BAGM = Pretty weak...

[jaxpac]

So I haven't bought the EA game for many years being a 2k fan until recently. But this year having no other option and reading some positive reviews I went and picked up NHL11. Being from Canada I have played recent games so I knew what to expect on the ice and with hardcore mode and slider tweaks the on ice play is pretty good. But I was also interested in the offline franchise mode, now called 'be a GM.' I am a longtime fan of the eastside series although I wouldn't expect the mode to anything close to as good as eastside hockey, I was hopeful that it would be enjoyable since they seemingly put a lot of effort in to it and are calling it by a new name.

So I started up a franchise as the oilers and played for about 45 minutes just simming all the games to see what this mode was like. First thing I did was look to trade Souray. In real life he was shopped around for months this summer before finally being waived and getting no interest from anyone. Now I realize that the game has no way of knowing what is going on in real life, but in game terms Souray is old, not rated that highly, and has a bad contract. So I was surprised to see that when I go to trade him I see his trade value is one of the highest on the team. Higher than the likes of Eberle. This doesn't bode well for the Ai's ability to evaluate players.

So I pick a team at random and offer Souray for a first round pick. It is accepted with some response along the lines of "wow, we won't look a gift horse in the mouth, we accept." Ok, so obviously the AI doesn't properly value players or draft picks, and I'm already wondering how this mode could possibly be challenging to the player in any way. It sucks when you find something this ridiculous in the first 5 minutes of the game.

But moving on I set up my lines and start simming the season. After a few games I get a popup that a player is on waivers. I have the option to ignore and move on, or claim the player, with the message saying "player will be placed in minors." As many will surely know, if you claim a player from waivers he must remain on your NHL roster for the rest of the year (if you send him to the minors the original team gets the player back). That's the whole point of waivers. The main benefit for a player gaining waiver rights is that they can avoid being sent down to the minors. The way it is in the game you might as well claim every player waived and stock up your minor league squad. I wasn't interested in exploiting an obvious error within the game so I didn't claim anyone but if this is actually how waivers work in the game it is pretty ridiculous. Now 10 minutes in and a second obvious problem.

But moving on I simmed the rest of the year, the oilers missed the playoffs, and the sabres won the cup. Standings were a little unpredictable which is good, because there are always surprise teams in real life. Moved on to the draft and I had two first round picks (one from my brilliant Souray deal), one at 6 and one at around 15. I just simmed to picks and to my amazement drafted Nugent-Hopkins and Couturier in the first round. While this is obviously ridiculous, I'm not sure if it is an AI problem or just a result of poor CHL rosters.

Moved on to the next year, resigned my players, didn't make any other moves and just kept simming. For some reason the next year by the time I quit I was second in the division and Hall had over 50 goals. So I am very skeptical about this mode after my first 45 minutes playing it. I don't understand how this is supposed to pose any challenge to the human player.

Other issues I found:

- unsigned draft picks seemingly remain the property of the team drafting them forever, no matter if they are playing in Europe or North America.

- the all star game in my first season ended 1-0. I don't know if this is indicative of a bigger problem with the sim engine or what.

- AI teams give away later draft picks for nothing. They were giving picks away for minor leaguers about to become UFA.

- AI doesn't seem to care what you select as your trading priorities in the trading screen. I set it to say I only wanted prospects and still got random offers for veterans. Also, it might have been me but it seems as though this screen was being changed automatically without me wanting it, so I don't know if the problem is the AI ignores what you set or the AI changes what you set for some reason.

- the draft is full of over-age players being drafted in the early rounds. By the third round it seemed as though almost all the "3rd round" rated players were 19 and 20 year olds.

- it seems as though at the start of the year the game lets you send any player to the minors without clearing waivers. I send Khabibulin down at the start of my second season and no mention of waivers.



Are these longstanding problems in the series? Is there any history in this series of EA fixing these sorts of problems through patches?

[savoie2006]

Quote: Originally Posted by jaxpac

So I haven't bought the EA game for many years being a 2k fan until recently. But this year having no other option and reading some positive reviews I went and picked up NHL11. Being from Canada I have played recent games so I knew what to expect on the ice and with hardcore mode and slider tweaks the on ice play is pretty good. But I was also interested in the offline franchise mode, now called 'be a GM.' I am a longtime fan of the eastside series although I wouldn't expect the mode to anything close to as good as eastside hockey, I was hopeful that it would be enjoyable since they seemingly put a lot of effort in to it and are calling it by a new name. So I started up a franchise as the oilers and played for about 45 minutes just simming all the games to see what this mode was like. First thing I did was look to trade Souray. In real life he was shopped around for months this summer before finally being waived and getting no interest from anyone. Now I realize that the game has no way of knowing what is going on in real life, but in game terms Souray is old, not rated that highly, and has a bad contract. So I was surprised to see that when I go to trade him I see his trade value is one of the highest on the team. Higher than the likes of Eberle. This doesn't bode well for the Ai's ability to evaluate players. So I pick a team at random and offer Souray for a first round pick. It is accepted with some response along the lines of "wow, we won't look a gift horse in the mouth, we accept." Ok, so obviously the AI doesn't properly value players or draft picks, and I'm already wondering how this mode could possibly be challenging to the player in any way. It sucks when you find something this ridiculous in the first 5 minutes of the game. But moving on I set up my lines and start simming the season. After a few games I get a popup that a player is on waivers. I have the option to ignore and move on, or claim the player, with the message saying "player will be placed in minors." As many will surely know, if you claim a player from waivers he must remain on your NHL roster for the rest of the year (if you send him to the minors the original team gets the player back). That's the whole point of waivers. The main benefit for a player gaining waiver rights is that they can avoid being sent down to the minors. The way it is in the game you might as well claim every player waived and stock up your minor league squad. I wasn't interested in exploiting an obvious error within the game so I didn't claim anyone but if this is actually how waivers work in the game it is pretty ridiculous. Now 10 minutes in and a second obvious problem. But moving on I simmed the rest of the year, the oilers missed the playoffs, and the sabres won the cup. Standings were a little unpredictable which is good, because there are always surprise teams in real life. Moved on to the draft and I had two first round picks (one from my brilliant Souray deal), one at 6 and one at around 15. I just simmed to picks and to my amazement drafted Nugent-Hopkins and Couturier in the first round. While this is obviously ridiculous, I'm not sure if it is an AI problem or just a result of poor CHL rosters. Moved on to the next year, resigned my players, didn't make any other moves and just kept simming. For some reason the next year by the time I quit I was second in the division and Hall had over 50 goals. So I am very skeptical about this mode after my first 45 minutes playing it. I don't understand how this is supposed to pose any challenge to the human player. Other issues I found: - unsigned draft picks seemingly remain the property of the team drafting them forever, no matter if they are playing in Europe or North America. - the all star game in my first season ended 1-0. I don't know if this is indicative of a bigger problem with the sim engine or what. - AI teams give away later draft picks for nothing. They were giving picks away for minor leaguers about to become UFA. - AI doesn't seem to care what you select as your trading priorities in the trading screen. I set it to say I only wanted prospects and still got random offers for veterans. Also, it might have been me but it seems as though this screen was being changed automatically without me wanting it, so I don't know if the problem is the AI ignores what you set or the AI changes what you set for some reason. - the draft is full of over-age players being drafted in the early rounds. By the third round it seemed as though almost all the "3rd round" rated players were 19 and 20 year olds. - it seems as though at the start of the year the game lets you send any player to the minors without clearing waivers. I send Khabibulin down at the start of my second season and no mention of waivers. Are these longstanding problems in the series? Is there any history in this series of EA fixing these sorts of problems through patches?

Yes, the cpu roster managment, trade logic, and the sim engine have always been an issue. A shame too, because GM has some nice depth to it.

[Flinch130]

Does the GM difficulty setting having bearing on AI logic possibly? i.e. Lower difficulty making trades easier?

[SA1NT401]

I dont think it does...Its a bigger issue than that.

[Lordofthething]

You have some great points. I can't believe they still allow you snag players off waivers and put them directly to the minors. They go to the trouble of adding RFA's and don't fix this obvious loop hole? Every year they say the trade logic is better than ever and still falls short of expectations.

Even with the deficiencies I'm sure I'll be playing it from now until the NHL 12 demo comes out...lol

[savoie2006]

Yeah, it doesn't take away from the fact the gameplay itself is a blast. Hopefully they can remedy these issues sooner than later. It definately won't keep me from playing this.

[JT30]

How is this mode playable with all these issues?

[Red71Star]

Quote: Originally Posted by JT30

How is this mode playable with all these issues?

It's like anything else, you take the good with the bad.