MLB The Show 17 Patch 1.04 Available Now, Patch Notes Included

[The Chef]

Quote: Originally Posted by bredfan

I think you quoted the wrong person. The fact that we're just playing videogames is exactly my point. If everything isn't in my control in a videogame, such that no matter what I do the outcome is predetermined by the game, then scripting is involved. It is the official stance of just about every major sports game publisher that scripting doesn't exist. So please, don't hold back your rant on my account. When I play The Show, I feel like every outcome has a logical explanation based on my input during any given scenario. I'm sorry that others don't feel that way.

I don't get your stance. It's not scripted as the outcome isn't decided at the start but yes there are randomizers built in to better replicate baseball as there are randomizers built in to every sports game out there.

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[bredfan]

Quote: Originally Posted by The Chef

I don't get your stance. It's not scripted as the outcome isn't decided at the start but yes there are randomizers built in to better replicate baseball as there are randomizers built in to every sports game out there. Sent from my SM-G920T using Tapatalk

RNG is not the same as swinging through an 89 mph meatball "just because people have bad days".

I'm in control of putting myself in the best position to succeed with RNG if I understand the game. I'm not in control when things are predetermined at all.

"Predetermined outcome" to simulate real life is basically an oxymoron.

[The Chef]

Quote: Originally Posted by bredfan

RNG is not the same as swinging through an 89 mph meatball "just because people have bad days". I'm in control of putting myself in the best position to succeed with RNG if I understand the game. I'm not in control when things are predetermined at all. "Predetermined outcome" to simulate real life is basically an oxymoron.

And you don't think that players in the majors work the counts, get the pitch they want and proceed to miss it? So you don't actually want a game based on realism you want a game that allows you to murder the ball just so long as you work the count and wait for your pitch? These randomizers are built into every sports game out there, I'm confused by what you want the final product to be. Most I'd assume want as close to a simulation experience as possible and to get that it has to have some sort of randomness built in.

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[bredfan]

Quote: Originally Posted by The Chef

And you don't think that players in the majors work the counts, get the pitch they want and proceed to miss it? So you don't actually want a game based on realism you want a game that allows you to murder the ball just so long as you work the count and wait for your pitch? These randomizers are built into every sports game out there, I'm confused by what you want the final product to be. Most I'd assume want as close to a simulation experience as possible and to get that it has to have some sort of randomness built in. Sent from my SM-G920T using Tapatalk

Professional hitters don't miss pitches randomly. They miss because of a mechanical factor.

Either they mistimed their swing, pulled their head, took their eye off the ball, guessed wrong or pulled up ever so slightly.

Frank Thomas is sitting heat. He works the count, gets the One and proceeds to whiff. As he walks back to the dugout the manager says "Frank, what happened?"

Thomas doesn't say, "I was possessed for a second, Skip. Lost all control for no reason." Nah, he tells the manager exactly why he missed.

There's 750 worldwide good enough to play pro baseball. And about 300 of those are pitchers. To suggest that they aren't 100% in control of their results when hitting is crazy, IMO.

[stealyerface]

Quote: Originally Posted by bredfan

When I play The Show, I feel like every outcome has a logical explanation based on my input during any given scenario. I'm sorry that others don't feel that way.

When you have the bases loaded, in the bottom of the ninth, trying to close out a game, and you throw a two seam fastball on the edge of the plate, and the catcher goes through some weird contortion, and for whatever, unforeseen reason, tries to lunge for a ballthat is in the strike zone, thereby causing the ball to skip off the glove, roll to the backstop and allowing the winning run to score... that is not an outcome based on my input.

When you camp out under a ball in outfield with a 94 rated right fielder, and the animation takes over where the ball bounces off the heel of the glove, that is not based on my user input.

Because the way the baseball gods work, is that sometimes, there is just something at work, beyond explanation, and that is the way the game goes.

Have a guy who is struggling in the field, and the ball will find him. It always does.

Have a close play that goes against you on a pick off at second, and the next pitch will inevitably score the run where the runner should have been out. It happens.

So for a game to try and replicate these untoward moments, but massaging the code to either enhance attributes, or degrade them, not only takes a brass set, it is also brilliant.

Not everything goes the way is should, could, or ought to. Guys miss easy pitches, guys get picked off when they shouldn't, and guys miss balls they make a play on the other 99% of the time.

In order for a game to truly be a SIM, it need to go beyond the mastering of your button presses and inputs, in order to stretch the boundaries of the game within the game.

This is why I stopped pitching with the meters or the pulse pitching. Because once you master the mini-game, you all of a sudden become Cy Young with Drew Pomerantz.

I don't want my 5th starter to go out and dominate because I have mastered the input of a pitching mini-game. I want ratings, I want situational outcomes, and I want the ebb and flow of baseball to have a say in the outcomes. And if, within that say, the game has figured out that for a certain game on the schedule, Jose Altuve is going to have an off day, or he is tired, or he is going to struggle, so be it, and good on the developers for actually instituting a part of the game that is unseen, and is just understood.

I'm not sure if you played baseball at any levels, but if you did, you'll totally get how brilliant the philosophy (whether it is in there or not) is to have Variable Stuff that you get no control over.

That being said, I'll make this my last post on the subject. The horse died about three pages back.

~syf



l

[bredfan]

Quote: Originally Posted by stealyerface

When you have the bases loaded, in the bottom of the ninth, trying to close out a game, and you throw a two seam fastball on the edge of the plate, and the catcher goes through some weird contortion, and for whatever, unforeseen reason, tries to lunge for a ballthat is in the strike zone, thereby causing the ball to skip off the glove, roll to the backstop and allowing the winning run to score... that is not an outcome based on my input. When you camp out under a ball in outfield with a 94 rated right fielder, and the animation takes over where the ball bounces off the heel of the glove, that is not based on my user input. Because the way the baseball gods work, is that sometimes, there is just something at work, beyond explanation, and that is the way the game goes. Have a guy who is struggling in the field, and the ball will find him. It always does. Have a close play that goes against you on a pick off at second, and the next pitch will inevitably score the run where the runner should have been out. It happens. So for a game to try and replicate these untoward moments, but massaging the code to either enhance attributes, or degrade them, not only takes a brass set, it is also brilliant. Not everything goes the way is should, could, or ought to. Guys miss easy pitches, guys get picked off when they shouldn't, and guys miss balls they make a play on the other 99% of the time. In order for a game to truly be a SIM, it need to go beyond the mastering of your button presses and inputs, in order to stretch the boundaries of the game within the game. This is why I stopped pitching with the meters or the pulse pitching. Because once you master the mini-game, you all of a sudden become Cy Young with Drew Pomerantz. I don't want my 5th starter to go out and dominate because I have mastered the input of a pitching mini-game. I want ratings, I want situational outcomes, and I want the ebb and flow of baseball to have a say in the outcomes. And if, within that say, the game has figured out that for a certain game on the schedule, Jose Altuve is going to have an off day, or he is tired, or he is going to struggle, so be it, and good on the developers for actually instituting a part of the game that is unseen, and is just understood. I'm not sure if you played baseball at any levels, but if you did, you'll totally get how brilliant the philosophy (whether it is in there or not) is to have Variable Stuff that you get no control over. That being said, I'll make this my last post on the subject. The horse died about three pages back. ~syf l

Talking about hitting, bro. Errors are an entirely different animal.

[crques]

At first I was reading this thread because I was concerned about some issues regarding the patch. Now the past few days it has been purely entertaining at some of the posts that make it in here. I think games have advanced so much that sometimes we have a tendency to blur the line between real life and fantasy. This is a video game, and each and every one of us that play have fantasy results in our own little video gaming world. This isn't an actual MLB game that you see in person or on tv. There is a huge amount of realism that can be captured in sports video games, however there will never be a perfect game that mimics real life in every single aspect of the game. There are always things that I wish could be better or more realistic in sports video games, and I'm positive there always will be as long as I'm playing.

In saying that, I'm almost 41 years old. I've been playing video games since I was about 6 or 7 years old when the Atari first came out. The amount of progression that has been made in the past 35 years of my video gaming experience is astounding. I remember playing the first few Tony LaRussa baseball games on the Sega Genesis thinking they were the greatest games of all time. I wasn't concerned about glitches, or bugs in those games. I was playing those games for what they were and having a blast in doing so. Heck, going back even further I couldn't tell you the amount of time I spent playing Nintendo games like Baseball Stars and Baseball Simulator 1.000. I remember spending hour after hour researching box scores from the newspapers and Baseball Weekly so I could create the most realistic and accurate teams and lineups on those games. Those games were far from perfect, but man they were fun.

I could go on and on about baseball games throughout the years and things I enjoyed about them or things that were wrong with them, but the bottom line is this...they are video games and we should enjoy them more for what they are, instead of what they are not...which is real life. I think most of us on here, myself included at times, should take a step back and appreciate what we have with games like The Show. The game is amazing, all things considered. Have fun with it.

[parky_17]

Also with these 'bad days' would they really apply to play now games? Where there's no stamina involved, no possible injury or no morale taken into account
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