the Good, the Bad and the Ugly; theSliderWhizperer’s M15 - GAME CHANGER SLIDERS

[theSliderWhisperer]

the Wiz, is back!

After taking a year off from hosting a Madden slider thread, I am back, and with a new gloss; theSliderWhisperer....

New gloss, same ol' Wiz....

The title of my thread seems apropos for this years M15 title; the Good, the Bad and the Ugly. I believe this is a very GOOD Madden title, but at times the glitches deliver a BAD taste in your mouth, often creating a real UGLY gaming experience.

For Madden veterans, what's new? Just another year, and another six months of anguish to bend and twist Madden into a playable, realistic sim of the game we all worship, F-O-O-T-B-A-L-L baby...

Initially I had NO INTENTION of creating and hosting a thread, but after reading and receiving so much anguish regarding M15 and its glitches, theSliderWhisperer decided to offer his "dos centavos (.02)" and throw his observations into the mix...

Heeeeeere we goooooo....


This is a beta slider mix that I have glossed "Hallow's Eve" slider brew.

The “Hallow’s Eve” slider brew is a beta slider concoction that theSliderWhisperer has created to tame the following annoying issues with M15:

1) CPU QB sack glitch
2) CPU Robo-QB completion percentages
3) Statistical and metric relevancy for CFM gameplay that mirrors NFL stats and metrics


Please note that the beta sliders do not propose, nor represent FIXING the aforementioned issues, simply another way to attack issues that has plagued M15 thus far.

Now before we get started on our maiden voyage, some house cleaning is in order:

1) theSliderWhisperer and his posse have played well over 100 CFM games with the beta sliders listed below. All quirks have been documented, and the sliders are a work in progress, MEANING they are NOT a FINAL release, simply a beta version for all to test and comment on.

2) theSliderWhisperer’s skill level and football acumen is top notch. These sliders were tuned to provide theSliderWhisperer a serious challenge and no gimmies. The game play may be quite the challenge for some to compete with, be patient, STICK WITH IT. Trust me, the CPU is beatable, however YOU NEED TO KNOW how to stop the run and how to PROPERLY scheme pass coverages, especially how to shut down the flats with defensive pre-sets before the snap. These sliders, just like any sliders, cannot address your lack of knowledge or stick/button skills and/or lack of ability to properly scheme a football game on the defensive and/or offensive side.

3) The slider brew is INTER-DEPENDENT, meaning that you cannot just move one slider and not have it impact another part of the playing experience, especially with the PEN SLIDERS. Tweak at your own risk, but be warned that extreme tweaking can lead to disastrous game play.

4) theSliderWhisperer plans on testing out several more theories and ideas before closing the door for business on his M15 sliders and branding the sliders as final.

5) These beta sliders were tested on a regular EA roster, with NO EDITS, so it is theSliderWhisperer’s assumption that they are good to go for several, if not dozens, of franchise years.

6) Please, please, PUUUUUUUUUUUHLEASE refrain from comments that indicate that by raising the SPEEDTHRESH, your “blankity blank” cannot get separation from the pack....This is simply NOT TRUE! In the 100+ CFM games that my posse and I have played, we have had our fair share of TD’s on sweeps, up the gut runs, kick returns, punt returns, bubble screens, etc. Fast dudes, out run slow dudes, PERIOD. Do not confuse a smart angle taken by defensive player as that defensive player having caught up with you.

7) theSliderWhisperer is considering working on an ALL-MADDEN slider brew. Be patient. In the meantime, have at it with this concoction, just change the skill level to All-Madden.

8) theSliderWhisperer will not be too active in following up on questions. Post your concern, question, and theSliderWhisperer will try his best to follow up, NO PROMISES though....

9) Areas that are still being tested include: HUM statistical output for the offense, total amount of turnovers for a season (fumbles and picks), YAC, YAR, Avg. Pass Yards/Attempt, Avg. Rush Yards/Attempt, AutoSubs, Kicking game, setting for injuries, yada, yada, yada....This is why they are called BETA SLIDERS

10) Sacrifices NEEDED to be made to tame the glitches. Among them are low penalties being called. Also, occasionally, weird animation sequences on tackles, and WR catches near the sideline. Live with it.

11) VERY IMPORTANT - Robo-QB will not rear it's head if you know how to properly scheme a defense. Always playing man to man or basic zones, WILL NOT get the job done. You have to learn how to cover the flats with zones covered by LB's, DE's, or if you are daring the FS/SS.... You must learn to double cover and TAKE AWAY the CPU's "go-to" guy on plays the CPU likes to go underneath, or on slants and routes. It can be done, and when you scheme correctly, the pick six is SWEEEEEEEEEEEEEET as buddder.....

12) The game play is tuned to force you to choose; STOP THE RUN, or be aggressive on the pass coverage and shut down the passing game, especially on the flats. I do it constantly, IT CAN BE DONE.... Learn how to scheme....

13) Appreciate the value of bringing up a FS/SS to stuff the run.





HALLOW'S EVE SLIDER BREW



House Rules:

1) Don't abuse the "cheese" plays; out routes for WR's, HB runs up the middle constantly, etc

2) Don't abuse the blitz. Blitz is defined as FIVE rushers or more. In the NFL, blitzes are dialed up on the extreme side, 40%-45% of the time. On the low end 2%-5% of the time... I average blitzing about 20%-25% of the time. Don't abuse the blitz.

3) I don't control the RB, I hand it off, and let the RB run it on his own. I don't control the WR after the catch. I don't switch off defensive players.

4) I DO CONTROL the QB, the Kick returner, the Punt Returner and typically a FS or SS on D

5) PLEASE BE CONSIDERATE AND POST YOUR OBSERVATIONS. PREFERABLY POST THE FOLLOWING:
a) Final Scores
b) Total number of picks and fumbles
c) Total number of sacks
d) AVG YRDS/RUSH
e) AVG YRDS/PASS
f) Rushing stats
g) Passing stats
h) Total number of plays

This is a beta test, so any and ALL feedback received can only help improve the tweaking. Thank you.



Gameplay: ALL-PRO
qtr length: 15 min
accel clock: 15 sec
fatigue: 43
injury: Work in progress (recommend for beta testing, to switch injuries to OFF)
gamespeed: Normal
speed threshold: 66
ball hawk: off
strafe assist: off
heat seeker assist: off
switch assist: off
Defensive tackle cone: Turned to full



HUM/CPU

qb acc: 25/7
pass blocking: 57/67
wr catching: 42/42
run blocking: 45/67
Fumbles: 63/63
Reaction time: 2/80
interceptions: 44/44
Pass coverage: 85/85
tackling: 48/58

Special teams (Work in progress, tune to your desire)

FG power: - /-
FG Accuracy: -/-
Punt power: -/-
Punt Accuracy: -/-
kickoff power: -/-

Penalties (the magic elixir....)
Offside: 53
False Start: 55
Holding: 50
Facemask: 54
DPI: 37
OPI: 67
Punt catch interference: 47
Clipping: 45
Int grounding: 80
Roughing the passer: 20
Roughing the kicker: 50


AutoSubs (Work in progress, tune to your delight)

Enjoy!

[theSliderWhisperer]

theSliderWhisperer's general comments on the sack glitch:

One of the things that all OS'ers need to keep in mind is that the sack issue stems directly from the following factors:


1) Terrible AI logic for the CPU OL or HUM OL
2) Terrible CPU QB awareness
3) Bad play calling by the CPU AI (3rd and short at his 35, and the CPU calls for All Streaks for the WR's and only leaves 5 men to block. Logic tells you this is when as a defense YOU WOULD dial up a blitz of 5 or more rushers)


What is happening is that the timing of the pass rush is not synced with either of the above mentioned issues. This can be clearly seen when trying to throw a screen pass...


If you are paying close attention to the animation on a screen pass, the CPU QB and HUM QB feel INSTANT heat when attempting a screen from under center, often times resulting in a sack or a very poorly thrown ball to the RB's head or butt, before the RB and OL even have a time to kick out and set the screen.... If you try a screen from the shotgun, the timing is only slightly better, but NOT BY MUCH!


So the "Band-Aid" to the sack glitch stems from figuring out how to manipulate the pass rush, the problem is that there is no slider that tunes the pass rush, or is there? Back in the day we used to have a designated pass rush slider, but in recent iterations of Madden we have not had one. But, the Wiz believes that a mix of PEN SLIDERS, CPU SLIDERS and HUM SLIDERS can "tame" the timing of the pass rush to make the game much more enjoyable...


Has the Wiz fixed the issue? Not quite. Has the Wiz created a Band-Aid that seems to work more often than not? Possibly so.


The other concern regarding the sack glitch is how do you define a sack that came from the "glitch"? I have reams of data that supports that DIFFERENT QB's, DO react differently to the pass rush and can get rid of the ball better/faster than other QB's (and this is without using QB edited rosters), hence avoiding a sack. And vice versa, other QB's act like they have ALL DAY to read the progressions and get blasted for a sack, even with a 3 man rush!


Defining the sack glitch was initially very hard for me to understand and quantify. I mean, if I get a sack on Geno Smith with a six man blitz, is that a glitch sack? Yet with the same six man blitz, guys like Peyton often (not always) do get rid of the ball or chuck it away...


It was very hard to quantify, it's almost like it is a judgment call after you go back and play the sack on replay in slo-mo and check to see if the OL and RB/FB did everything possible to pick up the blitz, and if so, then go and check the coverage to see if it was so tight that the sack actually was a coverage sack.... If so, then is getting a coverage sack a sack due to the glitch? Again, it is hard to say....


What I can say is that the amount of TOTAL SACKS did go down with the sliders I developed, but I also precluded myself from blitzing every chance I got....


In fact, OS'ers should be aware that in the NFL, at the extreme, blitz'es (defined as 5 rushers or more) are dialed up at most 45% of the time for a passing situation, and at the very least, 3% of the time.


I tended to moderate my blitzing to an average of about 20% - 25% of the time and was consistently achieving between 2-4 sacks per game... In fact, depending on the QB, the more I blitzed the higher his completion percentage was due to the QB using the safety valve and just dumping off the ball.... I liked this because I had to pick my poison; go for the sack, or get burned for a cheap 5-6 yard gain... I like this decision making.


Ho-hum, just some insight to chew on....

[theSliderWhisperer]

theSliderWhisperer's general comments on Robo-QB issue:

Stay tuned.

[theSliderWhisperer]

theSliderWhisperer's general comments on M15 observations:

Stay tuned!

[HC0023]

Hey Guys , This was a Coach Mode CFM Jets 12 Raiders 7 , Jets Geno 25-33-221-1TD-1INT-75%-AYPA-6.6, Schaub 22-34-199-1TD-1INT-64%-AYPA- 5.8, Rushing Jets Ivory 26-83-3.1AVG, Raiders MJD 16-65-4.0 AVG, McFadden 4-24-6.0 AVG, Schaub 1-5 Total Sacks 7 4 Jets 3 raiders , , 2 Total INT Total Plays 123 , Hope this helps Mr Whisperer 0 Fumbles

[theSliderWhisperer]

Quote: Originally Posted by HC0023

Hey Guys , This was a Coach Mode CFM Jets 12 Raiders 7 , Jets Geno 25-33-221-1TD-1INT-75%-AYPA-6.6, Schaub 22-34-199-1TD-1INT-64%-AYPA- 5.8, Rushing Jets Ivory 26-83-3.1AVG, Raiders MJD 16-65-4.0 AVG, McFadden 4-24-6.0 AVG, Schaub 1-5 Total Sacks 7 4 Jets 3 raiders , , 2 Total INT Total Plays 123 , Hope this helps Mr Whisperer 0 Fumbles

What did you think? Game play smoother? Also, did you enjoy seeing the DB's and WR's battle for the ball? How about those running lanes? They looked real good when the RB made a dash for the crease, but they close very fricking fast if the RB is not decisive....

Personally, with the personnel each team has, this result is VERY, VERY realistic. Gotta love those sack numbers being so low...Booooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooyaaaa aa!!!!!

Geno's completion % is a tad high, but to be expected in a COACH MODE game.... Schaub's numbers are SPOT on...... Rushing numbers are SPOT on. Turnovers for these backwards _ss (rhymes with GAS) teams are SPOT on.

When you counted total plays, did you also include punt/kick returns? Don't recall having a game with so few total plays.... My typical average was 143 plays.... Weird....

Would REALLY appreciate if you could play some more games and post the stats....

But I must say, very, very impressed with the slider's statistical performance after this one posting....

Thanks for your cooperation and effort...



theSliderWhizperer

[HC0023]

Quote: Originally Posted by theSliderWhisperer

What did you think? Game play smoother? Also, did you enjoy seeing the DB's and WR's battle for the ball? How about those running lanes? They looked real good when the RB made a dash for the crease, but they close very fricking fast if the RB is not decisive.... Personally, with the personnel each team has, this result is VERY, VERY realistic. Gotta love those sack numbers being so low...Booooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooyaaaa aa!!!!! Geno's completion % is a tad high, but to be expected in a COACH MODE game.... Schaub's numbers are SPOT on...... Rushing numbers are SPOT on. Turnovers for these backwards _ss (rhymes with GAS) teams are SPOT on. When you counted total plays, did you also include punt/kick returns? Don't recall having a game with so few total plays.... My typical average was 143 plays.... Weird.... Would REALLY appreciate if you could play some more games and post the stats.... But I must say, very, very impressed with the slider's statistical performance after this one posting.... Thanks for your cooperation and effort... theSliderWhizperer

No I count Pass attmepts, Rush Attempts and Sacks just like the NFL to get Total of Plays, Yes i will play some more games and post stats, They Felt Nice And for Coach Mode which is difficult to begin with finding a Happy Place with sliders

[theSliderWhisperer]

Quote: Originally Posted by HC0023

No I count Pass attmepts, Rush Attempts and Sacks just like the NFL to get Total of Plays, Yes i will play some more games and post stats, They Felt Nice And for Coach Mode which is difficult to begin with finding a Happy Place with sliders

Aaaah, of course.... My math include Punt/Kick Returns, field goals attempted, as well as fumbles, pass attempts, and of course rush attempts...

I concur, for Coach Mode, the Hallow's Eve Slider Brew truly hit it out of the park...

Winner, winner, CHICKEN DINNER, if I don't say so myself!