NBA 2K13 Gameplay Video Featuring Spurs vs. Thunder & All Star Weekend - 6/4 10PM EST

[kolanji]

Quote: Originally Posted by VDusen04

Not trying to beat this into the ground, but I wanted to affirm that the Kevin McHale clip posted a page or two earlier is in fact what we refer to as an "up-and-under" in the United States. I don't think it's a language thing but from the sound of it, it might be a cultural thing. I've personally never heard double pump layups (like the examples of Durant, Jordan and others you posted) being referred to as up-and-unders. For me, that'd be like calling a slam dunk a "jump throw". If you break it down, I suppose they really are just jumping and throwing, but that's never what we'd call it. So in terms of the topic at hand, the tendency we're referring to is a player's likelihood of pulling a Kevin McHale, where they dribble, stop, pump-fake, pivot, step through, and shoot.

hey its cool we came to a good understanding....when we practice here in belize am a point guard 6'2" in the IBS league( no nothing close to the nba but its fun and competitive and i like it) here in belize and during workouts we break up depending on our position to practice up and unders.... whether from the post for post players mid air up and unders( double clutch, some reverses )and as u guys call it flick flick....

i wasnt being specific like u guys when u spoke about up and upders as just the post version .in nba 2k i was being collective and packaging all the animations from post up to mid air to flick flick up and unders...
so now when i was being specific i would call the up and under out I.E. ...post up "up and under" and so on.

u see we use the term literally while u guys only refer to the post up version to be an up and under only....we call out the version of the up and under whcih just simply means to go up with the ball and down and up again.to elude shot blockers out stretched arms and to create contact and try to get to the FT line.....
unlike the NBA we play mostly zones and there is no 3 defensive in the keys(i guess this is why ballers outside the Us tend to be decent shooters,cause the paint is always guarded and compact) so ur always faced with a defender in the paint so i guess we specialized mostly on the term and branch off according to the version....so yes i understand u guys perspective and i respect that....
so to wrap this up all i was saying was that 2k has a lot of, and i used my term here:" up and under "versions ranging from the post to the mid air and "flick flick" and i just wished they would strike a balance according to who does it in nba 2k13 and not just the "flick flick" version

edith: http://www.youth-basketball-tips.com/up-and-under.html
this alone shows that its just not us here from the caribbean use the term literally and not just to refer to the post up version as being the up and under

[VDusen04]

Quote: Originally Posted by kolanji

hey its cool we came to a good understanding....when we practice here in belize am a point guard 6'2" in the IBS league( no nothing close to the nba but its fun and competitive and i like it) here in belize and during workouts we break up depending on our position to practice up and unders.... whether from the post for post players mid air up and unders( double clutch, some reverses )and as u guys call it flick flick.... i wasnt being specific like u guys when u spoke about up and upders as just the post version .in nba 2k i was being collective and packaging all the animations from post up to mid air to flick flick up and unders... so now when i was being specific i would call the up and under out I.E. ...post up "up and under" and so on. u see we use the term literally while u guys only refer to the post up version to be an up and under only....we call out the version of the up and under whcih just simply means to go up with the ball and down and up again.to elude shot blockers out stretched arms and to create contact and try to get to the FT line..... unlike the NBA we play mostly zones and there is no 3 defensive in the keys(i guess this is why ballers outside the Us tend to be decent shooters,cause the paint is always guarded and compact) so ur always faced with a defender in the paint so i guess we specialized mostly on the term and branch off according to the version....so yes i understand u guys perspective and i respect that.... so to wrap this up all i was saying was that 2k has a lot of, and i used my term here:" up and under "versions ranging from the post to the mid air and "flick flick" and i just wished they would strike a balance according to who does it in nba 2k13 and not just the "flick flick" version edith: http://www.youth-basketball-tips.com/up-and-under.html this alone shows that its just not us here from the caribbean use the term literally and not just to refer to the post up version as being the up and under

Right, what we're saying is in NBA 2K, up-and-under tendency is not referring to double-clutch or double-pump mid-air shots. It's only referring to the traditional McHale version, because that's what up-and-under means here in terms of basketball diction (and most elsewhere).

With respect, it seems you are making sweeping generalizations of the knowledge of other posters because their terminology differs from yours, or because you assume they have not played at a level as high as yours. In fact, the NBA is one of the few outlets in the United States that does not allow all forms of zone defense. Both college and high school basketball in the US allow all forms of zone, just as your region does, so to make an assumption that all Americans must be poor shooters because you believe there not to be zone defenses is relatively short-sighted.

Finally, regarding the youth basketball link, I wouldn't call that a particularly reliable website. It could have just as well been thrown together by you or me. That is literally the only other place in my life I've seen a double-pump layup referred to as an up-and-under. It is by no means a norm here.

Anyway, to get to the point, knowing what we're referring to by "up-and-under" (a pump fake, pivot and shot a la Kevin McHale) how frequent do you believe it should occur during a game in 2K13 for a player with 99 tendency?

[morningstar777]

I really can't believe there is a 3+ page discussion on up & unders, we might not even see it in the game.

[kolanji]

Quote: Originally Posted by VDusen04

Right, what we're saying is in NBA 2K, up-and-under tendency is not referring to double-clutch or double-pump mid-air shots. It's only referring to the traditional McHale version, because that's what up-and-under means here in terms of basketball diction (and most elsewhere). With respect, it seems you are making sweeping generalizations of the knowledge of other posters because their terminology differs from yours, or because you assume they have not played at a level as high as yours. In fact, the NBA is one of the few outlets in the United States that does not allow all forms of zone defense. Both college and high school basketball in the US allow all forms of zone, just as your region does, so to make an assumption that all Americans must be poor shooters because you believe there not to be zone defenses is relatively short-sighted. Finally, regarding the youth basketball link, I wouldn't call that a particularly reliable website. It could have just as well been thrown together by you or me. That is literally the only other place in my life I've seen a double-pump layup referred to as an up-and-under. It is by no means a norm here. Anyway, to get to the point, knowing what we're referring to by "up-and-under" (a pump fake, pivot and shot a la Kevin McHale) how frequent do you believe it should occur during a game in 2K13 for a player with 99 tendency?

ok cool i think u misconstrue my post i mean no offense to u guys and am definitely not insinuating that we r better shooters nor did i try to eject me playing ball gives me leverage to try and replace nobody opinion or understanding with my own..i was just sharing mine..is this not what OS is about? sharing about sports and sports video games...again my apologies if anybody i mean anybody was offended by my post


to answer ur question i think that is not how often the AI does it to me with a rating of 99...but a matter of WHO does it and whether or not a defensive tool is properly in place to stop and balance the offensive/defensive game come nba 2k13....but i do think that blocking/charging needs to be addressed first cause positioning is critical in stopping moves of this nature properly


edit: oh and my link was not to say i was right but just to show that its not my sole injections of what and up and under is but just to show that Belize is not alone nor am i when i just try to enlighten u of why or how come i have derived to the point of reference to my understanding of what it is....u say tom-a-to i say tom-ahh-to

[VDusen04]

Quote: Originally Posted by kolanji

to answer ur question i think that is not how often the AI does it to me with a rating of 99...but a matter of WHO does it and whether or not a defensive tool is properly in place to stop and balance the offensive/defensive game come nba 2k13....but i do think that blocking/charging needs to be addressed first cause positioning is critical in stopping moves of this nature properly

A lot of true points there, particularly regarding the blocking and charges. Regarding the up-and-unders though, I have trouble even answering the question myself (the one originally posed by Beluba). I think it was mentioned the up-and-under would be interrupt-able this year, which is a great start. So I guess now my question would be, who should be doing up-and-unders and at that point, how often should they be doing them? In 2K12 it seems many guards use the stop, pump-fake, pivot, and step-through as their primary mode of attack on a dribble drive.

[RyanFitzmagic]

As I said before, with a 99 tendency, they should be doing it basically every time they touch the ball or attempt a shot. It's always good to have the highest setting be TOO high so then we can find a middle ground much more easily.

[B-Wills]

Guitar Hero controls? Really 2k?

Everything else looks good though, I know this is an early build and I'm positive 2k won't disappoint with the gameplay aspect. Don't know what's goin on with the dunk contest though lol

[kolanji]

Quote: Originally Posted by VDusen04

A lot of true points there, particularly regarding the blocking and charges. Regarding the up-and-underst though, I have trouble even answering the question myself (the one originally posed by Beluba). I think it was mentioned the up-and-under would be interrupt-able this year, which is a great start. So I guess now my question would be, who should be doing up-and-unders and at that point, how often should they be doing them? In 2K12 it seems many guards use the stop, pump-fake, pivot, and step-through as their primary mode of attack on a dribble drive.

100% with u on that post
defense really took a hit outside post up defending, hard to stay in front of a player on the perimeter,so i see why 2k had the bump back animations a lot in previous versions of nba 2k
how often should they do them?u ponder ...am thinking the same thing but i also dont mind seeing from guy who love doing it often in a game as long as u have to chance to defend it properly...but now if i see Perkins doing it or Joel Anthony then that will annoy the hell outta me