Transition based submissions

[johnmangala]

The sub mini game should be replaced with Transition Based Submissions and a grip meter. Here is my version of TBS:

Transitions during subs are escape or advance. Now just you continue down the submission’s transition directions, meanwhile the opponent transitions in the direction of escape. The single objective for each will rotate while you perform swoops and holding directions to advance or escape the submission.

The grip meter determines who wins... it can be affected by strikes or transitions. Finally there should be mobile grappling: the locomotion should be uniform and seamlessly transition from clinch to ground.

[DCowboys22]

I think the Submission system should be transition based simply to remain consistent with the overall grappling system. It should be an extension of the same controls, not an entirely separate system.

There are ways to implement this and not be overly complex or confusing to casual gamers.

You can add visual queues for ever stage of a submission (which they already have if you pay attention to the animations behind the current submission Gate overlay), along with smart commentary to let the player know they are in danger.


The current system is not immersive at all. My eyes and focus should always be on the fighters, not some gates.

[SMOKEZERO]

While the sub mini game, indeed detracts from the fighters, it is the closest representation to grappling/wrestling the game offers. The current system can also be improved upon. I’m not ready to scrap it until we see what new changes are coming in the next game.


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[rabbitfistssaipailo]

I like this ...

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[SHADOW_UFCMMA]

Quote: Originally Posted by johnmangala

The sub mini game should be replaced with Transition Based Submissions and a grip meter. Here is my version of TBS: Transitions during subs are escape or advance. Now just you continue down the submission’s transition directions, meanwhile the opponent transitions in the direction of escape. The single objective for each will rotate while you perform swoops and holding directions to advance or escape the submission. The grip meter determines who wins... it can be affected by strikes or transitions. Finally there should be mobile grappling: the locomotion should be uniform and seamlessly transition from clinch to ground.

Dude i remember when you just posted this thread i accidentally put no instead of yes. my fault.

[TheGentlemanGhost]

Quote: Originally Posted by SMOKEZERO

While the sub mini game, indeed detracts from the fighters, it is the closest representation to grappling/wrestling the game offers. The current system can also be improved upon. I’m not ready to scrap it until we see what new changes are coming in the next game. Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

Unless I’m misunderstanding, I 1000% disagree. This is absolutely the worst representation of submissions out of the big 3 (UD, EA MMA & UFC). Stamina only plays a role before the sub is initiated and not throughout the submission itself, plus the gates are timed so every single individual standard submission takes the exact same amount of time to complete, nothing realistic about that at all. If someone slaps a RNC on you with Ortega and you’re a worn out McGregor, it’s the same gates timing out for the same 3.5 or whatever seconds a piece, just as it would be any other time using the RNC. Basically, if you have a 5 gate sub slapped on me with 15 sec left, there’s no reason to even play the mini-game since I just know it’s going to take too long to finish in time lol.

There is no true feeling of an actual submission battle. It’s more of a race against the clock than it is a battle between two fighters. It should feel like man vs man, not man vs man vs machine. EA MMA did that best while UD3 was a distant 2nd.

[johnmangala]

Quote: Originally Posted by DCowboys22

I think the Submission system should be transition based simply to remain consistent with the overall grappling system. It should be an extension of the same controls, not an entirely separate system. There are ways to implement this and not be overly complex or confusing to casual gamers. You can add visual queues for ever stage of a submission (which they already have if you pay attention to the animations behind the current submission Gate overlay), along with smart commentary to let the player know they are in danger. The current system is not immersive at all. My eyes and focus should always be on the fighters, not some gates.

Quote: Originally Posted by TheGentlemanGhost

Unless I’m misunderstanding, I 1000% disagree. This is absolutely the worst representation of submissions out of the big 3 (UD, EA MMA & UFC). Stamina only plays a role before the sub is initiated and not throughout the submission itself, plus the gates are timed so every single individual standard submission takes the exact same amount of time to complete, nothing realistic about that at all. If someone slaps a RNC on you with Ortega and you’re a worn out McGregor, it’s the same gates timing out for the same 3.5 or whatever seconds a piece, just as it would be any other time using the RNC. Basically, if you have a 5 gate sub slapped on me with 15 sec left, there’s no reason to even play the mini-game since I just know it’s going to take too long to finish in time lol. There is no true feeling of an actual submission battle. It’s more of a race against the clock than it is a battle between two fighters. It should feel like man vs man, not man vs man vs machine. EA MMA did that best while UD3 was a distant 2nd.

That brings up a point- there should be a HUDless submission game. I have an idea for it that is an evolution of the idea I posted earlier that can be played without a HUD:

The subber’s goal is to advance the sub (fill the grip meter) while the subbee’s goal is escape the sub (deplete the grip meter) via transitions, strikes, or movement. You can perform either a minor or major transition. Minor transition is by holding a direction, while major is a swoop...

- A minor transition (holding a direction) is safer but slower at maintaining or advancing the grip meter and sub. You shine the RS to find where the opponent is holding direction which will cause him to have to reposition and you both struggle there.

- A major transition (swoops) is risky but fills or depletes the grip meter faster. You have to time one during the times the opponent is repositioning between holding a direction for 5 seconds. You mistime one and you deplete your grip by the same you would’ve gained.

[SMOKEZERO]

The submission mini game is the best and only representation of a positional struggle or “wrestling” mechanic the game offers. The fact the mini game itself has nothing to do with fighting is beside the point. Until we see what’s coming next a tbs system doesn’t solve the transition grappling that is void of wrestling in the current system. There is more wrestling in the mini game than there is in the entire rest of the grappling based systems


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