What NFL is Madden Simulating?

[tdogg097]

So here I sit another year with Madden and another year stuck in week 1 of my franchise. You see I'm a stat guy , always have been. I know Maddens sim engine has been terrible over the years and every year I hope they fix it. But here we are with M23 and the sim engine is still awful. Every team/qb throws for 20+ tds, there are no FGs kicked, no fumbles recovered, etc. Those are the easy to spot issues. Once you do a deep dive it only gets worse.

So what is the fix? 2 years ago you could do a 32 team Quick Sim with slider adjustments and get a passable sim experience. Last year that was taken away and sliders would not influence quick sim only slow sim. Okay now we use slow sim to get those stats. I'll start at default All Madden with no adjustments to anything. 5 games in and 10 NFL QBs have a combined 10-29 TD:INT ratio with 75%+ completion percentage. NFL RBs cannot average more than 4.0 ypc, TEs receive too many targets, so many kickoff returns, the list is endless.

So what is the fix? Slider adjustments right. Except only some sliders work. If I turn up a penalty slider to the max I should see that penalty so much it's annoying. M23? You might never see that penalty called again. Kickoff returns should be easy to remedy right? Kickoff power 100 , done. Except when you do that nothing happens. Same with punt power. Some sliders work, some don't. Imo, there is no way to get a sim experience in M23 with a regular sim or a H2H sim. I have done every slider adjustment I could think of. You cannot even get realistic penalty numbers. Statistically this game doesn't replicate what you see on Sundays.

[MHammer113]

I can’t argue anything you’ve said. It’s not a true simulation and I’ve made this point on other threads, I don’t understand how the NFL allows this product to continue to be exclusive

[cabralk]

100% agree with you, I've been testing different things for the last few months to figure out how to make it possible. It really comes down to lowering the injury ratings of the players and lower ratings based on position. Problem is who has time to sit and edit 3000+ players and keep doing tests.

[tinpanalley]

Interesting, wasn't aware of this.
So what was the last good sim-realistic Madden? I've always liked 25.

[gr18]

Quote: Originally Posted by tinpanalley

Interesting, wasn't aware of this. So what was the last good sim-realistic Madden? I've always liked 25.

I'd say 16.It was tuned just right with cpu qb AI,penalties, fatigue and such.Id still be playing it more if it had full player editing,which started with 17.Things got out of whack with 17 though.

As far as sim stats 16 did well when super simming.

[JoshC1977]

Contrary to common opinion Madden (like all console sports games) is far more an RPG than simulator and always has been. It is based on a world that loosely simulates the real-life NFL (the teams, players, schedules, and even many of the fundamental rules of the game, etc.) but that is where the similarities end.

You get to choose which character to roleplay or you can select your own custom character. You have quests with goals/rewards, you have enemy encounters, you make decisions that change the storyline, etc.

But, there are many differences between real life and the fictional universe that makes-up the Madden universe (this is the same across the sports gaming series). The most fundamental difference is that the ratings of each player are not a precise correlation with real life - they roughly align but also contain some creative license (and obviously they level-up). But there are many other differences in how roster transactions are handled, salary structures and so on.

Where Madden has changed in recent years is that the EA team has leaned much more heavily into more high-fantasy, Final Fantasy-esque RPG elements. Some examples:

- Selected player characters now have limit breaks that can trigger while in battle (i.e. X-factor abilities) and you can even equip different "materia" (to use a term from the FFVII series) to change that limit break.
- Coaches have powers as well; for example, a Level 1 HC can now select a healing spell to help their party members (players) heal from injuries more quickly and they can select a number of special spells as they level-up to enhance the abilities of their players.
- You can hire special NPCs (called Offensive and Defensive coordinators) to boost your player characters.
- Your player personnel character has spells to help enhance their bargaining abilities in the 'stores' (i.e. player transactions).
- You now have a tactical phase prior to each battle where you can select your tactics and great your party certain boosts.
- During battle, we now have a dynamic ATB gauge that grants special powers to one side or another based on how the battle is going.

This is not an all-inclusive list, but the point is that EA has created a nice little fantasy world roughly based around the NFL. It's very obvious to me that they are not trying to mimic real life and have opted to develop this as a true fantasy RPG vs one that is a bit more 'grounded'.

Now, I love RPGs - which is why I play sports games. Most sports games do choose to take a more reality-based RPG approach; but I find Madden's adoption of the high-fantasy elements to be interesting. I really struggled with it at first (and still believe that the balancing is 'off') but now that I understand what they are trying to do, it makes more sense to me (I don't necessarily love it, but it makes sense). However, I think one's expectations with respect to how this fantasy world compares to real life needs to be tempered greatly - you just can't expect to find many precise correlations - especially with stats. Until there is a 'Paradigm Shift' (pun intended), I think we all have to either embrace the game for what it is or move-on.

[Madden08PCgmr]

I think they got their hands on the Tecmo Bowl code and can't figure out how to properly implement it...

[Caulfield]

some of us might not have the nfl madden we want, but as long as ea makes enough money as is, we consumers get the game we deserve, as long as we keep handing them $