PLAYER TENDENCY & Coach profiles !

[balage76]

Hi !

I think one of the most important thing (besides setting the coach profiles) to improve the CPU midrange game, that we have to change the individual player tendencies.

Set only the global tendency sliders aren't the way. This is not enough. The "substance" is in the individual player tendency.

I play some test game, and CPU shots more from mid range, when I change the individual player mindrange tendency to a higher level, and set the close shots lower.

I know, Nogster has a very good tendency "list". I try this, but I think, some things need to be change.

He gives to star players good mid range values, but I think, other players has low mid range value. (Bosh, Lebron ,etc has 85-99, it's O.K) I think we need to increase mid range tendencies of all players, who shots from mid range so much in real life. The values are better between 80-99. Who doesn't score much from mid, 60-80 is the best value. To Bigs, who doesn't shot from mid, the best value is 0. (These are Youngns values ! )

First question ! Are these values good ? (It's Youngns values, this is my base)
(G-SF with many mid shot --> set it 95,stars 99.
G-SF with less mid --> 80
PF-C who shots some mid shots---> 60
Dirk --> 99
Bigs, who don't shoot ---> 0

Close:
G-SF: not too much inside scoring --> set it to 10
G-SF: many inside points --> 20-40
Bigs: not many inside shots --> 20-35
Bigs: many inside score --> 35-60(max)

Attack basket:
attack basket many times -->75-99 (Lebron, Kobe, Wade)
don't attack ---> between 40-60
50%-50% --> 60-75

Guys ! Change the player tendencies same like these, and test it !


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(For example: In Nogster tendency Willie Green has just 55 mid range tendency. I think it needs to increase this to 75-80. He shots so many mid range in a real game. )

Besides this, we have to lower the close shot a little bit, prevent the PiP problem.

I'm on the PC, I think it's not different from xbox or PS. There are some differences, but not in player tendencies.

I try Nogsters tendencies, and CPU attack the basket everytime. Than I lower the close tend, increase the mid, and players shots, more from midrange.


If I'm wrong, that Nogsters mid range tendencies needs to increase, tell me.

I tried this, and with the change (increase the mid tendencies), I saw the difference.

It's important: NOGSTER !!! If I use your player tendencies and coach profiles, I need to use your sliders ? Becuase I use a slider, based on Youngns slider.

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I follow Youngn's individual player tendency values (see in his slider topic, on the last pages).
But I need others opinion of this. Maybe you guys, should test it. Play on Nogsters, than increase the mid tend, and play again. I think, you'll see the difference.

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With these words, I DON'T SAY, THAT NOGSTERS TENDENCIES aren't good. Most of people say, this is the best, and I respect Nogster very much. He is one of the guy, who makes this sh*t 2k9 better and better. So I really appreciate all of your work Nogster. It's true, I'm play on PC, but your opinions, your findings helps the PC players also !!

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And another thing: please find the best coaching profile settings:

mainly:
- fast break (it needs to lower a little bit, because in a real NBA game there are not SO many fastbreak. On default, there are many many fastbreaks)

- crash boards (on default, CPU is a rebound king)

- Run plays (I set this low, around 10-20. I realize, that on low values, CPU doesn't make so many assists. IN a real game, when a team score 100 point, there are about 25 ast. Run Plays on higher level, CPU team has 30+ assist. It's not realistic.) But we have to find the balance, 10 is very low, but 50 is so high, I think.

- Attack Basket ( If I set this to 60, will the CPU does more PiP ? )


So the reason I made this topic:

"COLLECT" THE BEST values of individual player tendencies in one place.

and

"Find" the effects of each coaching profiles (run plays, crash boards, attack basket) What happenes, when I set it to high, and what happens, when I decrease it to lower level.



I know there are so many playing style, Users have different style, but if users defense are GOOD, and you don't make so many mistakes in your defense, CPU have to shot more from midrange.



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Set USERs coaching profiles Defensive pressure to 0 is important. It makes more space between the defender and the ballhandler, and CPU can take more midshots.

But, I have one more question: if my def pressure is 0, CPU players shot many 3pts, because they have "big" space.
What can I do ? In Coaching/double/presssure take the good 3pt shooters tight ? But wit h this, they won't shoot many from midrange.

Or set the user def pressure in coach profiles to around 8. I saw some improvement, my players defense nearer.

We have to find the balance !!!

[Jukeman]

yup, I agree with the player tendencies as I do sumthin similar myself...it only make sense to raise jump shooters mid range and lower their close range becuz the game is so catered to inside shots...to keep sim stats realistic you would have to definitly lower some other tendencies aswhile...

[RAZRr1275]

Quote: Originally Posted by juk34man

yup, I agree with the player tendencies as I do sumthin similar myself...it only make sense to raise jump shooters mid range and lower their close range becuz the game is so catered to inside shots...to keep sim stats realistic you would have to definitly lower some other tendencies aswhile...

I'm really interested to see your new sliders and what kind of adjustments you do to the tendencies and coach profiles. Any chance of something coming this week?

[Jukeman]

Quote: Originally Posted by RAZRr1275

I'm really interested to see your new sliders and what kind of adjustments you do to the tendencies and coach profiles. Any chance of something coming this week?

I'll try, most likely I won't post the player tendencies, the OP and youngn are pretty much on the same page with me as far as player tendencies goes...I'm still using nogsters tho, I just edit them for even more great results

[RAZRr1275]

Quote: Originally Posted by juk34man

I'll try, most likely I won't post the player tendencies, the OP and youngn are pretty much on the same page with me as far as player tendencies goes...I'm still using nogsters tho, I just edit them for even more great results

Okay just sliders and coach profiles would be fine. Just post up a short guide on how your tendencies work. I'm really looking forward to it.

[balage76]

Man !

I "discovered" some things

In order:
I try nogsters sliders with his player tendencies and coach profiles.

The first quarter was awesome. There are some midrange shots, good actions. So near every part of the game was realistic. My defense was good. In the 2nd quarter it was the same. But in the 3rd I lost the game. Raptors lead about 15-20.

So this was good !


BUT: my Deffense Pressure set to 0.

I think it's NO GOOD ! Because with 0, the CPU players can shoot easy threepointers.

I gave a try, set the def press to 14. It was better. Defenders were nearer to ballhandler, and they can't shoot easy threes. We have to find the balance, because we want the CPU to shoot from mid, but we don't want so many 3s.
WHAT'S THE GOOD VALUE on DEF PRESSURE ? Or we have to change the on ball defense or some other sliders to solve this ?



Another thing:

As I said, I use nogster sliders, and his player tendencies.
After the first test game, I edit the players midrange shooting to higher level. (As Youngns made. I wrote it in my 1st post. Bosh 95, Calderon 85, Parker 80, etc,etc)
And I start a new game with this changes.
And what happened ?

No big difference, as with nogsters mid range tendency values.

I don't know the reason.


I SAY IT 1000 times, that the USERS DEFENSE SOLVES THE CPUs MID RANGE GAME. If users play good defense, CPU score less PiP, and shot more from midrange. We can use hundreds of different sliders, to find the best, but the defense is the most important. This effects the opponents mid game.

So as I played this test game, my defense was so bad. I found out, that I had to see, what the CPU team does against a good defense. So I switch the contol to "center", and leave the CPU to control my team. So it was a CPU vs. CPU game. I just wanted to see, how play the Raptors play against good defense.

Because when I play defense, and I make a mistake, CPU punish me. Always ! When I switch to my PF, and stand just 1 seconds, and not follow the CPU offensive player, the opponent PG pass the ball inside to opponent PF, and he score an easy point. From every defensive mistake, taken by the user, means an easy point by the CPU.
So 2k9 is a very good game, because if you play **** defense, you are punished, like in real life.


SO: what I saw, when my team (76ers) controlled by the CPU against the CPU raptors team ?


I saw, that Raptors shot many-many mid shots !!! It was very realistic. Bosh, Calderon, Bargnani, Parker shot from midrange. Because there were not so much mistake on defense.

So when you play good (super!) defense, CPU takes not too many inside shots.



I tested another thing:

I lowered the global take midrange slider tendency by the CPU. It was on 100 but I took it to 30.
And CPU shots nearly nothing from mid.


It shows, that CPU "Take Mid sliders" needs to set to near 100. We know that, so it's not new.


And I say, that Nogsters sliders are better than youngns. I was a fan of youngns sliders, but when I played today with nogsters, I had a better gameplay.

Main difference of the 2 sliders is: the defensive awereness. Nogster took it to 100. With this setting, I see more def rebounds by my team, cpu has less offensive. It was realistic.

But I don't know the real effects of the defensive awereness. ???



One more thing:

Nogster set the fastbreak slider in the cpu coach profiles to around 40.
When I set this to 40 and using youngns sliders, cpu make so many fastbreaks, which is not realistic.

What is behind this ? Is some connection between the def awereness and fastbreak ? (My teammates go back earlier, and prevent cpus fastbreaks ? )

Another thing I love in nogster sliders: the speed. I'm on PC, and it was great. When I use the turbo, players run as in real life.


At the end of this long "letter" I say that Nogsters tendencies works with his sliders. Am I right ?

And WE HAVE TO PLAY SUPER DEFENSE TO PREVENT CPUs EASY LAYUPS.

[Jukeman]

if you lower on ball D you can keep the D pressure around the default settings...I have on ball D at 0 and defenders are not glued to the ball anymore, there is alot of space for mid range game, also bowens still will play tight D and shooters will still get D up...the down side of having on ball D at 0 is that it will be super easy to ISO your way to the hoop, hence why I have ball handling at 0 also

[balage76]

Quote: Originally Posted by juk34man

if you lower on ball D you can keep the D pressure around the default settings...I have on ball D at 0 and defenders are not glued to the ball anymore, there is alot of space for mid range game, also bowens still will play tight D and shooters will still get D up...the down side of having on ball D at 0 is that it will be super easy to ISO your way to the hoop, hence why I have ball handling at 0 also

And find a mid-solution ? -->

On Ball def to 30, Def press 30. Around this values. So because of the on ball D on 30 we can defend the isomotion moves better, than set it to 0.
And set Def press from default 50 to lowest value. Around 20-30.



Now, I have On Ball D on 50, Def press on 0, sometimes 15-20 to test what's better 0 or low values like 10-15.


I I lower On Ball D, and increase def press ? I try this.


Oh, with the settings you mentioned, are you using coaching-double/pressures ? (Tight, deny,sag off options on your opponents ? OR just the on ball 0 def press default ?)