Remove the OVR rating?

[jmik58]

(I already posted this in the Madden forum, but in the event some don't venture over there...this is still a relevant topic for NCAA I believe)

I like to think about subtle changes that sports video games could implement to make the games more challenging and realistic at the same time.

I had a thought yesterday and I feel like it's worth a little discussion.

What impact would it have on sports gaming if the OVR rating was removed from players?

All players would have the same attribute ratings for specific skills they currently do, however; no one would be given a rating for "overall". You would have to evaluate their talent based on the specific skills necessary for the position you want them to play.

I like this on the surface for a few reasons...

Having a number to use to manage a roster or set a depth chart is too simple/easy - it's a crutch. It takes very little thought or skill to put the 91 OVR player above the 87 OVR player. If we didn't have the OVR to look at, we would have to think long and hard about the skills of each individual player and how/when we should use each player based on our scheme and match-ups.

Also, football is a game of situations. Few players are always better in every single situation in comparison to teammates. If you want to get the feel for what it's like to be a real coach or GM; ignore the OVR and focus on the specific attributes necessary of the position in relevant situations and deploy the appropriate players when necessary.

The final point that stands out to me is the idea that "this is how it works in real life." On every staff there are mixed opinions over who the best players are at each position. Some coaches like leadership, others pocket presence, others speed. There is no magic OVR rating that a coach or GM can pull out. These guys have unique philosophies about what makes a guy good and they stand by that. We should experience that as well.

Imagine if it was taken a step farther and the coaches within the games took on those personalities and philosophies. Who would the Raiders start at WR? The guy with exceptional speed with no hands, or the guy who can catch but is hitched to a plow? There is no OVR rating to decide. Each team's specific philosophies would keep this dynamic.

Anyways...how would you feel about such a change?

[WipeOut464]

OVR is a marginally useful metric as it is now.

Ideally, I'd be in the same boat as you with analyzing specific skill sets of my players and looking for potential mismatches. Unfortunately, the way Madden and NCAA currently work, many of the ratings don't mean a whole lot. Until weight/momentum and especially true positions (Strong/Weak-side LB, Slot WR, 3-4 NT, Nickel, etc.) are properly implemented, there's often not a ton of utility in looking for that perfect niche player.

I'm hoping the revamped passing game will make for truly useful classifications of WRs. Currently, the only thing that matters is SPD and making sure he doesn't have stone hands - but then again you can say the same thing for SPD and most other positions.

[GohanX]

It'd be a good change and it'd add depth.

However, it'll never happen as it's there as an easy number for casual gamers to figure out what player should play what position. The majority of players that buy these games just look at the OVR rating to decide pretty much every player decision they make.

[Pokes404]

Quote: Originally Posted by jmik58

(I already posted this in the Madden forum, but in the event some don't venture over there...this is still a relevant topic for NCAA I believe) I like to think about subtle changes that sports video games could implement to make the games more challenging and realistic at the same time. I had a thought yesterday and I feel like it's worth a little discussion. What impact would it have on sports gaming if the OVR rating was removed from players? All players would have the same attribute ratings for specific skills they currently do, however; no one would be given a rating for "overall". You would have to evaluate their talent based on the specific skills necessary for the position you want them to play. I like this on the surface for a few reasons... Having a number to use to manage a roster or set a depth chart is too simple/easy - it's a crutch. It takes very little thought or skill to put the 91 OVR player above the 87 OVR player. If we didn't have the OVR to look at, we would have to think long and hard about the skills of each individual player and how/when we should use each player based on our scheme and match-ups. Also, football is a game of situations. Few players are always better in every single situation in comparison to teammates. If you want to get the feel for what it's like to be a real coach or GM; ignore the OVR and focus on the specific attributes necessary of the position in relevant situations and deploy the appropriate players when necessary. The final point that stands out to me is the idea that "this is how it works in real life." On every staff there are mixed opinions over who the best players are at each position. Some coaches like leadership, others pocket presence, others speed. There is no magic OVR rating that a coach or GM can pull out. These guys have unique philosophies about what makes a guy good and they stand by that. We should experience that as well. Imagine if it was taken a step farther and the coaches within the games took on those personalities and philosophies. Who would the Raiders start at WR? The guy with exceptional speed with no hands, or the guy who can catch but is hitched to a plow? There is no OVR rating to decide. Each team's specific philosophies would keep this dynamic. Anyways...how would you feel about such a change?

While I was skeptical of it at first, I liked the concept behind All-Pro Football's rating system. The ratings weren't based on numbers, they were based on "abilities." Sure, you knew a Gold-Star player was better than a Bronze-Star player, but within those categories, it was really more about finding the player with the abilities that fit your system. It certainly wasn't perfect, but it was something unique to the numbered ratings we see in almost every other sports game. At the very least, it was a way to do away with the OVR rating. I think I'd still prefer attributes such as speed and strength remaining as numbered ratings (since these things can have a subtle, and measurable, difference between players), but it'd be interesting to see an abilities system with other aspects that are harder to measure (tackling technique, pursuit, coverage ability, footwork, hands, etc).

But to answer the question, I wouldn't be against removing the OVR rating, especially if it was offered as an on/off option. It would make evaluating young players more involved, and it would make scouting opponents a little more in-depth than just scrolling through the depth chart and looking at the OVR ratings.

[1GATOR FAN]

Quote: Originally Posted by Pokes404

While I was skeptical of it at first, I liked the concept behind All-Pro Football's rating system. The ratings weren't based on numbers, they were based on "abilities." Sure, you knew a Gold-Star player was better than a Bronze-Star player, but within those categories, it was really more about finding the player with the abilities that fit your system. It certainly wasn't perfect, but it was something unique to the numbered ratings we see in almost every other sports game. At the very least, it was a way to do away with the OVR rating. I think I'd still prefer attributes such as speed and strength remaining as numbered ratings (since these things can have a subtle, and measurable, difference between players), but it'd be interesting to see an abilities system with other aspects that are harder to measure (tackling technique, pursuit, coverage ability, footwork, hands, etc). But to answer the question, I wouldn't be against removing the OVR rating, especially if it was offered as an on/off option. It would make evaluating young players more involved, and it would make scouting opponents a little more in-depth than just scrolling through the depth chart and looking at the OVR ratings.

Would be nice I guess but there are way more players in NCAA and to many players would be the same

[cparrish]

Quote: Originally Posted by 1GATOR FAN

Would be nice I guess but there are way more players in NCAA and to many players would be the same

Not if you rate them properly.

I got some flak from people last year for my rosters because I didn't go by the overall rating. I rated people out to their abilities and didn't put much weight, if any, to their overall rating. Justin Blackmon felt nothing like Ryan Broyles and Rodney "Speedy" Stewart felt nothing like Kniles Davis.

I would like just to have the option to take out the overall rating and not get rid of it completely (just something you can click off in the games settings). It would be fun to use in my OD with my friends. Makes you really have to pay attention to your players and their strengths.

[DorianDonP]

I made a thread a month or so ago that was in the same spirit as this thread. I personally agree that going forward, getting rid of overalls, or numeric ratings is the way to go.

http://www.operationsports.com/forum...about-gen.html

[1GATOR FAN]

Overall rating also wouldn't be so bad if 1/2 the stats actually mattered.

Like many have shown you can put a bunch of kickers on the O-line and they will block as good as 300+ pound strong linemen.

Same with the D-line pretty much and there is no weight momentum in this game so getting a 230 pound Rb is no better than a 180 pound one