Major goalie change discovered!

[jtricoli]

When I first started playing the demo of NHL 12 I immediately locked in as goalie to see the changes from the previous year. What I discovered wasn't immediately apparent at first because of all the changes to the goalies this year, but I sensed the overall reduction in speed and figured it was just EA lowering the speed of the goalies from NHL 11 to balance the decreased puck handling and deking ability.

However, something just didn't seem right and I started to notice the types of goals being scored in NHL 12 were often easy put backs I would have been able to slide back across the crease to get in front of in NHL 11. I then started to really look at the goalie butterfly slide animation and noticed some key differences from previous years. There was the obvious overall reduction in lateral speed, but there was one sneaky addition EA added this year which wasn't in previous versions and that is SLIDE MOMENTUM.

What I mean is, if you are sliding in butterfly in one direction and then change directions without coming to a complete stop first, your first push will stop your original lateral direction (basically stopping you in your tracks) before moving you back in your new direction.

This is a huge difference from NHL 11! At first I wasn't sure what I was seeing and decided to load up NHL 11 to compare. What I saw was very dramatic. Aside from a huge change is game speed (NHL feels almost arcadishly fast), the goalie had no pause before changing directions while sliding in butterfly. You could just slide immediately from one direction to the next without stopping.

In comparison, try moving in one direction, stopping for a split second and then reversing direction. You will notice the first push by the goalie after you pause will move him in the direction of the push. Presumably this is more realistic because you have gathered yourself and aren't fighting against momentum before you try to react. It completely changes how people will play goalie. You will really have to focus on small discreate movements rather than mad scrambles in the net. It's more butterfly realistic, but doesn't take into account a Tim Thomas sprawling style of play.

One of the reasons Thomas plays the way he does is to overcome this exact issue. Thomas will aggressively play the original shot which will often leave a rebound in a direction he wasn't originally moving. Because physics dictate that a body in motion will stay in motion unless acted upon by an outside force, Thomas sacrifices textbook butterfly recover techniques for speed, with the result being somewhat sloppy, but effective. Maybe if EA really had different styles, this could be an area to really showcase that separation.

This subtle change has huge implications when playing goalie in NHL 12. Human goalies need to focus on small distinct movements now more than ever. If you are one of those guys who like to go butterfly and slide from save to save, you will find yourself sliding in one direction to make the initial save but unable to react to the rebound put back from the other side because you didn't come to a stop before pushing to the other side. I didn't realize how much I did that myself before I figured out what was happening.

Having said all this, I'm not sure how I feel about it yet. Clearly EA focused on improving the goalies this year, but they didn't do it at the expense of making it impossible to score. I've already posted about the unrealistic percentage of tipped shots which end up going 5 hole, and the slow overall lateral movement in net. Playing goalie in this game is already hard enough as it is, I just hope EA gives the goalies a little speed back in an effort to keep the balance in the game.

Jtric

[Qb]

I also noticed a reduction in lateral speed when locked to goalie. I left some very empty cages when I played the shot and a cross-ice pass got through. I didn't play much goalie in NHL11 (and none in OTP), but I think it feels better. As long as the team in front of you doesn't give up a ton of odd-mans and knows how to take away the passing lanes.

FWIW, I know Chase, who does play a lot of goalie online, is excited about some of the changes. Particularly the auto-cover on/off option, or in his words, "no more hungry hungry hippos!"

[JezFranco]

This all sounds good... from a non-goalie's point of view that is.

I've never tried playing goalie, so I wouldn't know if there was any change, but them "momentum" thing you mention should be good, as it would mean that you (as an attacker) could deke the goalie more realistically ( = deke right, goalie goes right, you go left).

But I guess for people playing goalie it could be really hard.
I guess it's really hard for a developer to put these things into the game to make the AI goalie "human" while at the same time not making a human goalie completely useless.


I guess we'll all know upon release, withing the first 24 hours there'll be hundreds of thousands of human goalie hours played, and the usual whining starts... but hopefully after a week or so it might get more constructive as people learn the ropes.

[blaziruku]

Quote: Originally Posted by Qb

I also noticed a reduction in lateral speed when locked to goalie. I left some very empty cages when I played the shot and a cross-ice pass got through. I didn't play much goalie in NHL11 (and none in OTP), but I think it feels better. As long as the team in front of you doesn't give up a ton of odd-mans and knows how to take away the passing lanes. FWIW, I know Chase, who does play a lot of goalie online, is excited about some of the changes. Particularly the auto-cover on/off option, or in his words, "no more hungry hungry hippos!"

What do you mean by auto-cover? Do you mean the ones where you press triangle and they glove it from the side/back or w/e that's not the usual crappy one?

[jtricoli]

Yes, you can turn off both the auto cover and goalie puck swipe in the controller settings area.

Jtric

[plaidchuck]

Are you talking about how the goalie actually pushes off a little to go in each direction? Because that was in 11.. but the auto-cover being off is definitely good.

[jtricoli]

No it's not the little push from last year. It is a very distinct stopping motion when going from one direction to the other while sliding in butterfly. I wish I could show everyone with a video, but I don't have a camera. Maybe someone with a capture card could do a side by side comparison.

Jtric

[ChaseB]

Quote: Originally Posted by jtricoli

No it's not the little push from last year. It is a very distinct stopping motion when going from one direction to the other while sliding in butterfly. I wish I could show everyone with a video, but I don't have a camera. Maybe someone with a capture card could do a side by side comparison. Jtric

Wait that's what the puck swipe is? I was wondering what that is. Wasn't sure if it was that auto poke that sometimes happens if you glue against the post while standing up and the puck is right near the corner of the net.