored adding more retro jerseys. We could have, but we just didn't, and that's on us") but I'm trying to look at it from a little bit of a business perspective here.

# 42 BluFu @ 08/20/13 10:50 AM

"But if you compare every second or third entry in the series--putting NBA2K on the same development timeline as other franchises--you can see a jump that's on par with its more respected peers."

don't wanna mention association or anything but...

# 43 Boilerbuzz @ 08/20/13 11:17 AM

Reread my post man.

# 44 Boilerbuzz @ 08/20/13 12:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yellow86


	Seriously, you're a game developer, it's not that hard if you change it one step at a time instead of completely ignoring certain aspects and modes

Spoken like an industry veteran I assume? How do you know how hard anything is? And there is that "ignore" ranting again.

# 45 luda06 @ 08/20/13 12:20 PM

This is why sports games should just exist as one game (w updates) versus annualized alphas and betas with roster updates slapped on.

# 46 The 24th Letter @ 08/20/13 12:39 PM

Good article...

Some of these replies are embarrassing....

# 47 blues rocker @ 08/20/13 02:08 PM

i definitely appreciate the complexity of a 2k basketball game. to me, it is probably one of the more complex types of games to pull off successfully...the amount of player interaction and specific animations that go into it are staggering. if you look at the average video game, the amount of movements the characters do are usually pretty limited and simplified: run, punch, clim, shoot, etc. but in 2k basketball, there are so many nuanced movements and contextual animations that other games just don't have to deal with. every year i'm blown away by how well 2k can pull off that level of complexity in movement compared to the average video game.

# 48 cthurt @ 08/20/13 02:28 PM

Are Mike Wang and the crew working on both 2k14 for current and next gen, or does 2k have a different development team for both games??

# 49 Sundown @ 08/20/13 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boilerbuzz


	Sports games have to have the depth of an turn based strategy, the visual quality of a front line FPS, the character development of an RPG, and the balance of an RTS. Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 4

And the realism of a simulator.

# 50 Rensational14 @ 08/20/13 03:28 PM

How about things like

Correct team color accessoires
Saving slider sets
Correct jersey colors

# 51 RyanFitzmagic @ 08/20/13 07:32 PM

I think one of 2K's biggest problems (if you can call it that) is that they're amazing at inserting/building upon great, dynamic, complex features, but then the simplest of mechanics are removed (such as saving sliders) or never even seen in the games (changing headband colors, removing a Signature Skill after it's been assigned to a player, etc).

It's not even like I'm really mad about those exclusions. It's just that I know 2K is better than that. I'm more mystified than anything.

# 52 Sundown @ 08/20/13 07:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RyanFitzmagic


	I think one of 2K's biggest problems (if you can call it that) is that they're amazing at inserting/building upon great, dynamic, complex features, but then the simplest of mechanics are removed (such as saving sliders) or never even seen in the games (changing headband colors, removing a Signature Skill after it's been assigned to a player, etc). It's not even like I'm really mad about those exclusions. It's just that I know 2K is better than that. I'm more mystified than anything.

Also QA.

A ridiculously complex game with a variety of compelling gameplay mechanics and well engineered systems is often undermined by one or two oversights and exploits-- the weakest links the chain. As a result, it's arcade cheese online most of the time.

The limited number of patches they can put out before being charged on current gen consoles didn't help either. Hopefully that changes moving forward.

# 53 Melbournelad @ 08/20/13 11:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Goffs


	Wait, wait...you mean there are more than one person other than Wang and Jones working on the game?! Jeez it must get annoying for those guys.....Mike is pretty much the gameplay guru and I remember when he posted here and a Crewbie came in complaining about the lack of crew in game....now we are going to hear it from ASSociation guys....smh.... How about we wait about association news before saying they did nothing and if it remains the same THEN complain ffs....

Wait for Association news? I don't think you understand, in 4 years they have added a barebones TSC. All the issues which are just code related (meaning they should take less time than art related development) are still glaring. There was no mention of it in the features list. The obvious thing to assume would be that it still hasn't been fixed with no mention of it. You don't think 4 years (most likely 5) is being patient? Association players get left out EVERY year. We have been very patient.

# 54 Melbournelad @ 08/20/13 11:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boilerbuzz


	Jones and Wang's group don't do franchise mode. So why assume the groups work the same way and also assume nothing's been done with franchise. It is like you guys want to convince yourself to complain about something. Don't you get tired of operating on ignorance? Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 4

Who does work on "franchise" then? Convince yourself to complain about something? I have never complained about anything in 2k unlike most people until now. Because all the issues which you would of thought would of been fixed a year after they were apparent haven't been. Let alone new features. We just want the basic issues to at least be fixed. It's been like this since 2k9.

# 55 Sovartus @ 08/21/13 12:00 AM

After hanging out with the guys at 2K a couple of times, I honestly think they do excellent work with the small amount of time they have to produce a product. They have to prioritize the changes they want to make to gameplay figure out what they want to add to the feature list and hope they don't break something while they are doing it....

In one cycle, they just don't have the time to do "everything" we would like for them to do. Really, those little DVD's can only hold so much information and taking the time to patch stuff in, takes time away from the new dev cycle and costs big money to implement after release. Some of the decisions they make work and others... well, let's just say, they leave us saying... "What tha.... why did they waste time doing that?". At the end of the day, someone, somewhere had been crying for that "WTF? Feature" in the game and so they put it in. All the people, including Mike's group, have some big choices to make each year and have very little time to make it happen. Most of us are big critics until we see what it takes to make it all happen and the small margin for error it carries with it.

# 56 Melbournelad @ 08/21/13 12:02 AM

^ I absolutely understand what you are saying, but what about 4 (5?) cycles? Is that not enough time to fix an issue?

# 57 Sundown @ 08/21/13 12:20 AM

Association guys definitely have legit gripes. Especially when most of their concerns can be fixed with some logic and code and doesn't require art assets.

Most decent programmers with basketball knowledge could start making a dent in the mode in a relatively short amount of time I'd think.

# 58 Sovartus @ 08/21/13 12:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Melbournelad


	^ I absolutely understand what you are saying, but what about 4 (5?) cycles? Is that not enough time to fix an issue?

The issue you want fixed could be "low priority" in relation to demands and overall direction of the franchise.

# 59 Melbournelad @ 08/21/13 01:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sovartus


	The issue you want fixed could be "low priority" in relation to demands and overall direction of the franchise.

So association players should never see any association issues fixed? Because if it is still "low priority" after 4 years then it will never get fixed. How can a whole mode be "low priority" for 4 years in a row?

It's not just "one issue" in association. There are many of them and code related development should take much less time than art related development.

# 60 RyanFitzmagic @ 08/21/13 01:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Melbournelad


	It's not just "one issue" in association. There are many of them and code related development should take much less time than art related development.

I think that's kinda the point. If they worked to fix all those problems in one cycle, they might not be able to include new features that will attract the largest part of their fanbase.

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