First Madden NFL 25 Screenshot, First Details on Run Free Ball Carrier Feature

[SageInfinite]

I think the ai being sub par is just a result of them wanting this game to be a popular online heavy COD type game. Honestly I think this whole gen has suffered because of this focus on online. It's similar to the single player story being sub-par in shooters and action games. Devs don't bother advancing the ai because they figure people don't play it. Madden's AI should be sooooo much more advanced than it is. Just so many holes in the foundation of Madden. I can damn near call the same 1 or 2 plays all game on defense and be successful against the cpu.

[Big FN Deal]

Quote: Originally Posted by SageInfinite

I think the ai being sub par is just a result of them wanting this game to be a popular online heavy COD type game. Honestly I think this whole gen has suffered because of this focus on online. It's similar to the single player story being sub-par in shooters and action games. Devs don't bother advancing the ai because they figure people don't play it. Madden's AI should be sooooo much more advanced than it is. Just so many holes in the foundation of Madden. I can damn near call the same 1 or 2 plays all game on defense and be successful against the cpu.

This is that 1v1 POV I keep ranting about like a crazy person, lol. I just don't understand why anyone would take that approach for a team sport. Other gaming studios making sports sims aren't doing it, EA Tiburon is out in left field by themselves with this approach. The sad part is that this POV isn't even hidden or subtle, they come right out and say it. They state all the time that Madden is not made for CPU v CPU and I start ranting "WTF?, did everybody else just notice that" yet people just seem to shrug it off or even agree.

I try not to be a Richard because I enjoy posting on OS and don't want to get in trouble but it amazes me the way doing things as realistic as possible in a simulation video game is viewed as optional or a matter of opinion instead of base expectation. We talk about how other sports sims have implemented x the closet to real life to date, so Madden should follow suit until something better comes along and people start talking reckless about how Tiburon doesn't owe us anything, it's just a video game, stop complaining, no game is perfect, etc. I compare it to a history buff being dissatisfied with a Time-Life documentary about WWII, playing out like Saving Private Ryan and being treated like their expectations were too high for historical accuracy in a documentary, lol.

[tfer717]

Quote: Originally Posted by Big FN Deal

This is that 1v1 POV I keep ranting about like a crazy person, lol. I just don't understand why anyone would take that approach for a team sport. Other gaming studios making sports sims aren't doing it, EA Tiburon is out in left field by themselves with this approach. The sad part is that this POV isn't even hidden or subtle, they come right out and say it. They state all the time that Madden is not made for CPU v CPU and I start ranting "WTF?, did everybody else just notice that" yet people just seem to shrug it off or even agree. I try not to be a Richard because I enjoy posting on OS and don't want to get in trouble but it amazes me the way doing things as realistic as possible in a simulation video game is viewed as optional or a matter of opinion instead of base expectation. We talk about how other sports sims have implemented x the closet to real life to date, so Madden should follow suit until something better comes along and people start talking reckless about how Tiburon doesn't owe us anything, it's just a video game, stop complaining, no game is perfect, etc. I compare it to a history buff being dissatisfied with a Time-Life documentary about WWII, playing out like Saving Private Ryan and being treated like their expectations were too high for historical accuracy in a documentary, lol.

This is one of my biggest pet peeves. and it bothers the crap out of me. I hate when people shoot down our aspirations to have a TRUE simulation game. Why do we want a more simulation game?? cuz we know we've been robbed by ea since 2005. The football gaming industry would be unbelievable if there was still competition allowed. I hate the ignorance and HYPE machine that is EA. Listening to Vic Lugo talk in the ncaa 14 video made me so angry. Its all the same BS year after year.
Sure people may say 'relax, its a video game'...but each year i get invested in the thought that MAYBE this is the year it becomes more simulation...more realistic... only to get shot back down to reality after the first screenshot... the first video. ugh /rant.

i wouldn't get so angry, if games like NBA 2k, MLB the show and PES didn't exist. Because I am able to see the realism shown in other sport games, and it only infuriates me.

[SageInfinite]

Quote: Originally Posted by Big FN Deal

This is that 1v1 POV I keep ranting about like a crazy person, lol. I just don't understand why anyone would take that approach for a team sport. Other gaming studios making sports sims aren't doing it, EA Tiburon is out in left field by themselves with this approach. The sad part is that this POV isn't even hidden or subtle, they come right out and say it. They state all the time that Madden is not made for CPU v CPU and I start ranting "WTF?, did everybody else just notice that" yet people just seem to shrug it off or even agree. I try not to be a Richard because I enjoy posting on OS and don't want to get in trouble but it amazes me the way doing things as realistic as possible in a simulation video game is viewed as optional or a matter of opinion instead of base expectation. We talk about how other sports sims have implemented x the closet to real life to date, so Madden should follow suit until something better comes along and people start talking reckless about how Tiburon doesn't owe us anything, it's just a video game, stop complaining, no game is perfect, etc. I compare it to a history buff being dissatisfied with a Time-Life documentary about WWII, playing out like Saving Private Ryan and being treated like their expectations were too high for historical accuracy in a documentary, lol.

I totally feel you, but I mean was Madden ever trying to be the documentary? Were they ever trying to be a true sim? I know early on the tech didn't allow for ultra realism, so it was easier to come off like they were(adding 11 on 11, real teams, real players, ect.), but once we got closer it seems like it became more apparent that they weren't trying to be that documentary. I mean they saw the strides 2k was taking, and they didn't and still haven't added some of the sim elements.

I think acquiring the license is what made it worse, because if they weren't striving for it before, becoming the sole licensed football game, now it should have been the goal. To be that ultimate game to make you forget about everything else. All they've seem to do this gen was remind you of all those previous games, and even their own previous iterations. I hope this next gen they finally complete this goal that we expected.

[Big FN Deal]

Quote: Originally Posted by SageInfinite

I totally feel you, but I mean was Madden ever trying to be the documentary? Were they ever trying to be a true sim? I know early on the tech didn't allow for ultra realism, so it was easier to come off like they were(adding 11 on 11, real teams, real players, ect.), but once we got closer it seems like it became more apparent that they weren't trying to be that documentary. I mean they saw the strides 2k was taking, and they didn't and still haven't added some of the sim elements. I think acquiring the license is what made it worse, because if they weren't striving for it before, becoming the sole licensed football game, now it should have been the goal. To be that ultimate game to make you forget about everything else. All they've seem to do this gen was remind you of all those previous games, and even their own previous iterations. I hope this next gen they finally complete this goal that we expected.

I can dig that, in spite of all the talk game about authenticity Madden is what it is. What I can't understand though is those that treat others that want Madden to be as realistic as other sports sim video games as if we are the ones that have our priorities wrong. We ask "why can't Madden represent __ like this other video game does?" and someone replies "because Madden is a video game" and metaphorically drops the mic walks the hell off like they just crushed it, lol.

Spoiler

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[SageInfinite]

Quote: Originally Posted by Big FN Deal

I can dig that, in spite of all the talk game about authenticity Madden is what it is. What I can't understand though is those that treat others that want Madden to be as realistic as other sports sim video games as if we are the ones that have our priorities wrong. We ask "why can't Madden represent __ like this other video game does?" and someone replies "because Madden is a video game" and metaphorically drops the mic walks the hell off like they just crushed it, lol.

Yeah I hate that attitude, just admit you enjoy the game for what it is regardless of its MANY short comings. There isn't anything wrong with it, but don't make it seem like we're perfectionist and that this game is striving to be as realistic as possible, and that it's how you play it, because it's not.

[Trick13]

The aspect I do not understand about the "it is a video game" argument, is that the things the "sim" crowd wants could easily be "opt out" or "toggle" features.

Adaptive AI isn't fun for you, or you want a tourney where the user has to micro-manage every aspect of the game, just go into the menu and turn it off.

I think the XP system is an area where the reverse is true. You want a more "sim" experience, EA could allow you to customize it by turning on/off access to each attribute and the DEV upgrades. So, for me I would turn off the following attributes or ratings, meaning they would be blocked from progression and would not appear as an option within the progress player packages;
SPD
INJ
TGH
SPC
JMP
THP
and the DEV packages

Which would mean if I draft a QB with 86 THP, 77 INJ, 85 TGH and SLOW DEV then I just drafted an injury prone QB who will likely never develop into much more than a journeyman backup
Add in an option to turn off "scouting" DEV in a league with honest "sim' players who don't go looking for draft spoilers or "cheat sheets" and now you have a system that would truly allow for "simulated bust picks".

Allow the option to be like sliders, where we can choose options to "block" the CPU from progressing and maybe the community could find some settings that allow the CPU to be much better at progression, because they wouldn't be wasting all the XP on TGH.

Add another option to set the CPU teams so they can see DEV, have all the positional XP upgrades so that the CPU gets max points for goal accomplishment and now you have much tougher CPU teams to battle against, without having to set as many "house" rules to limit your own XP practices.

Custom rosters, playbooks should be be available as on/off options for online or offline CCMs.

EA has done that in the past - vision cone, auto-sprint, salary cap, trade deadline, injuries, pre-existing injuries, and so forth. So it seems to me they can (if they wish) offer up both sim and arcade aspects while allowing the users and leagues to find the balance of those aspects that fit best the experience they are looking for.

Anything less, at this point, is cruel and unusual punishment.

[roadman]

I still feel one of the issues is that EA markets the game as a sim and it's not. They are trying to appease everyone, including hard core, to sims, to tourney, to casual, all in one neat $65.00 package.

It's all about the marketing, though.