I ran a quick scoring logic experiment.

[Plebn]

So there was a thread here a few days ago discussing scoring logic & it's been a cause for concern for me since the release, I have lost so many decisions due to people exploiting sub attempts that the know they can not get. So i decided to make a video to prove my point. This one failed submission clearly out weighs 2 significant strikes, 3 total landed and 6 blocked strikes, as well as almost 90 seconds of control with 1 take down. Nothing else happened in the fight.

[johnmangala]

Interesting, didn't know subs scored so well. GNP and control should score more too.

[Skynet]

Thanks a ton for the video and concise feedback! I'm going to look into this right away and hopefully we can find the cause of this imbalance.

If we do in fact find something funny is going on, I would hope to get it fixed for the next patch

[fballturkey]

Good work. Subs felt overscored but I didn’t have the numbers to back up the hunch.

[Evil97]

Thanks for taking to the time to experiment. I have been meaning to do it but only get a couple hours in when the kids go to bed so it's not something I want to waste. Sub attempts are so overly scored it drives me crazy.

[Plebn]

Quote: Originally Posted by Skynet

Thanks a ton for the video and concise feedback! I'm going to look into this right away and hopefully we can find the cause of this imbalance. If we do in fact find something funny is going on, I would hope to get it fixed for the next patch

This is great news. I would suggest that submissions should score very very little, if at all, until the final gate of the submission. This would be harder to balance with 1, 2 & 3 gate subs, though.

[EarvGotti]

Quote: Originally Posted by Plebn

This is great news. I would suggest that submissions should score very very little, if at all, until the final gate of the submission. This would be harder to balance with 1, 2 & 3 gate subs, though.

I agree. Either make submission denial windows much larger or make sub attempts only score anything at all if they make it to the last gate.

[Boiler569]

To the last gate --- or at least, get past a couple of gates before it counts for much on scorecard

Otherwise perhaps it just counts as 'control time'

"In Real Life" ---- if someone grabbed a Kimura, but didn't advance it at all for a couple minutes --- would judges give them tons of points? Or consider it more of a stall technique?

I'm not sure the answer haha

If you get someone into a sub, and it fails, you should probably get rewarded some, but definitely not a ton.

This video was interesting. I definitely had a feeling failed subs were very important to judges and it looks to be the case.

(Aren't the three judges also 'different' insofar as one of them really prefers Grappling; one Striking; and one is a blend? That's what it was in UFC 2 I believe I heard a dev state....same in UFC 3?)