Elite QB vs. Game Manager: A Disccussion

[jWILL253]

So, as a Seahawks fan, I see a lot of arguments about Russell Wilson's talent at the QB position daily. Opinions tend to range from "He's a top tier QB" to "He's a (now overpaid) game manager, and the wheels will fall off once the defense regresses and Marshawn retires." The funny thing about the latter argument is the fact that I've never really heard that particular point about any other QB who happens to play with a great defense/RB.

So, I've decided to do a little research (read: so much Googling I have carpel tunnel) into what separates a nearly average QB from a good one, and what turns a good one into a great one. I'll be using three QB's as examples for those three qualifiers, and I'll be examining those QB's in three categories:

1. Statistical performance (Pro & College)
2. Personnel
3. Impact

Let's start with a player that everyone considers to be the quintessential game manager QB.



If you were to look at Trent Dilfer's collegiate stats without knowing anything about his pro career, you never would've guessed that he was the most managing-*** game manager to ever play the game.

1. Stats:

College:

• 1992: 188/360 ATT, 3,000 yds, 21 TD vs 14 INT
• 1993: 254/396 for 3,799 yards with 30 TD vs 5 INT. Won the Sammy Baugh Award.

For his pro stats, we're gonna focus on his years in Tampa Bay and his lone year in Baltimore, as these years were his most productive:

• 1995 Tampa Bay 224/415 ATT 54.0% 2774 yd 6.7 avg 4 TD 18 INT 60.1 QBR
• 1996 Tampa Bay 267/482 ATT 55.4% 2859 yd 5.9 avg 12 TD 19 INT 64.8 QBR
• 1997 Tampa Bay 217/386 ATT 56.2% 2555 yd 6.6 avg 21 TD 11 INT 82.8 QBR
• 1998 Tampa Bay 225/429 ATT 52.4% 2729 yd 6.4 avg 21 TD 15 INT 74.0 QBR
• 1999 Tampa Bay 146/244 ATT 59.8% 1619 yd 6.6 avg 11 TD 11 INT 75.8 QBR
• 2000 Baltimore 134/226 ATT 59.3% 1502 yd 6.6 avg 12 TD 11 INT 76.6 QBR

(source: Da wiki)

So, basically what we have here is a QB who started out absolutely terrible, and progressed to merely "adequate" as his career went on. He never had a completion percentage over 59% in his entire career, and only threw more than 20 TD's twice. He's never hit the 3,000 yard mark either, and his career QBR sits at 70.2.

Now, when you look at his ATT numbers in his best statistical year, 1997, you'll see that Dilfer never went over 33 ATT's. In fact, he's only finished with over 400 attempts in a season three times, and in two of those seasons, he finished with significantly less TD's than INT's. So obviously, he's a player who can perform at a decent level if you limit his opportunities to make fatal mistakes.

2. Personnel

http://www.pro-football-reference.co...D/DilfTr00.htm

Dilfer is known for his lone year in Baltimore, as that was the year they won the Super Bowl. As you can see above, his stats for that year were about as average as average can be. It's no argument that he was surrounded by a great running back in Jamal Lewis, and a defense lead by Ray Lewis that ranks amongst the greatest.

However, Dilfer's best years were in 1997 & 1998, when he was still in Tampa Bay. I decided to do a little digging on both of these teams... and it turns out that these were the Tony Dungy era Buccanneers, lead by a Top 5 defense, and with a young Warrick Dunn & Mike Alstott heading up the running game (and the receiving game, as no notable WR on the depth chart finished with more than 51 receptions in either year). However, neither offense in either year finished higher than 18th.

To be honest, I'm kind of baffled here. There was way more offensive talent on the Ravens' Super Bowl roster (Lewis, Shannon Sharpe, Priest Homes) than there was on either of Tampa Bay's notable rosters, and yet Dilfer somehow managed to perform worse statistically on the Ravens, Super Bowl victory aside

3. Impact

I wouldn't blame you if any of you all thought that the backhanded compliment that is "game manager" was created solely as a shorthand for "Trent Dilfer". Simply put, his best praise was that he didn't make mistakes, despite his general lack of :wow: in his ability. And honestly, the statistics support it. He was able to visit the postseason two times, simply based on his proficiency to NOT **** it all up.

Next time, I'll take a look at a QB who no one doubts as one of the better QB's in football. Stay tuned to find out who it is.

As a conversation starter, what are the things you guys think separate QB's in terms of their abilities?

[TripleCrown9]

Russell Wilson's basic.

Spoiler

Just wanted to say it before kingkilla and dsallupinyaarea for once.

[ProfessaPackMan]

Man just say that you don't think Wilson is a "game manager" and that he's an elite QB. You know damn sure you want to, lol.

[TripleCrown9]

Quote: Originally Posted by ProfessaPackMan

Man just say that you don't think Wilson is a "game manager" and that he's an elite QB. You know damn sure you want to, lol.

Nah, man. He's got a whole series of posts planned out leading up to that.

[jWILL253]

Can you just comment on the OP, please?

[ProfessaPackMan]

Bruh, just post all the other QBs you're going to use as examples to prove/convince folks that Wilson is more than a game manager and should be considered an elite QB, since it's obvious this is where the thread will eventually head anyway.

Not even sure what you're trying to say with the Dilfer comparison because it's not like Wilson has ever gotten compared to him at all since the situations with him and Dilfer in Baltimore were completely different.

[thaima1shu]

Spoiler

[jWILL253]

I wasn't even gonna mention Russell outside of the OP. I was just using him as an example of a QB that tends to be divisive when it comes to what people think of what people consider to be a good or bad QB.

I was actually gonna use Andrew Luck & Matt Ryan as "good" & "great" examples, and examine what separates them as players. I was waiting until I had found all the data, photos, etc. to support my research into them.