KingV2k3's Blog
M18 AP All Default CFM Sliders V 4.17 (Advanced / AP / AP)
Posted on November 3, 2017 at 11:41 AM.
"Upon Further Review":
Decided to disable BallHawk, as it resulted in too many INTs for HUM (as well as too many Pick 6's) after a season long sample. The pass coverage is also compromised overall with BH:ON, as it causes defenders to overplay the ball, often to their detriment.
PENALTIES
Offside: 50 / 50
False Start: 50 / 50
Offensive Holding: 50 / 50
Defensive Holding: 50 / 60
Face Mask: 45 / 50
Illegal Block In The Back: 50 / 50
Roughing Passer: 50 / 51
Defensive Pass Interference: 50 / 55
OPI: Off / Off
All Others: On
Injuries: 10 / 20
Fatigue: 50 / 50
Player Speed Parity Scale: 50
Auto Subs (MM / CFM): 60 / 80
M18: GAME OPTIONS:
Simulation
Auto Strafe: OFF
Heat Seeker Assist: OFF
Defense Assist: OFF
Ball Hawk: OFF*
Defensive Auto Flip: ON / Optional
Auto Switch Assist: ON / Optional
Coin Toss: Receive / With Wind
Quarter Length: 15 Minutes
Play Call Style: Slim
Camera Toggle: Off
Coaching Tips: Off
Game Speed: Normal / Normal
Play Clock: On
Accelerated Clock: On Special Moves: Manual
Minimum Play Clock Time: 20
Camera Settings: Standard
Progression: Every Four Weeks
Shout out to the "Usual Suspects" who influenced the end result. Trojan Man / StefJoeHalt / JoshC1977 and the crew from Mil and Ren's AM sets all have contributed quality finds to incorporate into any set, this year.
Thanks y'all!
Additionally, here's some guidelines and house rules that pull the settings above into focus:
1) Assign sabo's Custom Books for the CPU Offence. The game is a less mentally challenging, sackfest otherwise. He recently put up some revised D Books, which also play great. Generics are the next best thing (as opposed to Team Default), but I highly recommend sabo's.
2) If you USER as a DL (I do), DON'T "Jump the Snap" (R2), use more than one or two "Special Moves" per pass play or employ the "Sprint Button". Failure to do so will send the CPU timing to heck and abuse the compromised (by hard code) QB AI.
3) DO NOT use Run / Pass Commit. They are also OP to the advantage of the USER.
However, with this updated set, using Coach Adjustments like Pass Rush: Aggressive is okay, if used SPARINGLY. I tend to use this when rushing 3 or against a hurry up / two minute offence only.
Also:
After this "Final Patch", you can get stung by False Start and / or RTP when employing Pass Rush: Aggressive, which creates a nice "risk versus reward" paradigm.
4) I use Formation Subs to get rotation out of the HUM and CPU HBs and some DL, etc. Create their HC / Set Formation Subs / Retire Coach / Then use Sabo's Custom Playbook method. Takes me 10 minutes to set up the game to play optimally. It's well worth it, IMHO.
5) Make sure the CPU QB is set to the same player style on the first page of the edit screen, as it is set in the trait screen. The player type isn't important, having those two "match" is.
5) Post Patch, it's a good idea to edit CPU QB's set mobile / scramble to Balanced / Balanced or they bail too quickly...props to tommycoa on that!
I also set USER QBs to "Throws Tight Spiral: No" to increase challenge / reduce completion percentage. BIG find by Trojan Man on that one. I leave the CPU QBs "as is" with regard to Tight Spiral, though.
6) I set all my player types to Balanced in the scheme menu. This allows the actual player styles to play out, unaffected by the animation triggers associated with the various setting options.
Props to JoshC1977 for figuring out that this menu appears to be tied to profile, which makes both teams slave off it.
7) Use tdawg's XP Sliders. They simply work WAY better than the default system.
8) Rovert's "Simulation Rosters" are as always, the best I've seen for this title.
Lastly:
This year, the AP "House of Cards" is more delicate than ever. The gameplay sliders have finally been rendered completely useless and since penalties affect BOTH sides (HUM / CPU) equally, it's quite a balancing act.
So?
No, you can't have "more" or "less" of ANYTHING.
All four phases (HUM Pass / Run, CPU Pass Run) are as challenging to the former and as forgiving to the latter as possible.
Raising (or lowering) Fatigue / Injury / ANY Auto Sub setting will not only make the fatigue rates worse, it results in different block shed / block duration / pursuit rates, and the "House" falls.
Using an alternate clock system than 15 minute Q with 20 Second Runoff, is also risky, due to the above.
So?
If you're up for a little extra work on the prep, you'll be rewarded with some of the most satisfying results I've seen from this series since M16.
# 2
KingV2k3 @ Nov 3
Hey Raniel3:
1) 13 "should" be fine?
I get 120 to 125 out of 15, so I'm not sure why that's not the case for you. On offence, I snap below the 5 second mark, so that may be the disconnect.
2) Don't mess with Auto Subs.
For instance, jacking up HB subs turns ALL of them into downhill / straight line runners, who don't use special moves or have decent vision. They tend to hit a less optimal hole at a less optimal point in the play. Use formation subs. Period.
3) Never played Play Now and neither 45 or 50 are going to be ideal, but I'd try 45 first.
At default the block shed and pursuit of defenders is too strong and results in too many sacks and tackles for loss. Also nukes the CPU's ability to run.
I hope this helps!
1) 13 "should" be fine?
I get 120 to 125 out of 15, so I'm not sure why that's not the case for you. On offence, I snap below the 5 second mark, so that may be the disconnect.
2) Don't mess with Auto Subs.
For instance, jacking up HB subs turns ALL of them into downhill / straight line runners, who don't use special moves or have decent vision. They tend to hit a less optimal hole at a less optimal point in the play. Use formation subs. Period.
3) Never played Play Now and neither 45 or 50 are going to be ideal, but I'd try 45 first.
At default the block shed and pursuit of defenders is too strong and results in too many sacks and tackles for loss. Also nukes the CPU's ability to run.
I hope this helps!
# 3
Raniel3 @ Nov 3
Okay played one game, Falcons vs Panthers (me), on Play Now with your suggested settings. It's just one game, but I tend to agree that Auto Subs do more harm than good: The running game was really different for both teams, all in all there were 300 yards of rushing (200 for the falcons, had two big 50+ yards runs with Freeman, other than that they were stopped for 1-2 yard gains most of the time). Rushing really felt more natural than with Auto Subs on, even though outside runs are still not effective at all.
I had 130 plays, which is good for me.
Passing was balanced, except for Ryan completing 77% of the passes. But the average yards per pass were on spot, so I will continue monitoring that.
Only thing that stood out stats wise were the 10 sacks combined for both teams (6 against Ryan, 4 against me). Most sacks against Ryan were coverage sacks, so no scrambling seen here. That brings me to another point: I used to edit every QB to "throws ball away YES", which brought down sacks and completion rates for certain QBs, Ryan is one of them who has set this to NO on default. Do you think it would help to set it to YES for every QB, or could this have some negative effect? Most QBs do have this by default, so I don't see a problem changing it for the rest, too.
I had 130 plays, which is good for me.
Passing was balanced, except for Ryan completing 77% of the passes. But the average yards per pass were on spot, so I will continue monitoring that.
Only thing that stood out stats wise were the 10 sacks combined for both teams (6 against Ryan, 4 against me). Most sacks against Ryan were coverage sacks, so no scrambling seen here. That brings me to another point: I used to edit every QB to "throws ball away YES", which brought down sacks and completion rates for certain QBs, Ryan is one of them who has set this to NO on default. Do you think it would help to set it to YES for every QB, or could this have some negative effect? Most QBs do have this by default, so I don't see a problem changing it for the rest, too.
# 4
KingV2k3 @ Nov 3
Play Now is a VERY different animal that I have ZERO experience with, so your results are not going to mirror mine.
All those penalty settings that you have to "round off" to increments of five are going to be a big part that generates that different result.
That being said:
According to adembrowski, who worked at EA when traits were implemented, the "Throw the Ball Away" thing isn't so much "reversed" as it means the opposite of what is commonly thought.
Throw Ball Away: No is actually more likely to make them bail on the play.
I don't recall what thread that's in, but it's from this fall.
Regardless, in my experience, editing ANY trait throws off the "balance" and players play worse.
Traits aren't your issue, having to round off the penalties is.
Everything in this game results in a tradeoff or series of tradeoffs, so...
All those penalty settings that you have to "round off" to increments of five are going to be a big part that generates that different result.
That being said:
According to adembrowski, who worked at EA when traits were implemented, the "Throw the Ball Away" thing isn't so much "reversed" as it means the opposite of what is commonly thought.
Throw Ball Away: No is actually more likely to make them bail on the play.
I don't recall what thread that's in, but it's from this fall.
Regardless, in my experience, editing ANY trait throws off the "balance" and players play worse.
Traits aren't your issue, having to round off the penalties is.
Everything in this game results in a tradeoff or series of tradeoffs, so...
# 5
TheWood56 @ Nov 4
Great to see you back at it again King.
One quick question, what’s the idea behind OPI being turned OFF? Not that it ever gets called when ON anyway.
One quick question, what’s the idea behind OPI being turned OFF? Not that it ever gets called when ON anyway.
# 6
KingV2k3 @ Nov 4
Hey Wood:
Turning that off makes the "catch radius" bigger / less precise and leads to more drops / balls knocked out by defenders, etc.
That results in keeping the completion percentages more realistic...
Receiver animations are also more varied and organic...
With it "on", the ball usually hits them in the ideal part of their bodies and at the ideal point in the route...
That less precise ball placement ALSO keeps RAC down, which results in more accurate YPC / Total Yards Passing / Total Yards, etc...
So?
It does a LOT, in a subtle way...
Turning that off makes the "catch radius" bigger / less precise and leads to more drops / balls knocked out by defenders, etc.
That results in keeping the completion percentages more realistic...
Receiver animations are also more varied and organic...
With it "on", the ball usually hits them in the ideal part of their bodies and at the ideal point in the route...
That less precise ball placement ALSO keeps RAC down, which results in more accurate YPC / Total Yards Passing / Total Yards, etc...
So?
It does a LOT, in a subtle way...
# 7
michdb8 @ Nov 4
what Formation Subs do you edit on the CPU team before a cfm match? I put the sliders of WR catch at 43 and QB at 40 and coverage at 55 to reduce the yards and point, how many points and yard does the match end on the matches you play?
# 8
KingV2k3 @ Nov 4
I put the backup HBs in a few formations that make sense for their skill set...
For instance, when I play PHI, I put Sproles in some Gun Sets...
If the backup is a Power Back, I put him in a couple / few 2 TE sets...
On defense?
If they have a Speed Rusher on the bench, I put him in some Dime / Quarter sets in place of a slower DE...
And, since the LLOB comes off the field for Nickel sets in Madden, I put him at ROLB in Nickel, if he's replacing a lower rated player...
Good example there is GB / Clay Matthews...
Just set them up as you would your own team, to maximize their talent, get some rotation and keep their best players playing when possible...
Lastly:
I get NFL average stats for yardage and point totals...
Some games are defensive battles and some are higher scoring (like the NFL), but they average out accordingly...
For instance, when I play PHI, I put Sproles in some Gun Sets...
If the backup is a Power Back, I put him in a couple / few 2 TE sets...
On defense?
If they have a Speed Rusher on the bench, I put him in some Dime / Quarter sets in place of a slower DE...
And, since the LLOB comes off the field for Nickel sets in Madden, I put him at ROLB in Nickel, if he's replacing a lower rated player...
Good example there is GB / Clay Matthews...
Just set them up as you would your own team, to maximize their talent, get some rotation and keep their best players playing when possible...
Lastly:
I get NFL average stats for yardage and point totals...
Some games are defensive battles and some are higher scoring (like the NFL), but they average out accordingly...
# 9
kennypowers88 @ Nov 4
Hey King,
Just wanted to clear what you meant about schemes. Does that mean tweaking coach schemes causes problems, or were you referring to changing things like player type and QB style?
Just wanted to clear what you meant about schemes. Does that mean tweaking coach schemes causes problems, or were you referring to changing things like player type and QB style?
# 10
KingV2k3 @ Nov 5
I'm referring to O and D schemes...
Altering them, usually results in inferior play calling by the CPU, even when using custom playbooks...
Player Types in the Team Scheme menu can't be changed for the CPU, unless you do 32 team control...
They don't stick otherwise...
When you "Retire HC" before the game, they revert...whereas Formation Subs stick...
Altering them, usually results in inferior play calling by the CPU, even when using custom playbooks...
Player Types in the Team Scheme menu can't be changed for the CPU, unless you do 32 team control...
They don't stick otherwise...
When you "Retire HC" before the game, they revert...whereas Formation Subs stick...
# 11
TheWood56 @ Nov 5
Interesting OPI theory. May have to try it myself.
It’s funny, I hear everyone complaining about QB’s being too accuracy, completion % being too high, etc. I’m on all-pro and have actaully raised the CPU QB accuracy and WR catch slider. Right now I’ve got them both 52 and I routinely see errant throws, dropped passes, timing between QB-WR off, etc. I’m 10 games into my CFM can’t recall a QB throwing much higher than 70% against me.
It’s funny, I hear everyone complaining about QB’s being too accuracy, completion % being too high, etc. I’m on all-pro and have actaully raised the CPU QB accuracy and WR catch slider. Right now I’ve got them both 52 and I routinely see errant throws, dropped passes, timing between QB-WR off, etc. I’m 10 games into my CFM can’t recall a QB throwing much higher than 70% against me.
# 12
michdb8 @ Nov 5
yes this game is a chaos on CPU , I think they should start a new madden cpu AI gameplay for button because the slider sets and CPU ai it works different for each people, cause even in all pro with 40 % on QB acu, 43 WR catch all QB makes more than 80 % complete, one reason is also cause is have some bug in some zones defenses which makes a lot of receivers always free like cover 2 etc
# 13
KingV2k3 @ Nov 5
Just so you guys know:
The sliders DON'T work.
At all.
Period.
It was confirmed by Clint from EA and I can most certainly confirm that as well, after TM and I beat our heads against that wall for the first couple months of this iteration.
@michdb88:
The reason you're percentages are high is because when you turn sliders down, the AI tells the CPU "they can't pass the ball" and they "defend against it", like the just don't care.
Coverage and pass rush get soft and the completions mount.
@TheWood56:
Values like 52 aren't going to rock the engine as hard as the previous example, but they still have a negative effect, cumulatively.
We had the QBA slider set as high as 60 for a while, to see what that did and it was a mess.
For some reason, tackles took on an arcade-ish "de-cleater" quality and the CPU suddenly started sucssefully kicking 65+ yard FGs.
Makes ZERO sense, but that's what happened.
I've been making slider sets for this game since 2003, and trust me:
They are mislabeled, entangled and clearly broken.
ZERO functionality.
I'm not going to tell you guys how to play YOUR game, but I would suggest you play this set "as is" and compare to what you're currently using.
I'd be VERY interested in your take(s) on THAT.
Regards!
The sliders DON'T work.
At all.
Period.
It was confirmed by Clint from EA and I can most certainly confirm that as well, after TM and I beat our heads against that wall for the first couple months of this iteration.
@michdb88:
The reason you're percentages are high is because when you turn sliders down, the AI tells the CPU "they can't pass the ball" and they "defend against it", like the just don't care.
Coverage and pass rush get soft and the completions mount.
@TheWood56:
Values like 52 aren't going to rock the engine as hard as the previous example, but they still have a negative effect, cumulatively.
We had the QBA slider set as high as 60 for a while, to see what that did and it was a mess.
For some reason, tackles took on an arcade-ish "de-cleater" quality and the CPU suddenly started sucssefully kicking 65+ yard FGs.
Makes ZERO sense, but that's what happened.
I've been making slider sets for this game since 2003, and trust me:
They are mislabeled, entangled and clearly broken.
ZERO functionality.
I'm not going to tell you guys how to play YOUR game, but I would suggest you play this set "as is" and compare to what you're currently using.
I'd be VERY interested in your take(s) on THAT.
Regards!
# 14
Raniel3 @ Nov 5
About play now, we've been discussing that back on M16 if you remember. All in all in my experience it's the same gameplay as in CFM except for the confidence stuff. Sliders sets I've used were working as good or as bad as they work in CFM. So a slider set for CFM that e.g. had WR catching at 40 resulted in a lot more drops in Play Now too. As you pointed out in the beginning, Auto Subs do as much harm in Play Now as in CFM etc.
Anyway I changed Facemask to 50, as at 45 it made my and the CPU's passing game too easy, seemed like DBs stopped playing the dreceiver at all, that is every pass that came near a receiver was a completion or an interception. On 50 it is better, even though it might impede the CPU running game (maybe false start at 55 could mitigate that?) Two questions: Would DPI at 55 have any other consequence than improving coverage? (Which I'd like). Secondly, is there a reason you have balk hawk OFF? IIRC most slider gurus think it helps with more pass reflections (I've even read it reduces suction tackling, which should improve the running game...) anyway i am having good balanced and challenging games with your set, keep it uo
Anyway I changed Facemask to 50, as at 45 it made my and the CPU's passing game too easy, seemed like DBs stopped playing the dreceiver at all, that is every pass that came near a receiver was a completion or an interception. On 50 it is better, even though it might impede the CPU running game (maybe false start at 55 could mitigate that?) Two questions: Would DPI at 55 have any other consequence than improving coverage? (Which I'd like). Secondly, is there a reason you have balk hawk OFF? IIRC most slider gurus think it helps with more pass reflections (I've even read it reduces suction tackling, which should improve the running game...) anyway i am having good balanced and challenging games with your set, keep it uo
# 15
KingV2k3 @ Nov 5
Hmmm...
I remember you (obviously), but I had no idea we were discussing Play Now, which I've never touched...
Ever...
Anyway:
Raising DPI will decrease separation in coverage, but also will jack up universal pursuit in pass rush and run defense...
Ball Hawk:On makes the defenders overplay the ball and leads to worse coverage, overall...
I hope that helps!
I remember you (obviously), but I had no idea we were discussing Play Now, which I've never touched...
Ever...
Anyway:
Raising DPI will decrease separation in coverage, but also will jack up universal pursuit in pass rush and run defense...
Ball Hawk:On makes the defenders overplay the ball and leads to worse coverage, overall...
I hope that helps!
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Working...
1. I was using 13 minutes and 20 secs run off, as with 15 mins you get too many plays and therefore scores and stats go up too much (I am a bit stats-obsessed I admit). You think 13 minutes could destroy that house of cards?
2. I was using Wiz's auto subs (which is basically only changing the RB's autosubs to 96/99 IIRC), as he claimed to have tested that it would not have detrimental sideeffects to the gameplay. Do you have contrary evidence?
3. As I only do Play Now games: Should I put Facemask to 45 or to 50? I suppose 45 increases the amount of broken tackles and decreases the pursuit of the QB, both of which should help with CPU run game and sacks. So you say I should go with 45?
Thanks again for you work!