NBA Live 14 Has Arrived, Post Your Impressions Here

[WTF]

Quote: Originally Posted by The Timber Wolf

I think it's great you and WTF and Nick are enjoying the game, but I find it hard to read that the "things it does wrong I don't value anyway". 1. No CPU fouls. The CPU basically never gets to the line. 2. All CPU big men are basically the same. All shoot ten foot Js and post up. 3. The CPU doesn't know it's behind with 20 seconds to go and dribbles the ball until the shot clock runs out and it loses. I've only listed three things, but there's probably 30 I could write. Those three are absolutely crucial for a realistic game against the CPU though and lack of late game AI is completely indefensible. I don't logically see how anyone could NOT value these things. I am glad Boiler is on here pointing these things out as people have a right to know before they buy the game.

I don't have a late game issue. I have not seen one instance of the AI not pushing the situation and trying to score where it makes sense. My last game, they were calling timeouts when I was up 7 with 1:30 left.

What they didnt do was call a timeout when I went on my runs through the game.

And the big men aren't playing the same either. But I digress. I will be told that they are.

Lastly, I play 12 minute quarters, last game combined, we shot 20 FTs. Granted, each team should be around there, but it is getting there. Needs improvement still yet, but I have no reason to believe that it won't get there.

[loadleft]

Quote: Originally Posted by The Timber Wolf

I think it's great you and WTF and Nick are enjoying the game, but I find it hard to read that the "things it does wrong I don't value anyway". 1. No CPU fouls. The CPU basically never gets to the line. 2. All CPU big men are basically the same. All shoot ten foot Js and post up. 3. The CPU doesn't know it's behind with 20 seconds to go and dribbles the ball until the shot clock runs out and it loses. I've only listed three things, but there's probably 30 I could write. Those three are absolutely crucial for a realistic game against the CPU though and lack of late game AI is completely indefensible. I don't logically see how anyone could NOT value these things. I am glad Boiler is on here pointing these things out as people have a right to know before they buy the game.

Of all the things you listed I only see the CPU foul problem regularly, and I've already mentioned that I'm waiting for the patch before I cry to loudly about that. At this point I'm guessing I've played 50+ games and I've seen the late clock glitch maybe 3-4 times so not an issue that I'd harp on. In my games big men play like they should. The one's with the skills to do what you've listed will do it, the others play defense and rebound as expected.

Do you play the game regularly? If so, how frequently do you see those issues? Again, for me the things you've listed are not frequent or even occasional issues for me so those aren't things that would make my list of things Live does poorly.

As a prospective buyer I would like to hear from someone with lots of experience with the game as opposed to someone that's played a few times and wrote it off. However even that experienced person must share my views on gameplay and that's why I've shared mine. Also I often compare the two games in my impressions and that allows the reader to have a contrast to my preferred way of doing things, that way he or she can form their own impression of my impression, instead of me stating my opinion as fact.

[Boilerbuzz]

Quote: Originally Posted by loadleft

Hey Boiler, First of all kudos for a great post and I can see your points. For the most part I can to some degree agree with you, except for it doesn't really bother me if someone gets effusive with the praise. I also see that there are those that go overboard in both forums. However, it is my opinion that the few people that do praise Live at OS don't fall in that category. I think they, like me, have found something in the game that promotes the things they like about basketball and they're wanting to other like minded people about it. For example, my opinion of Live is that the things it does wrong, it REALLY does them wrong but those are things I don't value in a basketball game anyway, so it is exciting to find that the things it does right are exactly the things I value most. That said I don't thing anyone would disagree, including the devs, that 2K is the Gold Standard, so by comparing the two, at least for me, it's to say hey here is one thing I like better about Live than 2K. In essence what I'm attempting to say when I compare them is: if only Live or 2K could do all the things that 2K does but do this one thing or two things like Live then you'd have my ideal game. For instance, for me, I don't like how it feels to play 2K. When I play I, apparently unlike most fans, want it to feel like I have had a brain transplant with the player I'm controlling, like I have his body and athletic gifts but my mind is controlling them. 2K, to me, feels more like watching that player from afar with a headset that I can speak into his ear and tell him what I want him to do, but sometimes he ignores me, and sometimes he just does what he wants to do without even waiting for me to make my suggestion. If you read my impression of Live I alluded to that and my fear that EA will cave into the fans and get more like 2K in that respect. In my opinion I already see aspects of Live that are in that direction that was never like that in Live before. Now even though I want that one thing to stay about Live that doesn't mean that I want Live to continue down this graphical path, or animation style, feature set, depth of control, and so much more. Do you follow what I'm saying? Here's the other thing if I must choose, I'd take that feeling of control over most of the other stuff but I'd love to have it all. Another thing is I feel 2K's gameflow/ game momentum system is a bit heavy handed. They do represent the ebbs and flow of a regular game but in real life you tend to see an action cause the swing in momentum, IMO 2K's system tends to swing the momentum inexplicably, like I'm shooting lights out then all of the sudden I am not, it didn't happen because the defense changed, or they put they're top defender on my hot shooter, or something else, it just goes that the same wide open shot I've been hitting at a 75% clip all of the sudden start sinking at a 30% clip. I think it is this that makes people think 2K is scripted because yes, 2K got the momentum swing part right but they left out the why it swung part. This is something else that is a high value aspect of the game for me and one I'd choose over all the other things. So if indeed there are only two things Live does better than 2K, but those two things are the most important thing in the videogame basketball world to me, I'd end up choosing Live over 2K. That actually is why I like Live. Finally I feel there is enough coverage of Live's shortcomings that I don't need to harp on that but I do want to speak on it's positives before the whole games gets a reboot and we end up with EA's NBA 2K. That's why I, and I suspect a few others harp on the good and try to get others to recognize those few things that are worthy of keeping too so that our voice says: hey it ain't all bad EA, you got a good start (foundation) now, the last I checked no one lives in a foundation so you got to build an entire house on top of this foundation. In other words, good start but you have so much further to go. Can you see my point of view Boiler?

Yes, I can see where you're coming from. All I will say is that too many times, people chose a game based on perceived fallacies of another. That's a bad reason to chose anything. People really should consider and judge Live as if there was no other game out there.

[Boilerbuzz]

Quote: Originally Posted by The Timber Wolf

I think it's great you and WTF and Nick are enjoying the game, but I find it hard to read that the "things it does wrong I don't value anyway". 1. No CPU fouls. The CPU basically never gets to the line. 2. All CPU big men are basically the same. All shoot ten foot Js and post up. 3. The CPU doesn't know it's behind with 20 seconds to go and dribbles the ball until the shot clock runs out and it loses. I've only listed three things, but there's probably 30 I could write. Those three are absolutely crucial for a realistic game against the CPU though and lack of late game AI is completely indefensible. I don't logically see how anyone could NOT value these things. I am glad Boiler is on here pointing these things out as people have a right to know before they buy the game.

The funny thing is that I'm not the one that points out most of those issues. I see them. Then, when I feel folks try to just brush them off, THAT is when and why I chime in.

[Boilerbuzz]

Quote: Originally Posted by loadleft

Of all the things you listed I only see the CPU foul problem regularly, and I've already mentioned that I'm waiting for the patch before I cry to loudly about that.

This is what I'm talking about. Why wait? If you see the issue, and don't speak, how will EA understand how prevalent or how important the issue is? If only two people speak up, it's a rare issue than isn't very important. If 10 people mention it, it gets more attention. No one is saying you need to troll. But speaking up isn't any harder than patting them on the back repeatedly saying how nice the foundation is...

Quote:

In my games big men play like they should. The one's with the skills to do what you've listed will do it, the others play defense and rebound as expected.

Not when Tyson Chandler is taking shots that he would never take. Many people can attest to this. Not when WTF is forced to double Deandre Jordan. Not when Andrea Bargnani tries to post up Jaokim Noah. Trying to spin baseline for a reverse layup.

Again, I'm only pointing out things that people have acknowledged that fly in the face of statements such as that.

[loadleft]

Quote: Originally Posted by Boilerbuzz

This is what I'm talking about. Why wait? If you see the issue, and don't speak, how will EA understand how prevalent or how important the issue is? If only two people speak up, it's a rare issue than isn't very important. If 10 people mention it, it gets more attention. No one is saying you need to troll. But speaking up isn't any harder than patting them on the back repeatedly saying how nice the foundation is... Not when Tyson Chandler is taking shots that he would never take. Many people can attest to this. Not when WTF is forced to double Deandre Jordan. Not when Andrea Bargnani tries to post up Jaokim Noah. Trying to spin baseline for a reverse layup. Again, I'm only pointing out things that people have acknowledged that fly in the face of statements such as that.

As far as the CPU foul problem, see my post in the patch thread and on the big men I can't complain about what I don't see. When I first started playing Live 14 I was having problems like that, well it was really everyone that went into the post torched me, whether it was bigmen or point guards but I took the time and just practiced post D until I figured out I was in the wrong positon, as I explained earlier. Once I got that figured out I don't see it anymore. As a matter of fact the only bigs that even attempt to post against me are the ones with skills. Like I got blew out by 22 by the Thunder a few games back but pretty much no one posted me up, it was Westbrook killing me from mid range.

In real life, if I'm Dwight Howard and I stand beside Joel Anthony (basically out of position) and watch him score, he'd light me up, right? So why should it be any different in a videogame? I can't speak to what anyone else is seeing but that's what solved my problem and I felt a sense of accomplishment. If EA dumbs the game down and I just automatically stick to whoever comes in my vicinity, how is that sim?

At any rate I appreciate the dialog man. Happy gaming!

[The Timber Wolf]

Quote: Originally Posted by loadleft

As far as the CPU foul problem, see my post in the patch thread and on the big men I can't complain about what I don't see. When I first started playing Live 14 I was having problems like that, well it was really everyone that went into the post torched me, whether it was bigmen or point guards but I took the time and just practiced post D until I figured out I was in the wrong positon, as I explained earlier. Once I got that figured out I don't see it anymore. As a matter of fact the only bigs that even attempt to post against me are the ones with skills. Like I got blew out by 22 by the Thunder a few games back but pretty much no one posted me up, it was Westbrook killing me from mid range. In real life, if I'm Dwight Howard and I stand beside Joel Anthony (basically out of position) and watch him score, he'd light me up, right? So why should it be any different in a videogame? I can't speak to what anyone else is seeing but that's what solved my problem and I felt a sense of accomplishment. If EA dumbs the game down and I just automatically stick to whoever comes in my vicinity, how is that sim? At any rate I appreciate the dialog man. Happy gaming!

This has been a great thread and it is genuinely cool to see you, WTF and Nick enjoy the game so much. Ultimately, that's all that matters. I have watched Nick's videos on youtube and the game looks good the way 'he' plays it. I think people obviously also have different settings (coach, tempo, defense etc) and that means different experiences. The defensive settings are very deep. Good thread. Glad to see people enjoying something so much. Patch + sliders and maybe more people will get on board.

[WTF]

Believe it or not, but when Rudy Gay or Derrick Williams gets matched up with Jordan on the block, that size difference is huge. When you have a cpu ai that recognizes this, and a passer with the skill of CP3, he will get the ball to them. I have no other option.

Or when I throw a zone defense out, and the cpu is picking me apart with a pass to the center of the zone, immediately hitting the low cutter.

The Clippers play a real good game. Blake flashes high post often and looks for Jordan rolling from a screen for the alley. Happens constantly in real life, happened often to me in my virtual season.

Everything isn't as black and white as you all are trying to make it seem.