NBA 2K16 Player Ratings - Top Rated Point Guards (UPDATED)

[Sundown]

Quote: Originally Posted by joenuts83

my point exactly. who is the only PG to win in Oracle from the east in the regular season. all while destroying chef curry with a jimmyless bulls team. what point guard went 4 and 0 against lowry and 3 and 1 against wall. he beat Lillard parker and harden on their court too. he beat cp3 at home too past season....

That's a super tiny sample size man. I remember that game.

The game was GSW's except for a mindless turnover in the last seconds of regulation by Curry when he just needed to call a time out.

Rose shot horribly and was chucking that game and he had 11 turnovers. The Warriors seem to defend Rose well, even from what I remember before his injury, and this was no exception. He scored 30 on 33 shots, which is the opposite of "torching" by any measure. This is a pretty terrible example of Rose's dominance. And he had 1 assist in FIVE periods.

The main difference was GSW was getting killed on the boards and was getting to the line at double GSW's rate-- 0 of which were shot by Rose. The Bulls had 15 extra shot attempts even with all of Rose's turnovers. He hit a game winner, so that's cool. But no, that wasn't a good game by Rose.


In fact 11-33 shooting, 1 assist as PG, and 11 turnovers are the exact type of numbers that should drop Rose, especially if that is held up as an example of one of his better games. Admitedly, I had originally thought 84 was only a little inflated but you're actually reminding me of how terrible Rose really was.

[MGSW]

Quote: Originally Posted by 8KB24

I love stats and analytics as much as the next guy...but I gotta know how players achieved these stats.

Like I said. All available information. Stats and good old fashioned eye test. And everything in between.

[Kese86]

Quote: Originally Posted by MGSW

Still not the way it works though is it? That's not how people compare players. It's a dumb way to do it. Now if you want to analyse their games and the metrics and compare them, I'm happy to do that. If you want to play some sort of pseudo-MYGM because you're craving 2k16 so much I'll have to pass. Sorry.

Actually I was referring to real life GMs. This has nothing to do with 2K. Metrics are fine if the with the eye test players are comparable, but that isn't the case with Westbrook and Conley. You called him Westbrick in a previous post so if you personally don't like him just say that. Crunching numbers aren't the be all, end all. Westbrook is a more dynamic player. He can guard multiple positions and affects the game in more ways offensively than Conley. Just watching games will tell you that without using any metrics.

[Sundown]

Quote: Originally Posted by Kese86

Actually I was referring to real life GMs. This has nothing to do with 2K. Metrics are fine if the with the eye test players are comparable, but that isn't the case with Westbrook and Conley. You called him Westbrick in a previous post so if you personally don't like him just say that. Crunching numbers aren't the be all, end all. Westbrook is a more dynamic player. He can guard multiple positions and affects the game in more ways offensively than Conley. Just watching games will tell you that without using any metrics.

Westbrook actually shows up fantasticly on advanced metrics in addition to the eye test. But the metrics reveal that his defense is actually subpar despite its aesthetics and that near-30 PER and all those triple doubles don't actually have MVP-level impact.

There are a lot of things that can fool the eye test, and advaned metrics casts a light on them. If Westbrook can defend multiple positions, he's not doing it very well.

And yes, Westbrook is a much more impactful player than Conley, by the eye test and especially by analytics.

[8KB24]

Quote: Originally Posted by MGSW

Like I said. All available information. Stats and good old fashioned eye test. And everything in between.

So...we agree

[MGSW]

Quote: Originally Posted by Kese86

Actually I was referring to real life GMs. This has nothing to do with 2K. Metrics are fine if the with the eye test players are comparable, but that isn't the case with Westbrook and Conley. You called him Westbrick in a previous post so if you personally don't like him just say that. Crunching numbers aren't the be all, end all. Westbrook is a more dynamic player. He can guard multiple positions and affects the game in more ways offensively than Conley. Just watching games will tell you that without using any metrics.

I completely disagree.

1. He can't even guard his own position never mind multiple. He's a horrible defender. His athleticism and quick hands hides how terrible he truly is. He's worse than Harden. He's constantly caught out of position and he always reaches too much. Gambling all the time. The difference between him and Conley defensively is night and day.

2. He can't run an offense like Conley can. Not even close. He doesn't have the same fundamentals or vision.

3. He can't shoot. At all. He's a terrible shot.

4. He's an awful decision maker. Literally the worst out of all starting point guards.

5. He's horribly inefficient. Conley isn't.

6. His usage rate was historically massive. So all those triple doubles... meh.

7. The only thing Westbrook has over Conley is athleticism and rebounding. That's it.


I don't dislike the guy. I dislike people overrating him. He's not a top 3 point guard. He's barely top 5.

[Sundown]

Quote: Originally Posted by MGSW

I completely disagree. 1. He can't even guard his own position never mind multiple. He's a horrible defender. His athleticism and quick hands hides how terrible he truly is. He's worse than Harden. He's constantly caught out of position and he always reaches too much. Gambling all the time. The difference between him and Conley defensively is night and day. 2. He can't run an offense like Conley can. Not even close. He doesn't have the same fundamentals or vision. 3. He can't shoot. At all. He's a terrible shot. 4. He's an awful decision maker. Literally the worst out of all starting point guards. 5. He's horribly inefficient. Conley isn't. 6. His usage rate was historically massive. So all those triple doubles... meh. 7. The only thing Westbrook has over Conley is athleticism and rebounding. That's it. I don't dislike the guy. I dislike people overrating him. He's not a top 3 point guard. He's barely top 5.

A couple things. While Conley is certainly a better decision maker, Westbrook isn't THAT much more inefficient than Conley.


Westbrook's career TS: .525
Conley's career TS: .537

That is not really that large a gap. Now Conley's season last year was siginfiicantly better at .558, but Westbrook had a TS of .536, close to Conley career at INSANE usage. That is an impressive feat, even if it doesn't move the needle for me as much as triple doubles and PER might move some casuals.

And again, Westbrook shows up way better on most metrics simply for being a force on the court, even despite his inefficiency which if horrible, Conley's would then be slightly less horrible. I will say that I don't like my clear Option 1 player having only NBA average efficiency, however. It's essentially both a floor and ceiling for how good your offense can be. OKC doesn't usually have that problem though, since Durant is Option 1, even if Westbrook sometimes forgets.

Strangely Conley doesn't show up well according to advanced defensive metrics. Now it's a little better than Westbrook according to RPM, but not very much so.

[Real2KInsider]

Quote: Originally Posted by Hopsin

Isn't there a saying that goes like, "stats don't tell the whole story,"? Yes his efficiency and other parts of his game dropped.. But if you were to have watched all the games last season you'd know, he passes the eye test, he just was a lot more cautious. He wanted to ease his body back in and stay healthy.. Stats don't tell you that.

Rofl, Rose did not pass the eye test, he was jacking up shots instead of getting Gasol/Butler involved half the time. His basketball IQ is terrible.

All the numbers do is back that up.