2K Bring Back Shading: Who Uses Cutoff.....?

[DatGD12guage]

First of all WHO in the HEEEELLLLL is mo capping these defensive interactions. Can we get elite on ball NBA defenders to mo cap defensive animations.

They need to mo cap everything defense on jumping picks, fighting thru pick(shading has ALOT to do with pick n roll defense), closeouts, hand checks, contests and REAL cutoff animations.

Why in the HEEELLLLL was shading taken out again? Replaced with......a cutoff jump? Did anybody use the cutoff jump?

Well now the cutoff jump is gone and we have complete hands up defense. Does anybody use the hands up defense? While the hands up defense position looks like a good defensive stance what is the point if you lose lateral quickness like what exactly is the point other than it looks good. Where is the tutorial on where this hands up animation gives you an advantage and why we should use it. I'm talking about the STANCE.

One of the most effective tools in playing on ball defense is shading and taking angles. In the video Kawhi is taking angles. Ironically Kawhi is in sort of the hands up STANCE you can get in on NBA 2K17 But you lose lateral quickness and you cannot shade, atleast not completely manual in a shade stance.

Don't get me wrong its some guys, VERY FEW that play NBA 2k and actually used angles against me BUT its kind of hard bc you cannot lock into that stance and switch your shade stance manually like kawhi did in which if we had that tool........it would really show defensive skill. I also want to add that some bump animations knock your defender out of position.


The contact animations and cutoff bumps would trigger and make a lot more sense if we had the shade defense back bc nobody likes the contact animation so he is not going to run to the side you are playing him UNLESS he want that smoke, its more fun and strategic just by adding that one scenario. I'm just trying to understand why 2k keeps taking away and adding tools on defense that nobody really uses vs keeping the ones that work way more effective and just adding on to those.

Like if we had the shade to pair with the hands up stance without losing lateral quickness that would be MUCH more useful than what we have now.

Maybe we need a bring shade defense back poll. Maybe 2k just needs a dam poll section in the forums to just ask the community different questions Idk but they have been doing some questionable xxxx.

[fluent2332]

Quote: Originally Posted by DatGD12guage

First of all WHO in the HEEEELLLLL is mo capping these defensive interactions. Can we get elite on ball NBA defenders to mo cap defensive animations. They need to mo cap everything defense on jumping picks, fighting thru pick(shading has ALOT to do with pick n roll defense), closeouts, hand checks, contests and REAL cutoff animations. Why in the HEEELLLLL was shading taken out again? Replaced with......a cutoff jump? Did anybody use the cutoff jump? Well now the cutoff jump is gone and we have complete hands up defense. Does anybody use the hands up defense? While the hands up defense position looks like a good defensive stance what is the point if you lose lateral quickness like what exactly is the point other than it looks good. Where is the tutorial on where this hands up animation gives you an advantage and why we should use it. I'm talking about the STANCE. One of the most effective tools in playing on ball defense is shading and taking angles. In the video Kawhi is taking angles. Ironically Kawhi is in sort of the hands up STANCE you can get in on NBA 2K17 But you lose lateral quickness and you cannot shade, atleast not completely manual in a shade stance. Don't get me wrong its some guys, VERY FEW that play NBA 2k and actually used angles against me BUT its kind of hard bc you cannot lock into that stance and switch your shade stance manually like kawhi did in which if we had that tool........it would really show defensive skill. I also want to add that some bump animations knock your defender out of position. The contact animations and cutoff bumps would trigger and make a lot more sense if we had the shade defense back bc nobody likes the contact animation so he is not going to run to the side you are playing him UNLESS he want that smoke, its more fun and strategic just by adding that one scenario. I'm just trying to understand why 2k keeps taking away and adding tools on defense that nobody really uses vs keeping the ones that work way more effective and just adding on to those. Like if we had the shade to pair with the hands up stance without losing lateral quickness that would be MUCH more useful than what we have now. Maybe we need a bring shade defense back poll. Maybe 2k just needs a dam poll section in the forums to just ask the community different questions Idk but they have been doing some questionable xxxx.

Defense is all about angles. I recall there being a shade button in either NBA Live 10 or previous 2Ks. You could force the offensive player to go left or right.

I never use hands-up D because it's pretty much been pointless in the game since it's been in. Trigger "defensive stance" was much more effective in past 2K games. Even in the paint you could better defend with proper use of the trigger defense. I never really found a good use for hands-up D as long as I've really been playing the 2K series...

[killu4what]

Quote: Originally Posted by fluent2332

Defense is all about angles. I recall there being a shade button in either NBA Live 10 or previous 2Ks. You could force the offensive player to go left or right. I never use hands-up D because it's pretty much been pointless in the game since it's been in. Trigger "defensive stance" was much more effective in past 2K games. Even in the paint you could better defend with proper use of the trigger defense. I never really found a good use for hands-up D as long as I've really been playing the 2K series...

I believe more fouls are called when using the "trigger"

[fluent2332]

Quote: Originally Posted by killu4what

I believe more fouls are called when using the "trigger"

True, but I don't think it's meant to be used 100% of the time. I think a simple "feathering" of the trigger can work better in some situations. Even in 2K16 the trigger would cause fouls at times as well as even trigger your player to jump at pump fakes or shots.

I'm just saying I've never found a good use for the hands-up defense in 2K games. It is about as effective as the jab step or a dribble-gather jumpshot in their games.

[BegBy]

Watch the video. Note you never see any of the defensive interactive animations that you see in 2K. He's arguably the best perimeter defender in the game, yet guys still run along side him...guys explode past him. They don't get sucked into a body up animation. They don't run into him and bounce off him like a rubber ball. You don't see guys trip and fall, nor do you see them stumble. Guys don't instantly get pulled into him while he's behind them and come to a complete stop while he's jamming his forearms into their back. Again - he is a world class NBA defender.

Play 2K. Every defender makes him look like an amateur. Even if you do beat your defender (while often times looking like you're making an And1 mixtape) you'll just get sucked into another defender that slides into you, or your original defender will morph through you and make you stumble and lose your dribble. Don't dare try to use turbo - that engages ultra defender!

I'm a broken record, but the defense in this game is beyond bad. The individual defenders, their reaction times, physicality, ability to defy the laws of physics and ability to turn their opponents into window licking invalids who literally can't run and dribble is impressively staggering. Paralleled only by how the same exact defender, when playing off ball, will quite literally run out of bounds, get stuck on his teammate or just plain stop trying while guarding his ai controlled counterpart.

How are we supposed to accept that one player can quite literally be the universes best on ball defender, defying the laws of the organization that employs him and the laws of physics, and then be quite possibly the victim of an instant surprise lobotomy that renders him all but useless?

The lazy programming has got to go. Time to scrap their current model and focus on obeying the NBA rules, the rules of physics and adopt the defensive philosophy of every single basketball coach and player on the planet. Stop trying to reinvent the wheel. Real defense is a thing and they need to emulate it and not rely on inhuman one on one interactions.

Assuming they won't do this, since it's been their defensive philosophy for years, they should send every NBA player the memo for the life cheat code that makes it so when Westbrook or Wall (or anyone for that matter) decides to turn on the jets and blow past them they can activate said cheat and instantly make their opponent come to a dead stop without being called for a foul. Sadly the NBA will lose gobs of money and be a dead organization within a season or 2 because absolutley nobody would want to watch, but it'd be 2K realistic.

[urjaywall]

Quote: Originally Posted by fluent2332

Defense is all about angles. I recall there being a shade button in either NBA Live 10 or previous 2Ks. You could force the offensive player to go left or right. I never use hands-up D because it's pretty much been pointless in the game since it's been in. Trigger "defensive stance" was much more effective in past 2K games. Even in the paint you could better defend with proper use of the trigger defense. I never really found a good use for hands-up D as long as I've really been playing the 2K series...

Yeah, I've always tried to prevent the CPU from even trying to attack the basket. If you are in the right spot defensively, they usually pass rather than go right at you.

The only thing I hate this year is when you know the game engine has predetermined the player is going to attack (they keep trying over and over, or start doing break down dribbles), but your defensive stance is too squirly to keep up. That's been my experience. So I jump to the right side but overreact and they go by, then I try to use a big man under for help defense, but it takes a good 5 seconds for them to actually turn around, move and get into the spot. The response time is too slow for help defense.

But yes... all about angles. I agree. Positioning and angles. You need to predict what the offense is going to do. That's what the best defenders in the NBA are able to do (just like the best point guards spot weakness in the defense when they pass).

[fluent2332]

Quote: Originally Posted by urjaywall

Yeah, I've always tried to prevent the CPU from even trying to attack the basket. If you are in the right spot defensively, they usually pass rather than go right at you. The only thing I hate this year is when you know the game engine has predetermined the player is going to attack (they keep trying over and over, or start doing break down dribbles), but your defensive stance is too squirly to keep up. That's been my experience. So I jump to the right side but overreact and they go by, then I try to use a big man under for help defense, but it takes a good 5 seconds for them to actually turn around, move and get into the spot. The response time is too slow for help defense. But yes... all about angles. I agree. Positioning and angles. You need to predict what the offense is going to do. That's what the best defenders in the NBA are able to do (just like the best point guards spot weakness in the defense when they pass).

I didn't have that problem with last year's game. On higher difficulties it can be *really* tough to stay in front of CPU ballhandlers (or human ones, for that matter). But once you play the CPU enough you start to get pretty good at defending it.

The higher difficulties let the CPU "notice" every slight positioning mistake in man defense, so if you are slightly out of position they will attack. It is pretty good practice for online matches, though. I also find that playing a bit more aggressively on defense is often better than laying back too much. If you lay back on D and let them get a head of steam, you're in trouble.