Something that I really want to see in Madden 12.

[cgalligan]

I want to preface this by saying, I know APF was not a perfect game and I am in no way looking to start a screaming match with Madden vs 2k fans. I enjoy Madden and 2k both. I like certain things in one game vs the other. I am simply trying to show some things that I think Madden could include in their game to make it even better.

Topic #1 - True to life ROUTE BASED PASSING.

I think APF Nailed this aspect of the game. Take a look at some routes vs air in practice mode.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h3V1Ib4j4Rs

Notice how you can throw the ball BEFORE the WR breaks on his route... Notice the elevation of the ball... It wont get swatted down by a linebacker who is 15 yards in front of the intended target.

Topic #2 - Offensive line play

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MiR9t...eature=related

Notice how APF forms a better pocket... Notice the interaction before, during, and after contact between the DLine and the OLine... notice how around 2:00min the DT splits the double team with no "warping" by another OLineman to pick him up...

Topic #3 - Route running

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2DyDSUbjZ6c

The video explains it all, no need for me to chime in really.

Topic #4 - WR / CB interaction

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oN9yG...eature=related

Notice when the WR looks for the ball the CB also looks for the ball, now, also notice, when the CB looks back for the ball, he slows down just a tad, which creates a little seperation between him and the WR. Also notice how the WR extends his arm a bit to try and create a little more seperation.

----------------------------------

Again, I am not looking to start a 2k vs EA holly war. We all know what we are dealing with, since these exclusive NFL contracts and what not. I'm simply trying to show people what can be done and what should be done in Madden to make the game even that much better. There is simply no excuse not to have the FUNDEMENTALS of Football perfect at this point in such a a game that has been running for over 20 years.

[TNT713]

With regards to #1: "Route Based Passing" in Madden

For years Madden has had a dynamic for throwing passes before a receiver cut to the spot he's supposed to cut to.

Having never thrown a pass on the NFL2K series, I cannot attest to how they feel as compared to Madden. I can only attest to the presence of dynamic that allows passes to be thrown to areas OTHER than the area straight ahead of the direction the receiver runs...

The dynamic requires activation of ONE BUTTON after the snap and is most readily witnessed when the ball is thrown on the 3rd, 5th, or 7th drop when throwing to routes breaking at the respective points in the QB's drop. No stick action whatsoever is required at the time of the throw.

I used 5-step routes for a video and found tremendous success throwing Post, Corner, In, Out, and Hook routes before the receiver cut to the EXACT location the ball should have been thrown if the pass was thrown based on the route he was running instead of the direction he was facing...

I did a duplicate of the routes in the video you posted... It used Madden 10. But I can remember the dynamic for YEARS before that.

The videos (3 Parts) are in my arena is you want to check them out...

I have no comments on 2, 3, or 4.

Later

[RazzBerry80]

TNT, your videos did not play. I think EA still has alot of work to do to get real route based passing in their game. I would be very happy if it equaled APF2k8. Having played both games the passing system in madden is not close enough to say that route based passing is in Madden. I have had moments of route based passing in Madden, but you really need to play 2k8 to compare to what we would like added to Madden.

I hope all of the things the OP listed will soon find their way into madden. I would expand wr/db interaction to include all player interactions, and maybe all animations, perhaps that includes doubple hit tackes aswell? Animations over all throught the game could use improvment. The devs have admited as much so we will see how much they worked on it.

[MJenness]

I want to se working penalties!! ALL of them. And a working and realistic challenge system....been waiting for YEARS for those to be addressed.

[roadman]

Quote: Originally Posted by MJenness

I want to se working penalties!! ALL of them. And a working and realistic challenge system....been waiting for YEARS for those to be addressed.

You are preaching to the choir on this note.

Please make penalties work.

[carnalnirvana]

i think madden is caught between two worlds,

in my edits i have madden playing great, blocking, OL/DL etc, it still lacks animations but atleast its trying to play football....

however if madden was programmed like my edits the online gameplay would be lost

1. if everyone blocked online i would avg 200yds on the ground(and i am trash online)

remember when blocking worked and we used to put a OL at TE oh man we ran all day

2. if you dropped the safeties to combat the running game and DB's trailed its the deep ball all day like we used to in madden 04-06
...rocket catch....

if ST blocked like they did in 09, we would average 2 KR/PR per game


in APF/2k back in the day games were always 60-70 online because when foorball is respected and you have the GODS EYE VIEW it becomes wayyyyyy too easy.

can you imagine if manning/brees had the ability to see every WR at the same time and knew when they would break their routes or that the CB was trailing it would be a shootout.........

i am not defending EA or the devs by any means, i wish they would make a sim game and forget about online, however thats not going to happen.

look at nba 2k11, they put in momentum which everyone loves, but you can abuse it all game crossing anyone with D rose to where they are falling out of the way.......leading to garbage online play unless you get another simhead

now i understand there will be abusers in every game but IMO this is why EA leaves the cheap tricks in the game and has not attempted to completely smooth it out, LAME !!!! yes definately but online has grown so much since ps2 glory days you have to capatalize on that market and strict sim will create more problems that it will solve........

[TNT713]

Quote: Originally Posted by RazzBerry80

TNT, your videos did not play. I think EA still has alot of work to do to get real route based passing in their game. I would be very happy if it equaled APF2k8. Having played both games the passing system in madden is not close enough to say that route based passing is in Madden. I have had moments of route based passing in Madden, but you really need to play 2k8 to compare to what we would like added to Madden.

They played for me... Try this link: Madden - Route Based Passing Videos

If they don't play, I changed the YouTube options to Unlisted. Try these:

Part 1 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YgTroLGdvtU
Part 2 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cLzWnjynOuU
Part 3 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=spWTN4jXJeo

As far as comparing the two - NO INTEREST. So while APF may be great, and I sincerely have nothing against it other than IT'S NOT MADDEN. Once upon a time I played every NFL game on the market for PC and consoles (1995-1999) and always came back to Madden. Now Madden is the only football game I'll PLAY - although I'll watch any of the others.

That said, I'm INTIMATELY familiar with several of the passing mechanics on Madden and utilize them all where appropriate (hypothetically at least).

Later

[RazzBerry80]

Thank you for the links to your videos. I have to say that they have a couple of flaws. You should show the play art of so the viewer can see the actual route the reciever runs. Also I would like to see what happens when you release the pass a full secound or two BEFORE the WR starts his break animiation.

Lets say your WR was running a post. Your QB lets the ball go a full second or 2 before the WR starts his break. Without leading the pass will the ball go to where the route should be run? or will the pass be thrown like a GO route. In AP2k8 it will still be thrown along the post route. In madden it will be some kind of go route.

It seems that if you time the throw with the break it will be a route based pass. But it still falls short of how well route based passing was done in 2k8. And that is what myself, and many others would like to see put into Madden to make it a stronger game, in my opinion.

Not trying to make you not like Madden, TNT. And I am not going to try to force you to play APF2k8, even though that would help more than my words can, to show you what I am trying to discribe.

Just trying to clarify what myself and others are talking about when we say we want route based passing in madden.