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NBA 2K11's Simulation Gamestyle Is Great, But I Hate How It Cheats the User 
Posted on October 10, 2010 at 07:19 AM.
I have been a member on OS for 8 years now. I first joined the site back in 2002 when it was still in its infancy. I found the website through a Google search while looking for a website dedicated to sports gaming - my favorite genre of video games at the time. NBA 2K3 was on the verge of release, and thus the game that would begin the 2K Brand's dominance in the basketball video game market (and sports video gaming for that matter).
Over the years, I've noticed how most of the NBA 2K games are met with glorious impressions initially, then the criticism starts to roll in days later. It happens like clockwork every single year when a new NBA 2K is released - and NBA 2K11 is no exception.
There is a lot to love about 2K11 on paper: the updated rosters, the updated Association and My Player modes, the gameplay enhancements, and the granddaddy of all features, the return of Michael Jordan to the virtual hardwood. I would be lying if I said this wasn't my most anticipated video game release of 2010. It seem like October took forever to get here this year!!
Spending my middle and high school years during the 1990's, I was 14 (a month shy of 15) year's old when Jordan took his "final shot" in the 1998 NBA Finals. Like the rest of America, I thought that Jordan pushed off on that play (LOL), but what a climatic way to end a season and a career right (or so we thought LOL)?
For those of you that have played NBA games as long as I have, you know that Jordan hasn't appeared in many of them (due to his separate licensing rights outside of the NBA Player's Association). In his 14 year NBA career, I think Jordan has only been featured in officially licensed NBA games maybe like 4 years out of his 15 full seasons in the league. Just like Live 2000 did over 10 years ago, 2K11 announced that Jordan would be featured in their game. That was big news for the basketball gaming industry.
When popping NBA 2K11 into your console for the first time, you're greeted with probably the best opening sequences in video gaming history. Jordan walks out on to the court; Game 1, 1991 NBA Finals. No start menu. No options adjustments. You're thrown right onto the front lines with Jordan as your Platoon Sergeant. Your enemy? The 1991 Los Angeles Lakers and their floor general, Magic Johnson. If you're like me, eventually that nostalgic feeling wears off, and then your attention focuses on the meat and potatoes of any officially licensed sports game - its gameplay, current teams, players, and the modes dedicated to them. 2K11 has its fair share of modes - Association, Playoffs, Single Season, Situation, Practice, Blacktop Mode, My Player, and Quick Game. As you can see, there is plenty to do in this game if you are a fan of the NBA.
Having watching the sport of basketball all of my life, I tend to think that I know a little bit about the game. Grant it, I only played one year of high school basketball (and on the JV level at that), and I will never be mistaken as the best player on the court in any pick up games, but I understand how to play the game. I understand proper defense, working the ball on offense to get the best uncontested shot, and boxing out and getting proper position to grab the rebound. I understand what strengths there are in basketball as well as the weaknesses that a player can have. Having that knowledge is important in analyzing your opponent.
When I play a basketball game such as NBA 2K11, I look to see if those fundamentals of basketball exist in the product. This year NBA 2K11 introduced a simulation gamestyle, designed to replicate the nuisances and patience needed to win an NBA contest. This was a welcomed addition for OS vets and NBA 2K vets alike. Initial criticism of this gamestyle talked about the CPU's ability to steal and deflect passes at a high rate, and I was among one of those who shared in those complaints. A lot of OS posters happy with the game faulted the user's ability, or should I say, inability to play "smart basketball" as the reasons for their frustration. Upon further review, I started to agree. But that's where my agreement stopped.
Once I took a step back and realized I was not playing NBA 2K10 anymore, I started to exhibit more patience on offense. Low and behold, I was generating less turnovers on offense, and starting to get more open looks at the basket. I was finally settling and becoming extremely happy with the game's simulation gamestyle...or so I thought...
Like an NFL referee making a bad call, I needed further review to analyze what was transpiring on the court. The things I started noticing really bothered me; it bothered me to the point that I let out my frustrations about the game yet again. Rather than storm the forums ranting in every open thread and risk a ban for trolling, I elected to write this blog instead.
We all would agree that the key to maintaining an effective offense is minimizing mistakes and taking care of the ball. This holds true in every sport (except baseball since their offense is played out differently). So in basketball, it is important to pass the ball to a teammate only if he has an open opportunity to receive the ball without any interference from an opposing player. THIS JUST IN!!! The turnovers that you generate in 2K11 are not your fault entirely. With the function of instant replay, I was able to go back and review the passes that I threw that led to turnovers. I would say 75% of the turnovers I had were completely my fault - passing the ball in situations that were not ideal; again an old habit from playing 2K10. But that other 25%? I will explain below.
2K lauded over the fact that they redid the passing system this year. Why it's easy to see these improvements when playing the game for the first time, you soon that to see the faults of the passing system as well. To make the game "appear" more challenging to the user, what was done was the make the user perform a pass that was errant and not ideal for the situation. When the situation calls for a bounce pass, your player performs a chest pass instead. When the situation calls for a little more zip on the pass, your player will throw a halfhearted lazy pass instead. These situations lead to easy turnover opportunities for the CPU defense. So while the sim fan thinks that defensive awareness has been ramped up, it really hasn't (well it has, but not as much as it seems), it's just the game trying to overcompensate for its lack of defensive awareness for different situations.
Wonder why you aren't getting a lot of fast break opportunities? Well, when the ball needs to be passed out quickly after a defensive rebound to initiate the fast break, your player lazily hands the ball off to your point guard who must adjust to the bad pass, thus negating the fast break opportunity because the defense has time to recover. So what looked like awesome defensive AI from the computer, was actually the game reducing your offensive AI giving the CPU defense an advantage. Also, your teammate AI on fast breaks is atrocious at best (EDIT: I'm only seeing this in sim mode, I think the fast breaks are fine on default). While the CPU defense sprints down the court to get into position, your teammates jog down court like they are pacing themselves in a marathon; a situation once again allowing the defensive to recover and negating an opportunity for you.
Another sore spot in the game is rebounding. Think your man is in perfect position to grab that board? WRONG!! Count on an opposing player to come in and "Superman that ho!", snatching the ball out of your outstretched hands. This gives the CPU second chance points on your defensive end, and less second chance points for you on your offensive end. And what leads to these peculiar situations? It's simple - there is no box out logic built into the game. Sure, you're able to box out manually, but 9 times out of 10, those shots go in. (I wonder why? Hmmm...) And I wouldn't say that this fault is exclusively tied to simulation mode. The bad rebounding logic is present all across the game. That is something I definitely hope can be patched.
Tell me if this has ever happened to you: You have Jarret Jack (or any point guard not named Derek Fisher) on the wing and you see that Glen "Big Baby" Davis is guarding you because of a defensive switch. No problem right? You just use Jack's speed to get around Davis, right? NOT SO FAST SWEETHEART! (In my Lee Corso voice) Count of Big Baby locking you down as if he were Shane Battier and you were, well you. Again, this is simulation mode at work overcompensating and not rewarding the user in recognizing a mismatch and trying to take advantage all to make the game "appear" to be more challenging. Sure, you can try to "isomotion" your way out of the situation, but even when you finally get daylight, count on Mr. Davis "magically" being able to recover to bump you and impede your progress forcing you to pick up your dribble, or worse, lose control of the ball. And if by some slight chance you do get by even with the odds so heavily stacked against you, be sure to expect the game to force you into some unnecessary, overcomplicated layup animation to make the layup harder than it needed to be to force a "bad" shot attempt. Better yet, you can pass the ball off to a teammate. Oh wait, I forgot about my previous paragraph. Nevermind. (And if you expect your AI teammate to adjust and be smart enough to come to the ball to make the pass easier for you to complete, keep dreaming.)
There's a myriad of other issues I can touch on that I see are prevalent when the game is set to simulation mode, but I'm tired of writing, so I'll just quickly highlight a few down below:
- If you're lucky, you'll hit 30% of your WIDE OPEN 3 pointers, even if you have a team filled with the best 3 point shooters in the NBA (trust me, I created a team of the best 3 point shooters in the game at each position to test out. Sadly, I was right)
- Once again, contesting jump shots doesn't seem to have any effect on the CPU's ability to make or miss shots (unless you block it of course). I'm sure you all have played against KG right? No amount of hands in his face, even with an excellent post defender like Pau Gasol, is going to have any effect on his ability to hit the fadeaway. All you can do is hope you can miraculously block it or it's the 10th time (as Clark Kellog puts it) and he just happens to miss the shot. See my previous blog that I wrote this time last year for more thoughts on that.
- What happened to the awesome human defensive awareness from the demo? It seems eerily absent on simulation.
- Players struggle to make even the most routine layups; the game once again overcompensating by making things more difficult than it needs to be and making the game "appear" to be more challenging
- There's little to no off ball movement from your AI teammates. You basically have to call a play, or navigate through a complicating control scheme to get a teammate to make a cut - the game compensating by eliminating an option to lead pass your way to victory as was prevalent in 2K10. While it may seem like a welcomed addition to some players, that's not sim on any level of basketball, let alone the NBA. Teammates should have the basic knowledge to continuously work to get open without you telling them to.
- Able to get any loose balls lately?
Instead of doing its due diligence and making the CPU smarter and more adept to playing good basketball, the game simply gives the CPU artificial advantages while taking away abilities for the user making it more challenging to win. This forces you to believe that what you have is an extremely intelligent CPU forcing you to beat it legitimately and not through exploits, but really it's counting on you to be too blind to see that you're actually being cheated by the AI. While some users may welcome that, that's not how a basketball simulation should play out. Don't get me wrong, the game can still be enjoyable....on the default setting. I actually enjoy the game very much on Superstar/Default. But if you're looking for a "simulation" experience, it's default or custom sliders. Simulation mode is a fraud.
Comments
# 16 chypskilark @ Oct 11
I must agree that 2k11 has the best presentation of any sports game ever! While it does have alot of bright spots theres those "cheating" moments that really kill the gameplay. I can deal with the cheap steals, lazy passes, and Gary Payton esque defense that every player on the game shares, but i cant stand tht when you finally succeed in getting a step on someone and get an open lane players dont take off like they should they either do a difficult shot that you werent expecting or that spin-dunk combo which isnt 100% successful. Makes no sense
 
# 17 silentnite33 @ Oct 11
People here have to realize that what NBA 2k11 is trying to accomplish is for you to play "REAL BASKETBALL". In other NBA 2k titles you can get your favorite team with your favorite player and just run up and down the court ball hogging, throwing up garbage shots and they still go in. With this years title you actually have to run plays to be effective. Running up and down the court and just shooting or trying to get a dunk will only get you so far. I was playing my association game today and was loosing to an inferior team as i would call them. I started to get into the play book and run plays and they were actually working. My advice for anyone reading this is get into your teams playbook and run plays... you will notice a big difference
 
# 18 Stickz24 @ Oct 11
Yo .. I just finished some videos of a season I am doing in the simulation allstar mode. It seemed perfectly fine to me. Once I upload the videos to youtube .. I'll post the link here. I made it specifically for you and those who agree with you in this blog. I agree its easier to say .. the game is playable at those lets .. but me -- I'm more of a show and tell type. I'll post the link later today. I'm hoping it'll help ..or at least encourage you and a few others .. this game is the truth man .. you just need some guidance.
 
# 19 Stickz24 @ Oct 11
** levels **
 
# 20 Tpitt85 @ Oct 11
did anybody notice their is no travel rule in nba 2k11 WTF is dat... how can u not put traveling in a basketball sim it don't make any sense. I wonder if the DEV team know they forgot to add this
 
# 21 C_Bailey24 @ Oct 11
I really wish people would stop replying with the same ole "this game forces you to play sim", "get in your playbooks" stuff. What does getting in your playbooks have to do with Centers being able to guard point guards, slashing Sg's, etc on the perimeter one-on-one? What does it have to do with trying to outlet and get a fastbreak started and as soon as your wing player catches the ball they STOP, gather then start running again. I've been watching pre-season NBA and i haven't seen half the amount of contact and body'ing up on the perimeter that you see in this game. I shouldn't have to isomotion to blow by a big man with Brandon Jennings or someone of the like. I shouldn't have to do 13 isomotion moves to get by a defender who is shading me to my left and i jab step and explode to the right only for him to magically beat me to the spot. All this stuff along with rebounding and ******** A.I. teammates have nothing to do with running plays or playing sim. This game has faulty aspects and everything the OP stated is completely on point.
 
# 22 Tommy_Vercetti @ Oct 11
i think you are just expecting too much from a video game bro! this game is as near to perfection as i have seen from a sports title! (never played The Show #TeamXBOX lol) and i have been playing 2K games religiously since Dreamcast but there is just no pleasing a lot of you people.... if you want real basketball tune in to NBATV.... its a VIDEO GAME!! this is like having the perfect girl complaining about her because she farts in her sleep! lmao
 
# 23 NELL86 @ Oct 11
This game is great but far from perfect the fast breaks our horrible when u pass the ball to a teammate and they stop to catch the ball where they do that at.When you beat someone with a move they some how recover thats not happening
 
# 24 bigsmallwood @ Oct 11
I agree with the ops points on playing "sim". For me personally I have witnessed everything he said and also the biggest problem is the missing of wide open jump shots. I played on Pro-Sim with the Heat and D. Wade missed 9/10 open jumpers that were all around the paint....most of which were uncontested. I feel like the shooting percentage is lowered on this level. I am VERY GOOD with the shot stick, yet no matter when I release, I continue to miss. And the pass need more zip on them along with more player movement.
 
# 25 cwash020 @ Oct 11
I agree with many of your impressions of the game. I decided to rent it instead of making the impulse buy and I could not be any happier that I did. I returned it over the weekend. The first few hours I had it I spent time with the Jordan Challenge and nostalgic teams. I thoroughly enjoyed those games but as I started playing quick games and fiddling around with the association, I began to realize that this game is not the revolutionary change some reviewers have made it out to be. It still suffers from the same legacy issues as before. The one that pisses me off the most is with the passing game - How many times have you went to pass to someone wide open under the basket, or even on the wing, only to have the ball get picked by the defense because your teammate kept running through the play (thus running away from the ball) not having enough common sense to stop and catch the pass. This has enfuriated me since NBA 2K8. And it is the cause of probably half of my turnovers. The other half are definitely my fault because I was trying to thread the needle, which was much easier to do in NBA 2K10.

This game has made some improvements. The isomotion and shot sticks have both improved. Defense has tighted up (though the AI's intercept pass percentage going up is an artificial to crank up the D). But I don't see where the graphics are much improved and not many problems of the past were fixed. I was really hoping EA would bring something fresh to the table. But there is no doubt that 2K11 is the best b ball game on the market.
 
# 26 alyaaa @ Oct 11
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# 27 Mos1ted @ Oct 11
^^^^ I can't read Arabic! LOL

Just to clarify for those who enjoy the sim setting, I'm not criticizing the game as a whole, just the sim setting in particular. To me, the game plays a challenging, yet realistic game right out of the box. I just feel that the simulation mode is a little bit overboard in trying to replicate realism, when in fact it's exceeding realism to get desired results. That's what we gamers called scripted gameplay.

Basketball is a dynamic sport. For every Sportscenter Top 10 play, there are many fundamental plays that play out throughout the course of a game that a ****** basketball fan may not notice.

For example, field goal percentages in the NBA are the results of defense. Notice how field goal percentages are always higher in the All-Star Game. That's because the defense is always lackadaisical in these games. If you want lower field goal percentages, play better defense. Force the offense into taking bad shots, or at the very least, contest the good shots that they take. I shouldn't have to play with lowered sliders just so my stats replicate real life stats. The CPU defense to force me into missing my shots. At the same time, if I outsmart the defense and work for a wide open shot, I should be rewarded for my efforts. I'm not saying that I should make every wide open shot, but I shouldn't miss the shot just because a slider is set to 45 and not 50. That's not sim. That's screenwriting aka scripting.

If I'm in control of a good ballhandler, I shouldn't have to do 5 moves to get past a slower defender. Look at some of the most devastating crossovers in the NBA. They typically only take 1 or 2 quick moves to get past an opponent. If I gotta keep resetting trying to get past Glenn Davis, then that is not simulation to me. That is the game trying to create a "challenge" so I won't get into the paint so easily even when the situation dictates otherwise in real life.

Simulation is so scripted and frustrating, it takes away the dynamic gameplay so prevalent in the real NBA.
 
# 28 kareem434 @ Oct 11
Disagree take your time your not going to be able to dominate and do what you want all the time that would be too easy. If I could blow by ever mismatch and all ways make a perfect pass then I would be avg 32 pts and 15 ast a game. Oh and trust me when you build your player up the things you though were so hard wont be anymore. "And remember dont play games play basketball"
 
# 29 DaReapa @ Oct 11
This is a good write up and for the most part, I wholeheartedly agree. At first I thought the passing was atrocious (and in some cases it still is), but after a little time figuring out some of the patterns the cpu takes at intercepting passes, I've managed to lower the turnover rate of my team. That's not to say that some of the passing isn't scripted as you've pointed out in your blog. The example you've laid out regarding the point guard in a defensive mismatch, I've touched upon in a previous post and totally agree. To me, that's a part of the lingering problems associated with sluggish controls and hanging animation that 2K proclaimed to have improved over NBA 2K10 in their Developer's Insights. I've gotten a better grip of the controls and it's becoming a lot less frustrating than it was during my first few games. But I'd be silly to dismiss the fact that this game is not flawed when I know it's not, despite how entertaining it may be. However a couple of things that still annoy me (besides the sluggish controls) is that sometimes during a pass attempt, the intended recipient of the pass usually gets caught up in some kind of hanging animation, and as a result, causes your player to instead make a pass across to the far side of the court to an unintended player, and 9 times out of 10 leads to a turnover. This can be so frustrating. The other thing I hate is the high layups off the glass. There have been a few (albeit not many) shots I've missed because the player took a shot high off the glass when the situation never called for it. If 2K can resolve some of these prevailing issues through a patch, maybe, just maybe then we can start talking the G.O.A.T. of sports games.
 
# 30 Stickz24 @ Oct 11
Hey Most .. Here's a sim game I ran ..for you and those it might help.
There are four vids as you can only post 10 mins a time on youtube.
I'll post the link for the first few mins ... you and anyone else who wants can check out the rest if you so desire. Look to see if some of the things you complained about are in there .. kiiling the gameplay or making the sim setting "fraudulent" - Hope it encourages you man - its always easier to show than tell.
------------
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OJkayWVTKHU
 

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