Evolution of a staff(patriots disection)

[algoody421]

To show off how often coaches get moved around the league, I decided I would start with the sb winning 2001 pats and follow them to this present year. All information from wikipedia.

Offensive Coordinator/Running Backs – Charlie Weis
Quarterbacks – Dick Rehbein*
Wide Receivers – Ivan Fears
Assistant Head Coach/Offensive Line – Dante Scarnecchia
Assistant Offensive Line – Jeff Davidson
Coaching Assistant – Ned Burke

Defensive Coaches

Defensive Coordinator – Romeo Crennel
Defensive Line – Randy Melvin
Outside Linebackers – Rob Ryan
Inside Linebackers – Pepper Johnson
Defensive Backs – Eric Mangini
Coaching Assistant – Brian Daboll
Special Teams Coaches

Special Teams – Brad Seely

2002

Offensive Coordinator/Quarterbacks – Charlie Weis
Running Backs – Ivan Fears
Wide Receivers – Brian Daboll
Assistant Head Coach/Offensive Line – Dante Scarnecchia
Assistant Offensive Line/Tight Ends – Jeff Davidson
Coaching Assistant – Nick Caserio

Defensive Coaches

Defensive Coordinator/Defensive Line – Romeo Crennel
Outside Linebackers – Rob Ryan
Inside Linebackers – Pepper Johnson
Defensive Backs – Eric Mangini
Coaching Assistant – Josh McDaniels
Special Teams Coaches

Special Teams – Brad Seely

2003

Offensive Coaches

Offensive Coordinator – Charlie Weis
Quarterbacks – John Hufnagel
Running Backs – Ivan Fears
Wide Receivers – Brian Daboll
Assistant Head Coach/Offensive Line – Dante Scarnecchia
Assistant Offensive Line/Tight Ends – Jeff Davidson
Coaching Assistant – Sean Gustus

Defensive Coaches

Defensive Coordinator/Defensive Line – Romeo Crennel
Outside Linebackers – Rob Ryan
Inside Linebackers – Pepper Johnson
Defensive Backs – Eric Mangini
Coaching Assistant – Josh McDaniels
Special Teams Coaches

Special Teams – Brad Seely

2004

Offensive Coordinator – Charlie Weis
Quarterbacks – Josh McDaniels
Running Backs – Ivan Fears
Wide Receivers – Brian Daboll
Assistant Head Coach/Offensive Line – Dante Scarnecchia
Assistant Offensive Line/Tight Ends – Jeff Davidson
Coaching Assistant – Matt Patricia

Defensive Coaches

Defensive Coordinator – Romeo Crennel
Defensive Line – Pepper Johnson
Linebackers – Dean Pees
Defensive Backs – Eric Mangini
Coaching Assistant – Cory Undlin
Special Teams Coaches

Special Teams – Brad Seely

2005

Offensive Coaches

Quarterbacks – Josh McDaniels
Running Backs – Ivan Fears
Wide Receivers – Brian Daboll
Tight Ends – Pete Mangurian
Assistant Head Coach/Offensive Line – Dante Scarnecchia
Assistant Offensive Line – Matt Patricia

Defensive Coaches

Defensive Coordinator – Eric Mangini
Defensive Line – Pepper Johnson
Linebackers – Dean Pees
Assistant Secondary – Joel Collier
Coaching Assistant – Mike Judge
Special Teams Coaches

Special Teams – Brad Seely

2006

Offensive Coordinator/Quarterbacks – Josh McDaniels
Running Backs – Ivan Fears
Wide Receivers – Brian Daboll
Tight Ends – Pete Mangurian
Assistant Head Coach/Offensive Line – Dante Scarnecchia
Coaching Assistant – Mike Judge

Defensive Coaches

Defensive Coordinator – Dean Pees
Defensive Line – Pepper Johnson
Linebackers – Matt Patricia
Secondary – Joel Collier
Coaching Assistant – Josh Boyer
Special Teams Coaches

Special Teams – Brad Seely
Coaching Assistant – Kevin Bickers

2007

Offensive Coordinator/Quarterbacks – Josh McDaniels
Running Backs – Ivan Fears
Wide Receivers – Nick Caserio
Tight Ends – Pete Mangurian
Assistant Head Coach/Offensive Line – Dante Scarnecchia
Offensive Assistant – Bill O'Brien

Defensive Coaches

Defensive Coordinator – Dean Pees
Defensive Line – Pepper Johnson
Linebackers – Matt Patricia
Secondary – Joel Collier
Coaching Assistant – Josh Boyer
Special Teams Coaches

Special Teams – Brad Seely

2008

Offensive Coordinator/Quarterbacks – Josh McDaniels
Running Backs – Ivan Fears
Wide Receivers – Bill O'Brien
Tight Ends – Pete Mangurian
Assistant Head Coach/Offensive Line – Dante Scarnecchia
Coaching Assistant – Shane Waldron

Defensive Coaches

Defensive Coordinator – Dean Pees
Defensive Line – Pepper Johnson
Linebackers – Matt Patricia
Special Assistant/Secondary – Dom Capers
Coaching Assistant – Josh Boyer
Special Teams Coaches

Special Teams – Brad Seely

2009

Quarterbacks – Bill O'Brien
Running Backs – Ivan Fears
Wide Receivers – Chad O'Shea
Tight Ends – Shane Waldron
Assistant Head Coach/Offensive Line – Dante Scarnecchia
Coaching Assistant – Brian Ferentz

Defensive Coaches

Defensive Coordinator – Dean Pees
Defensive Line – Pepper Johnson
Linebackers – Matt Patricia
Defensive Backs – Josh Boyer
Coaching Assistant – Patrick Graham
Special Teams Coaches

Special Teams – Scott O'Brien

2010

Quarterbacks – Bill O'Brien
Running Backs – Ivan Fears
Wide Receivers – Chad O'Shea
Assistant Head Coach/Offensive Line – Dante Scarnecchia
Offensive Assistant Coach – Brian Ferentz
Assistant Coach Offense/Special Teams – Brian Flores

Defensive Coaches

Defensive Line – Pepper Johnson
Linebackers – Matt Patricia
Defensive Backs – Josh Boyer
Defensive Backs – Corwin Brown
Defensive Assistant Coach – Patrick Graham
Special Teams Coaches

Special Teams – Scott O'Brien
2011

Offensive Coordinator/Quarterbacks – Bill O'Brien
Running Backs – Ivan Fears
Wide Receivers – Chad O'Shea
Tight Ends – Brian Ferentz
Assistant Head Coach/Offensive Line – Dante Scarnecchia
Offensive Assistant – Josh McDaniels
Offensive Assistant Coach – George Godsey

Defensive Coaches

Defensive Line – Pepper Johnson
Linebackers – Patrick Graham
Defensive Backs – Josh Boyer
Safeties – Matt Patricia
Defensive Assistant Coach – Brian Flores
Special Teams Coaches

Special Teams – Scott O'Brien

2012

Offensive Coordinator/Quarterbacks – Josh McDaniels
Running Backs – Ivan Fears
Wide Receivers – Chad O'Shea
Tight Ends – George Godsey
Assistant Head Coach/Offensive Line – Dante Scarnecchia
Brian Daboll
Defensive Coaches
Defensive Coordinator – Matt Patricia
Defensive Line – Patrick Graham
Linebackers – Pepper Johnson
Cornerbacks – Josh Boyer
Safeties – Brian Flores
Special Teams Coaches

Special Teams – Scott O'Brien

[algoody421]

You'll notice those first 4 years and 3 sb wins, he had romeo crennel and charlie weis as his coordinators. Then they parted. After that, he ALWAYS promotes from within. Some stay longer than others.

Eric mangini and josh mcdaniels take over but mangini is gone one year later to the rival jets as you all should remember. Mcdaniels is there 3 years before he makes oc and he stays there from 2005 through 08(7 total), 2009 he coaches broncos two years gets fired. He rejoins in 2011 as a qb assistant and takes back over as oc in 2012 when obrien leaves to coach psu I think.

When Mangini leaves, Dean peas takes over for 4 years till he leaves to coach the ravens defense. these last couple years. He started there in 04 and was a position coach 2 years.

When mcdaniels left, bill obrien took over. He was a position coach 2007 and 2008 and took over oc when mcdaniels left. 09 10 and 11 he was oc. When peas left, it doesnt really show who was dc but it was matt patricia who took over.

As you can see though, coaches last with a team for around 6 years like I've said. Sometimes it takes them longer to get to oc or dc because of other candidates being kept or considered better in house. Sometimes they stay longer as an oc or dc in order to improve their chances of a hc job. Its how romeo and weiss got them, same with mcdaniels. Dean peas will get one soon enough and bill obrien is at psu like I said(took over for paterno).

This is why its called a coaching tree, because its supposed to branch out across the league and even into the college ranks. Some choose to stay in college like saban, also a bellichick disciple. Helped to lead the 1994 browns to a league best d (something like that, its on the espn parcells/bellichick tree).

If someone gets fired and you want to rehire them, sure go ahead. But you should be trying to limit coaches to 5 years max and only when THEY need the seasoning, not when you want to keep them. Shouldnt keep coordinators longer than 3 years really but you can make a case for 4 as that was bills norm. Based on the patriots(most winning team since 2001), no coach should be kept longer than 7 total unless rehired(ala mcdaniels). I still think 3(position) and 5(total at coordinator and position combined) with rare exceptions are the perfect limits though to keep careers fresh and exciting.

[Mike3207]

It's going to take longer than 5 years to build a coordinator up. Both my coordinators are in their 6th year and they still have a lot of room to grow.

You also need to realize the CPU teams aren't necessarily going to let go of their skilled coaches. Coaches like Monte Kiffin will stay forever until they retire. You can especially expect teams like the Broncos and Giants to keep a staff together.I remember one dynasty the Giants kept both their OC/DCs as 99s until Coughlin retired in 2018, they then promoted the OC/DC.

[algoody421]

A) The only people who will stay on a staff are the ones like Anchor, traditionalist, and loyalist. That and staples like kiffin who's a captain anyways I believe. They stay loyal to a team.

B) they may only be doing that because you never release your oc or dc/position coaches. I see coaches leave all the time but I also look at every team in the staff hiring recap. I actually see the carousel when you guys just go on to the next offseason with out doing any research.

C) If you want to continuously play with 99 coordinators and coaches, go ahead. But its not gonna be fun or challenging, and you never create a coaching tree. Thats the whole ****ing point of this game. Making coaches become hcs elsewhere so you can verse them.

D) why are you taking 6 years? What are you trying to do? Fill them completely? Why is that necessary? 3 years man, thats it, all you need. If they need any more seasoning they can get it on someone elses staff. but I had a dc hired after 2 years of exp and a dc after 1 as hcs so I dont know why you need that much time...

I'd rather see my coaches as my opponents then always on my team.

Remember, I played exactly like you people. I kept 99 coaches every year of my career, making sure to save and then restart if they left. Yeah, I did all that **** too. Its not fun and it ruins the game. Play it how you want though.

I dont give a **** what coughlin or any other coach does, this is about what I do and what bellichick does in real life. This way, you keep upgrading the league around you by developing both players and staff and then letting them loose on the league.

In real life, which is what this game is supposed to simulate, when you keep someone on your staff for 8+ years, they start to resent you as if you're holding them back. Go read up about walsh and how he felt he was held back in cincy for 8 ****ing years(I HAVE, its on espn in his coaching profile).

Do the research Ive done and then realize Im just passing on whats realistic in the nfl.

[mailman2]

Quote: Originally Posted by algoody421

A) The only people who will stay on a staff are the ones like Anchor, traditionalist, and loyalist. B) they may only be doing that because you never release your oc or dc/position coaches. I see coaches leave all the time but I also look at every team in the staff hiring recap. I actually see the carousel when you guys just go on to the next offseason with out doing any research. C) If you want to continuously play with 99 coordinators and coaches, go ahead. But its not gonna be fun or challenging, and you never create a coaching tree. Thats the whole ****ing point of this game. Making coaches become hcs elsewhere so you can verse them. D) why are you taking 6 years? What are you trying to do? Fill them completely? Why is that necessary? 3 years man, thats it, all you need. If they need any more seasoning they can get it on someone elses staff. but I had a dc hired after 2 years of exp and a dc after 1 as hcs so I dont know why you need that much time... I'd rather see my coaches as my opponents then always on my team. Remember, I played exactly like you people. I kept 99 coaches every year of my career, making sure to save and then restart if they left. Yeah, I did all that **** too. Its not fun and it ruins the game. Play it how you want though. I dont give a **** what coughlin or any other coach does, this is about what I do and what bellichick does in real life. This way, you keep upgrading the league around you by developing both players and staff and then letting them loose on the league. In real life, which is what this game is supposed to simulate, when you keep someone on your staff for 8+ years, they start to resent you as if you're holding them back. Go read up about walsh and how he felt he was held back in cincy for 8 ****ing years(I HAVE, its on espn in his coaching profile). Do the research Ive done and then realize Im just passing on whats realistic in the nfl.

Very few guys want to be a coordinator for so long. This is why you so frequently see NFL coordinators taking open jobs.

[algoody421]

I want to also explain that Im not saying EVERY COACH and EVERY TEAM follows this specifically. There are coaches like kubiak who stayed with shannahan for 11 years as an oc on the broncos. But you dont see that AS MUCH NOW, as you did back then. People are more ambitious and better taught now then they were back then. There are more job opportunities then there used to be. Head Coaches dont last as long anymore so its kind of become custom to see coaches gone within 3 years of starting somewhere if they stall.

Its also not JUST about realism or difficulty. Its about "respecting your staff". If these were real people, and you were their coach, would you want to hold them back? No, you would want them to be able to continue to grow. Holding a position coach longer than 3 years with no intention of promoting is kinda like torture. Its like saying, yea, I know you could be a good oc somewhere but **** you. Its like the opposite of what charles ramsey did, you're keeping them hostage...

[Jail2end]

I always avoided promoting from within because I figured my position coaches would only be good in the area they specialize in. If you upgrade a really good WR coach to offensive coordinator, how good will his potential and development be outside of wide receivers?

[john129pats]

Interesting how they didn't even have an offensive coordinator in 2005.