Shot Aiming = No Consistency

[Kushmir]

So after testing the New Shot Stick Aiming my issues remain the same, I just can't see where it was necessary.

Especially given the Legacy Issues that really needed OVERHAUL like Transition/Help Defense, Passing, the Steal System, Screen Interaction and really fleshing out/providing depth to User Contests and adding a NO SWITCHING option on defense.

What stands out the most tho? Its INCONSISTENCY. You want us to aim for the target right? OK FINE. Is our starting Aim Point picked at random or is it based on the direction/intensity of the defense? Here's Kawhi shooting jumpers in practice where my AP starts left of center....



That is until the last shot which randomly starts on the extreme right. Why? Is gameplay just screwing with me? Like, what? That feels like a puzzle game--not basketball.

If the defense was coming from the left with high intensity or if i'm moving right then ok maybe it represents how I have to correct a bit...but i'm shooting in the gym by myself, soooo...what gives?

Worse? The post game which is nothing but intuitive/feel is now turned inside out. Keep in mind we have controls for the different moves we make...and those have to be satisfied first and THEN we have to aim. Errrr...who drew that up? I hate to be that guy but that's flat-out bad design.

An example: Shot Aiming is easiest when pointing down and then adjusting the Aim Point accordingly. Here's the thing, in the post that's fading away from the basket. Which is a rare skill-set:



Ask any post technician, the hook is a staple because the defenders options are limited (remember that fleshed out User Contest I mentioned above?) and I can vary my timing with a quick move that has tons of variety. Most users are gonna try to block it which is the worst way to defend it. But guess what? Hook is UP on the Shot Stick--the complete opposite of the optimal way to use Shot Aiming. Here I just hold up and luckily my starting Aim Point is right on target. But pointing up and then adjusting your Aim Point is super clunky....at some point we're adding lag and user defenders? YIKES.



Keep in mind i've got no way to see how the defender reacts (which is job #1) because I have to be totally fixated on Shot Aiming. THAT'S BAD DESIGN.

Another great post move is the counter hook. Basically lead the defense one way and then execute the hook opposite. Guess what tho? That involves pointing the Shot Stick right or left...with the Shot Aiming we now have to do all that and THEN AIM before the shooting animation finishes:



Do you see why elite post guys are asking if the Legacy controls still exist?

Another great post move is the baseline fall-away. Its super quick and its basically you vs the shot meter. But here again, you have to do the command first (right or left away from the defender) and then AIM as the stick is left or right. AGAIN: Bad Design.



The Coup De Grace is a move that you can usually setup after hitting a few post fade-aways. The Up/Under...in short after first faking (keep in mind we can't really watch the defender to see if he bites) and then finishing towards the rim and then finally AIMING, i've seen Mortal Combat Finishing Combos that were less complicated. It will have you confused and literally not knowing Up from Down:



In closing, there's no way Shot Aiming was developed with the post game in mind. And that THIS was prioritized over known Legacy issues? NO WORDS.

[Erithtotl]

What I don't get is they've basically replaced one basic skill, timing, with another basic skill, aiming. From what people are saying timing doesn't matter on aiming. So how this is more 'skill based' I don't know.

[The 24th Letter]

As someone who loves the post, I would have to respectfully disagree.

Not liking it? I completely understand if you have given it a fair shake and learned its nuances. I do however, think there is a fair bit of overthinking and overadjusting when it comes to shot aiming.

This is coming naturally day 2:

https://streamable.com/fxx616

I can adjust to the defender pretty easily and convert without an overabundance of stick work or being overly concerned with the meter. Honestly, I'm beginning to see why Mike is talking about adjustments as people catch on.

- To your shooting concerns

I'm not sure what changes your starting point. I assumed it was where you began your launch on the stick. Maybe Mike can clear that up. There are a lot of times I dont even have to make any adjustments on shots though.

In any event, the option to revert to 2K20 controls is fully available at launch right?

[mb625]

The bone I'd have to pick here is that those legacy issues are, indeed, improved. I have seen some plain awesome AI rotations off of help defense and some quite good transition D that has shut down breaks for me. A lot of these things seem very well refined.

I also kinda like the shot stick (need to work with it more, but I like it) and think that it kinda works well with the post game myself.

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk

[pietasterp]

I'm in total agreement w/ the OP and Erithtotl. To me, the whole thing seems unnecessary and unintuitive. When you shoot a real basketball, of course you're incorporating a lot of variables and data, but it all happens intuitively, it's not like you feel like you're aiming significantly left or right or adjusting in the middle of your shot (most of the time). It's mostly timing, which is why the original mechanism was fine. With this new system, it definitely does feel like they've just replaced a timing skill with an aiming skill, which seems....arbitrary and/or unnecessary.

[Kushmir]

Quote: Originally Posted by The 24th Letter

As someone who loves the post, I would have to respectfully disagree.

I know you do lol. And you definitely did your thing with Lopez ...it just feels counter-intuitive and I feel like more and more we're being asked to focus on meters instead of the game world/defender. Gotta be honest....I don't support that philosophy AT ALL. The option to revert to 2K20 controls is definitely a must-have for me.

[Yeah...THAT Guy]

I don't necessarily hate the new mechanic. I like that if you're off to the right, the shot misses to the right. It also seems like this might be good for people that get thrown off by input lag online and stuff since this theoretically won't be messed up as much as trying to time a shot would.

I think I'll almost certainly revert to the 2K20 controls if it's actually an option though. I just much prefer not needing to look at the shooting meters when I'm playing.

I also wonder how annoying it will be that if they make all meters visible to everyone online, we'll all more or less know where rebounds are headed on every shot that goes up. Granted with the way rebounding has been implemented in past 2K's, there's very little skill involved anyways, but it is what it is.

[Kushmir]

Quote: Originally Posted by mb625

The bone I'd have to pick here is that those legacy issues are, indeed, improved. I have seen some plain awesome AI rotations off of help defense and some quite good transition D that has shut down breaks for me. A lot of these things seem very well refined.

Glad to hear it, but those are my floor--I have to be honest. I won't even consider the game without competent Help /Transition defense.

I just can't rationalize this change knowing they probably don't have the option for 2K19 play-calling, a NO SWITCHING option on D, guys tagging out to avoid mismatches, calling plays in timeouts and putting plays on repeat not to mention a fleshed out Contest.

I haven't even mentioned Passing Variety, and giving the game a Risk/Reward foundation overall, but especially in relation to Steals and Blocks. There are just too many Legacy Issues that had priority IMO.