PES 2017 News Post

PES 2017: Impressions of the Demo

03:27 PM - August 31, 2016 by RaychelSnr

Another year, another PES release. Those who were around to witness the "golden years" of the Pro Evolution Soccer (otherwise known as Winning Eleven) series will tell you that it was the best soccer game on the market at the time, masterfully capturing the spirit of the beautiful game.

It’s now 10 years later, and those same fans still use those Winning Eleven classics as a measuring stick for Konami's yearly releases. Last year's effort was a marked improvement over PES 2015, which itself had done an excellent job putting down the foundation for the future of the series with the incorporation of the Fox Engine.

Read More - PES 2017: Impressions of the Demo

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Member Comments

# 21 orion523 @ 09/01/16 08:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Josam27o7


	3) Physics - I heard Matt10 say in one of his videos that PES 17 has such amazing physics he is having a hard time putting down the game. And yet you say there are barely any physics? Btw, PES 17 on -2 gamespeed has light years more weight than Madden 17 (which still remains laughably floaty (even on the "very slow" setting) -- the PS2 era of Madden had tons more feeling of being grounded). 2) Defending AI- It is ridiculous to judge this game on its default settings. Why don't you do the same with FIFA? Seems you have an ulterior motive... bc if you were fair with this game, like I am, you would have done what I did which is play on -2 gamespeed, full manual passing. On these settings, after the "demo patch for positioning" this game is highly tactical. 1) Refs - They call only the most egregious fouls? Huh? I have seen tons of fouls called for little pushes, or a foot stuck in slightly wrong, or a ref falling for a player faking contact drawing a foul.

As far as physics, I'm talking about foot planting, inertia, things like that. In PES, every player feels loose, they turn on a dime and shoot without effort, missed tackles mean nothing, because defenders easily sprint back without penalty. That's the physics I'm talking about.
As for the refs, I stand by what I said, the CPU is rarely called for fouls that are not cards. Also there are no 50/50 calls. It's simply ignored. Also, don't think I've ever seen advantage played in any of my games with the demo.
And yes, I do judge FIFA but default manual settings. As for an ulterior motive, that's downright silly. I'm 45 years old, fanboyism passed me by years ago. I call them like I see them. Don't really care who agrees, disagrees, gets their feathers ruffled or whatever. Yes I have preferred FIFA over the past several years(since at least 11), but f there ever came a time where I felt PES offers a better overall product, overall now, I'd jump ship. From what I've seen thus far, not this year.

# 22 papinho81 @ 09/02/16 04:43 AM

Hi Orion!

As far as I can remember you were not particularly positive about fifa16 neither, right?

# 23 DBMcGee3 @ 09/02/16 08:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dubcity


	That's an exaggeration. Bundesliga will (I'm assuming) have all their kits, but 98% of the players will have generic faces because they will have to be created one by one by whoever is generous enough with their time to create and share them for free. Same with any other league that isn't already in the game in some form or another. It's why I always roll my eyes when people talk about including the MLS in an option file.

Fair enough, but I feel like FIFA has the same problems when you're playing with many of the lesser known teams. Lots of generic looking faces that stick out like a sore thumb when compared to the quality scans.

It should also be noted that, while their post launch support comes up short in many areas, at least Konami patches in new face scans from time to time. How long has FIFA been rolling with that ridiculously inaccurate David Silva face now? I usually get my option files from Daymos, and to me he does an adequate job of updating player info and likenesses over the course of the season.

# 24 Matt10 @ 09/02/16 09:51 AM

Compared to PES 16, I'm ridiculously excited for this game. I did not expect a full blown out, new, game. I expected a 16.5 with some added tactics. I did not expect a bit more physical game or better ball physics.

When your expectations are as low as it is coming in, it's hard not to get excited about what has already been shown. I remember we had very little information and even breaths of it possibly being a mobile only game, lol.

# 25 RoyceDa59 @ 09/02/16 10:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt10


	Compared to PES 16, I'm ridiculously excited for this game. I did not expect a full blown out, new, game. I expected a 16.5 with some added tactics. I did not expect a bit more physical game or better ball physics. When your expectations are as low as it is coming in, it's hard not to get excited about what has already been shown. I remember we had very little information and even breaths of it possibly being a mobile only game, lol.

I hear you I don't think any of us expected it and it has taken a while for them to get the Fox Engine to work well with the game. Even though I still feel there are little bit of the annoying niggles left over from PES 16 I think we can say they are moving in a positive direction.

# 26 Josam27o7 @ 09/02/16 11:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by orion523


	As far as physics, I'm talking about foot planting, inertia, things like that. In PES, every player feels loose, they turn on a dime and shoot without effort, missed tackles mean nothing, because defenders easily sprint back without penalty. That's the physics I'm talking about.

We all know we're never gonna get a game that does that on default settings. The herd are casual babies. So why do you expect it? That's why they allow you to switch settings. When you switch gamespeed settings all those things you mentioned matter. So I think your entire framing of this issue is off. It's almost like you are playing dumb on purpose -- and that's why I mentioned an ulterior motive possibility.

# 27 Matt10 @ 09/02/16 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Josam27o7


	We all know we're never gonna get a game that does that on default settings. The herd are casual babies. So why do you expect it? That's why they allow you to switch settings. When you switch gamespeed settings all those things you mentioned matter. So I think your entire framing of this issue is off. It's almost like you are playing dumb on purpose -- and that's why I mentioned an ulterior motive possibility.

Now, now - Johnny is a well respected brother of OS, so there's no need to go to those depths. I think the statement made is just out of frustration in hopes of getting that football game that we allwant, and the potential of not having it - for another year (going on X amount of years), boils over once in a while.

FIFA's demo isn't out yet, so there is a hard comparision to draw from, other than PES 17 Demo to FIFA 16 current status, and that is definitely not a valid apples to apples comparison.

Let's see how the continued feedback on the PES demo goes when FIFA demo drops next week.

FWIW, I still stand firmly that you can't compare these two games, just have always felt they're after different things, and their entire interface has different intents. This is why I've never had a problem with getting both, and that's a great problem to have

# 28 BL8001 @ 09/02/16 02:54 PM

I went back to 16 to make a few vids for someone who posted in the demo thread.

It's shocking, the differences.

I went to 2 pes forums last night and was reading through demo threads and was amazed at the amount of people that said "feels like 16" "looks like 16"

I have no clue what demo people are looking at or playing. Maybe they need to go back and play 16 again.

It's night and day and painfully obvious, the differences.

16 is stiffer and the middle of the pitch is wide open always.

17 is pretty damn silky and the D plays much tighter.

Oh yeah, that was the other part of most of the posts at those forums. Feels like 16 followed up by I can't seem to score.

Been awhile since a game truly had me excited for it to come out but PES 17 is doing that right now.

# 29 Josam27o7 @ 09/02/16 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by orion523


	Also, don't think I've ever seen advantage played in any of my games with the demo.

Just played one match and there were two times an advantage was played by the cpu. It's definitely in there. But I do hope the full game improves on the logic of advantages.

# 30 KG @ 09/02/16 09:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Josam27o7


	Just played one match and there were two times an advantage was played by the cpu. It's definitely in there. But I do hope the full game improves on the logic of advantages.

I wish PES had some on-screen notification like FIFA where it lets you know there is an advantage. Sometimes the ref in PES is trailing the play and you can't tell if there's an advantage.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

# 31 orion523 @ 09/02/16 10:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by papinho81


	Hi Orion! As far as I can remember you were not particularly positive about fifa16 neither, right?

No. I though FIFA 16 started out brilliantly, but the succession of patches all but ruined the game for us sim players. The final patch did make some improvements, but overall, yes I would categorize FIFA 16 as a disappointment.
And yes Matt, you are correct. I am completely frustrated with both games inability to "get it right," and make no mistake, neither game has gotten it right this console generation. FIFA 14 was the closest, but that was more or less a port of past gen.

# 32 Fraser G. @ 09/03/16 07:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KG


	I wish PES had some on-screen notification like FIFA where it lets you know there is an advantage. Sometimes the ref in PES is trailing the play and you can't tell if there's an advantage. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

The funny thing is - PES started using a notification-based advantage system in Pro Evolution Soccer 3 (Winning Eleven 7). There's no reason why it can't be added now.

# 33 Gnemi @ 09/03/16 04:14 PM

The more I play the demo, the more I summarize my experiences in one word:

Joy.

It has taken me some time to get used to it, but now I can safely say that I prefer the PES 17 demo gameplay over any football gameplay since PES 5 and 6.

Maybe I'm still overreacting because it's early days and it's only a demo, but I have been keeping my feelings private for fear of blowing things out of proportion. Nonetheless, here are the areas in which I find PES 17 to be vastly superior to any FIFA offering in the last 5 years. Yes, 5 years.

1. Shooting and Passing | Ball Weight: I love the weight of the ball and when it does hit the woodwork or the keeper or a defender's leg, it looks and feels like it had genuine gravity behind it. FIFA, for years, has made deflections look like they hit steel rather than flesh. PES 17 is not perfect, but it's excellent.

2. Dribbling: Auto-feint is fantastic, thanks Nuno for point out how to do that. Now that I've gotten the hang of it, I feel quite competent in tight spaces with just using auto-feint and the special controls button to stop quickly. I even like the dash button much more than the double-tap of the right stick that's used in FIFA. In fact, overall I don't find this category even close. PES 17 is vastly superior to FIFA's dribbling mechanics.

3. Variety: Every single game I've played feels quite different, or at the very least, there is a sort of recipe book for how things will go based on context. This *may* be subject to change and I'm going to be careful with managing my expectations. By the time January rolled around with FIFA 16, it got to the point where it didn't matter if I was playing Bournemouth in August or Real Madrid in a champions league final, the CPU would do the same monotonous crap over and over and over again. I could basically take a smoke break while the CPU attacked (or run out and buy a pack of cigs since I don't smoke).

4. Build-up: the way an attack is put together both by the CPU and by my AI teammates feels fan-effing-tastic. I feel at times, with practice, that I could make my team play like Liverpool in 2013-2014. Conversely, if I want to play back and counter, it feels like an option. There's a sense of freedom in choices and the CPU makes a moderately good dance partner, reacting to whatever I'm doing accordingly, and vice-versa.

5. Aerial game: there is no argument here. Whether it's long-ball, 50/50 challenges, goal kicks, crosses, the way jockeying and aerial affairs are handled through PES is simply superb. In FIFA, I feel like I might as well just flip a coin and pray.

6. Set pieces: no comparison. When you send in a ball from a set piece in FIFA, it's a beach ball that's lofted with zero threat. If you don't go for goal, you're wasting your time. In PES 17, I love that I can finally whip the ball in and give a target man a chance to put his hat on it.

6. Fouls: I think the refs and fouls are extremely good in the PES 17 demo. I love knowing that I can frustrate the CPU into sticking a leg out when guys like Mezil and Iniesta are on the ball. I'm averaging about 4-5 fouls per game, often in dangerous areas of the pitch, which leads me to...

7. CROSSES! - how could I leave this for last? I FRIGGIN' LOVE crossing the ball in PES *and* I love watching the CPU do it. It looks right! There's pace, zip, movement, and quality on the crosses. It's not cheesed like in FIFA where I feel like all I have to do is wait for the exact moment that the CPU defender will sag and I'm guaranteed to score. You can send crosses into the mixer and if your players have the quality aka. Giroud, you have a good chance to at least get your hat on it even if you're defended. You're still not likely to get it on target, but it just looks and feels right.

FWIW, I'm playing on the lightest assisted settings and Superstar with -2 speed. As I get better, I'll do manual.

Now, here are the areas where I feel like PES 17 still needs some help:

1. Tackling is a bit too easy and the CPU dribbles into tackles too frequently. Yes, even on Superstar.

2. Generally, I think the CPU needs a bit more venom, but I'm not sure I'll ever be satisfied there. That said, PES 17 is orders of magnitude better than FIFA 16 in this regard.

3. All the bells and whistles: it's a damn shame, but I know that I might end up having both games this year because I'll love the big shiny ball that EA puts out with all its licenses, presentation, graphics, UI, etc. I understand that Konami are probably broke, but they should at least spend $10-20K on a proper UI/UX designer for their menus. WTF, there is no excuse for this nonsense in 2016! For shame. Even without licenses, they should at least have a beautiful looking interface. That doesn't require FIFA or FA cooperation.

# 34 Josam27o7 @ 09/03/16 05:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by orion523


	The defending AI remains a weak point, with too much space being given up all over the pitch

After consideration, I think Orion is right.

PES 17 is fundamentally broken.

The issue of the CPU ONLY defending when you get close to its box -- the cpu NOT BEING AGGRESSIVE in closing down spaces higher up the pitch -- the cpu d-line ALLOWING PASSES IN FRONT of them too easily -- .... it makes this game severely lacking. While it can be challenging to break down the cpu around its box, it is too easy to reach the cpu's box (that part of PES is broken). RIP PES 17 -- It's a shame bc everything else in the game is good enough to enjoy.

# 35 RoyceDa59 @ 09/03/16 06:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Josam27o7


	After consideration, I think Orion is right. PES 17 is fundamentally broken. The issue of the CPU ONLY defending when you get close to its box -- the cpu NOT BEING AGGRESSIVE in closing down spaces higher up the pitch -- the cpu d-line ALLOWING PASSES IN FRONT of them too easily -- .... it makes this game severely lacking. While it can be challenging to break down the cpu around its box, it is too easy to reach the cpu's box (that part of PES is broken). RIP PES 17 -- It's a shame bc everything else in the game is good enough to enjoy.

Kinda hard to judge this properly in a demo where another half of tactics are locked and can't be changed. Plus I truly don't find this to be the case all the time especially on Top Player difficulty. There are times when the Cpu is trailing or tied late in the match when they will press you right in your own half at a goal kick. Things like this force you kick down the field out of fear of losing the ball in your half.

# 36 Matt10 @ 09/03/16 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gnemi


	The more I play the demo, the more I summarize my experiences in one word: Joy. It has taken me some time to get used to it, but now I can safely say that I prefer the PES 17 demo gameplay over any football gameplay since PES 5 and 6. Maybe I'm still overreacting because it's early days and it's only a demo, but I have been keeping my feelings private for fear of blowing things out of proportion. Nonetheless, here are the areas in which I find PES 17 to be vastly superior to any FIFA offering in the last 5 years. Yes, 5 years. 1. Shooting and Passing \| Ball Weight: I love the weight of the ball and when it does hit the woodwork or the keeper or a defender's leg, it looks and feels like it had genuine gravity behind it. FIFA, for years, has made deflections look like they hit steel rather than flesh. PES 17 is not perfect, but it's excellent. 2. Dribbling: Auto-feint is fantastic, thanks Nuno for point out how to do that. Now that I've gotten the hang of it, I feel quite competent in tight spaces with just using auto-feint and the special controls button to stop quickly. I even like the dash button much more than the double-tap of the right stick that's used in FIFA. In fact, overall I don't find this category even close. PES 17 is vastly superior to FIFA's dribbling mechanics. 3. Variety: Every single game I've played feels quite different, or at the very least, there is a sort of recipe book for how things will go based on context. This may be subject to change and I'm going to be careful with managing my expectations. By the time January rolled around with FIFA 16, it got to the point where it didn't matter if I was playing Bournemouth in August or Real Madrid in a champions league final, the CPU would do the same monotonous crap over and over and over again. I could basically take a smoke break while the CPU attacked (or run out and buy a pack of cigs since I don't smoke). 4. Build-up: the way an attack is put together both by the CPU and by my AI teammates feels fan-effing-tastic. I feel at times, with practice, that I could make my team play like Liverpool in 2013-2014. Conversely, if I want to play back and counter, it feels like an option. There's a sense of freedom in choices and the CPU makes a moderately good dance partner, reacting to whatever I'm doing accordingly, and vice-versa. 5. Aerial game: there is no argument here. Whether it's long-ball, 50/50 challenges, goal kicks, crosses, the way jockeying and aerial affairs are handled through PES is simply superb. In FIFA, I feel like I might as well just flip a coin and pray. 6. Set pieces: no comparison. When you send in a ball from a set piece in FIFA, it's a beach ball that's lofted with zero threat. If you don't go for goal, you're wasting your time. In PES 17, I love that I can finally whip the ball in and give a target man a chance to put his hat on it. 6. Fouls: I think the refs and fouls are extremely good in the PES 17 demo. I love knowing that I can frustrate the CPU into sticking a leg out when guys like Mezil and Iniesta are on the ball. I'm averaging about 4-5 fouls per game, often in dangerous areas of the pitch, which leads me to... 7. CROSSES! - how could I leave this for last? I FRIGGIN' LOVE crossing the ball in PES and I love watching the CPU do it. It looks right! There's pace, zip, movement, and quality on the crosses. It's not cheesed like in FIFA where I feel like all I have to do is wait for the exact moment that the CPU defender will sag and I'm guaranteed to score. You can send crosses into the mixer and if your players have the quality aka. Giroud, you have a good chance to at least get your hat on it even if you're defended. You're still not likely to get it on target, but it just looks and feels right. FWIW, I'm playing on the lightest assisted settings and Superstar with -2 speed. As I get better, I'll do manual. Now, here are the areas where I feel like PES 17 still needs some help: 1. Tackling is a bit too easy and the CPU dribbles into tackles too frequently. Yes, even on Superstar. 2. Generally, I think the CPU needs a bit more venom, but I'm not sure I'll ever be satisfied there. That said, PES 17 is orders of magnitude better than FIFA 16 in this regard. 3. All the bells and whistles: it's a damn shame, but I know that I might end up having both games this year because I'll love the big shiny ball that EA puts out with all its licenses, presentation, graphics, UI, etc. I understand that Konami are probably broke, but they should at least spend $10-20K on a proper UI/UX designer for their menus. WTF, there is no excuse for this nonsense in 2016! For shame. Even without licenses, they should at least have a beautiful looking interface. That doesn't require FIFA or FA cooperation.

Well said, man. Definitely agree with everything and also the UI/UX importance.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Josam27o7


	After consideration, I think Orion is right. PES 17 is fundamentally broken. The issue of the CPU ONLY defending when you get close to its box -- the cpu NOT BEING AGGRESSIVE in closing down spaces higher up the pitch -- the cpu d-line ALLOWING PASSES IN FRONT of them too easily -- .... it makes this game severely lacking. While it can be challenging to break down the cpu around its box, it is too easy to reach the cpu's box (that part of PES is broken). RIP PES 17 -- It's a shame bc everything else in the game is good enough to enjoy.

A bit dramatic response, don't you think? Just remember that the implementation of all these tactics, advanced or not, have to be complimented by the right formations and especially line height.

Quote:

Originally Posted by RoyceDa59


	Kinda hard to judge this properly in a demo where another half of tactics are locked and can't be changed. Plus I truly don't find this to be the case all the time especially on Top Player difficulty. There are times when the Cpu is trailing or tied late in the match when they will press you right in your own half at a goal kick. Things like this force you kick down the field out of fear of losing the ball in your half.

Yea, same here, Royce. I've settled on Top Player as well. Once we get all the greyed-out options, then we can truly process what this game is going to really be like.

# 37 Thrash13 @ 09/03/16 06:57 PM

I agree with pretty much everything Gnemi posted about this game! One of the areas he mentioned is the ball weight, and that's so true and a definite positive. Kicking the ball in PES sounds so much more like real life than FIFA. Kinda crazy, but it's probably the first thing I noticed after playing PES 2017 and FIFA 16 back-to-back earlier this week.

PES 2017 seems to have more of the "little things" when it comes to replicating real-life soccer.

# 38 BL8001 @ 09/03/16 07:11 PM

The defensive pressure to me seems fine.

I watch plenty of the sport and quite often see teams constrict towards their own box allowing the team on offense to push up but not into the box.

If you are scoring often because of this then that would be an issue.

I just see the cpu collapsing to protect the goal and me not succeeding in scoring and now they have the ball.

Truly fifa aggravates me more because the defense there relies too much on that damn 1 on 1 toe poke as its main method of ball turnover.

In reality ball turnover mostly occurs through a poorly played ball creating a 50/50 (or worse odds for the offense) situation where the ball is briefly fought for and possession changes.

How often do you see a player step out, challenge a player for the ball and win it? It's too risky which is why it does not happen often.

What I am talking about is offense pushing towards defense situations.

When play is chaotic and nothing is being set up or field position being claimed them yes, this is where challenges fly in and more risky defending takes place.

# 39 Gnemi @ 09/03/16 09:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BL8001


	The defensive pressure to me seems fine. Truly fifa aggravates me more because the defense there relies too much on that damn 1 on 1 toe poke as its main method of ball turnover. How often do you see a player step out, challenge a player for the ball and win it? It's too risky which is why it does not happen often.

I agree with you wholeheartedly, but here's the problem with your latter point: it's fairly easy to regularly nick the ball off the CPU in exactly that way. However, the reverse is not as true in PES 17.

In FIFA, the precise opposite of this is the problem. They program the CPU to defend through magical toe-poke tackles more than anything else.

--

Overall, there is a larger issue here that comes down to optics and preferences. I say this every year, but the task for these programmers, whether it's PES or FIFA, is to simulate what occurs over the course of 90 minutes in a mere 20. Think about that very hard before putting on the trifocals and scrutinizing every single pixel of gameplay.

Something has to be done to create chances and goals, not to mention wins and losses. If the CPU defended like real footballers, well, for 20 minutes you'd be lucky to see more than three or four *chances*, period, let alone shots or shots on target.

Optically, I like the way PES 17 is configured. Play vacillates, it's fluid, and at times, yes, it's quite open. But no matter what, it's incredibly varied in the way action on the pitch progresses and my WORD is it fun.

Maybe I've been institutionalized by the effing god-awful FIFA 15 and, to a much lesser extent, FIFA 16. I just know that I am not buying FIFA day one. There is a lot riding on their demo, I can tell you that.

By the way, I probably disagreed with most people in thinking that FIFA 16 ended up being one of the best ever versions of FIFA. I'm just having much more fun with the PES 17 demo, enough so that I quit my very beloved Everton career in FIFA 16...after 8 seasons. *sniff* RIP

I'm pouring one out for you, lads! Except you, John Stones. You can go fornicate yourself, traitor!

# 40 BL8001 @ 09/03/16 10:03 PM

Yep the 1 thing keeping PES from amazing greatness.

Shielding, a shield button, shielding mechanics, etc.

If the cpu was better at simply turning and shielding then the user could not steal it so easy.

I miss a dedicated shielding button so much when I play this game, yes, you can let go of everything, squeeze sprint only and then left stick away to sort of shield but it does not always make the player shield, it's based too much on what the defender is doing and where they are located on the pitch.

This is the 1 thing intriguing me about fifa this year, the revamped shield mechanic.

But if pes had this the cpu could turn and shield, drawing a foul maybe but more than anything protecting the ball at the cost of advancing it, but retaining possession.

Meanwhile I would not have to turn away from pressure, squeeze RT(my sprint button) over and over pointing the stick trying and hoping the shield animation kicks in.

Shame is PES has a shielding animation and it looks very cool.

I have not seen the cpu shield during any of my play sessions.

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