Peter Moore Confirms on YouTube Stream That EA Still Exclusive With NFL

[Jet Sufferer]

Quote: Originally Posted by PVarck31

I'm not saying you should be happy with exclusivity. I'm just saying people should know by now that it's not gonna change. The NFL will give EA the chance to retain it every time its up and they will. This is why I say nothing will change and we shouldn't be surprised by it. In my opinion, the exclusive deal will remain in place until console gaming is no longer. Every year someone comes here or there and says another NFL game is coming and people get so excited, only to be let down every year. So I choose to no longer believe anything will change.

I simply don't accept that it's never going to change.

If Roger Goodell and the NFLPA got a couple million hand written letters voicing their displeasure about the agreement with EA they would notice, there's one scenario, one that hasn't unfortunately hasn't happened yet.

Another scenario where a competitor comes along and offers full customization and the game sells like hotcakes.

Now there's a problem for EA and the NFL. Someone is making an "NFL" game and the NFL isn't getting paid. EA is paying for an exclusive that's not really an exclusive.

Now we are into lawyer territory. There is also another possible outcome other than lawyers. Perhaps EA says, well if this game is going to sell a million or two copies without having the license, maybe they can pay part of the license and we can recoup some of our money from the lost sales by "sharing" the cost of the license.

If let's say Montana does just that and the modding community makes it an NFL game, EA is going to feel ripped off and rightfully so. Just like EA got away with making historic rosters for a long time until guys realized. Hey they're using my likeness etc. for free.

This is only relevant if a game like Montana is really good and sells really well. It could get very interesting very quickly if Montana sells a couple million copies and Madden loses a couple million units.

Which is why I could never for the life of me understand why 2K didn't do this. They knew they had a competitor ripe for the picking. You may have to absorb some costs at the beginning but eventually you could be king of football again.

I'm not a lawyer, but I'm not certain just how far you can push with the customization and infringing on the license with user content, etc.

[aholbert32]

Quote: Originally Posted by Jet Sufferer

I simply don't accept that it's never going to change. If Roger Goodell and the NFLPA got a couple million hand written letters voicing their displeasure about the agreement with EA they would notice, there's one scenario, one that hasn't unfortunately hasn't happened yet. Another scenario where a competitor comes along and offers full customization and the game sells like hotcakes. Now there's a problem for EA and the NFL. Someone is making an "NFL" game and the NFL isn't getting paid. EA is paying for an exclusive that's not really an exclusive. Now we are into lawyer territory. There is also another possible outcome other than lawyers. Perhaps EA says, well if this game is going to sell a million or two copies without having the license, maybe they can pay part of the license and we can recoup some of our money from the lost sales by "sharing" the cost of the license. If let's say Montana does just that and the modding community makes it an NFL game, EA is going to feel ripped off and rightfully so. Just like EA got away with making historic rosters for a long time until guys realized. Hey they're using my likeness etc. for free. This is only relevant if a game like Montana is really good and sells really well. It could get very interesting very quickly if Montana sells a couple million copies and Madden loses a couple million units. Which is why I could never for the life of me understand why 2K didn't do this. They knew they had a competitor ripe for the picking. You may have to absorb some costs at the beginning but eventually you could be king of football again. I'm not a lawyer, but I'm not certain just how far you can push with the customization and infringing on the license with user content, etc.

I'm an IP (copyright/trademark) lawyer so I'll give you my input:

First, you and I know that a million people wont write emails, hand written notes or tweets to the NFL and NFLPA about Madden. They wont. Even though many at OS like to believe that most of the gaming world is unhappy with Madden....its simply not true. I'm not saying that a significant amount of people dont have issues with the game just not enough to start a significant campaign.

Two, a generic game will never sell millions. Why? Because customization is too difficult. Most people think it will be as easy as a game allowing customization, a user (or group of users) creating a NFL mod with real players, uniforms etc and the game having an easy way for people to download this mod.

There are a bunch of problems with that:

- The generic game cant host those mods within the game. EA and the NFL would immediately send cease and desist letters to that company and demand that they take down that mod. If they dont they would be subject to losing millions of dollars in a copyright infringement suit. It would be a slam dunk case and would bankrupt the company.

- Next gen has made it virtually impossible to share content outside of the consoles because save files are tied to console IDs and no one has figured how to crack this. So people on consoles would be forced to create their own NFL and most people dont want to do that.

- So that leaves the PC. The mod issue isnt as much of a problem because you can share mods through the internet and they wont be difficult to install. Sounds good right? Here is what would happen in real life:

The NFL and EA would hire a law firm on retainer. Each day a paralegal would scour the net looking for nfl mods for JM16. That paralegal would send a cease and desist letter to any site that hosted the file. Most legitimate sites like OS and others would refuse to host the files because they want to avoid a lawsuit. Some would ignore the cease and desist letter....

....and those people would get served with trademark and copyright infringement lawsuits. These suits likely wouldnt cost EA/NFL much money because they are straight forward lawsuits, the lawyers are on a retainer and most of these lawsuits would be won very early in the process.

[pantherfan_forever17]

Think about it. If you owned the rights to the nfl in video game form and made bank every year would YOU give it up? heck no you wouldn't and if you say yes you would you are a dang lier or you made enough money that you could retire and live on a beach for the rest of your natural life. A company like ea would be stupid to give it up. Don't blame them, blame the nfl. And i'm certain if another game company came along and whispered in the nflpa/comish ear "pssh heres a couple million dollars mind if we make a nfl game?" i'm sure the nfl would say yes. money talks. sad but true.

[denverbro89]

I would love to see Pro Football Focus kick start their very own football game.

[bad_philanthropy]

Quote: Originally Posted by aholbert32

I'm an IP (copyright/trademark) lawyer so I'll give you my input: - So that leaves the PC. The mod issue isnt as much of a problem because you can share mods through the internet and they wont be difficult to install. Sounds good right? Here is what would happen in real life: The NFL and EA would hire a law firm on retainer. Each day a paralegal would scour the net looking for nfl mods for JM16. That paralegal would send a cease and desist letter to any site that hosted the file. Most legitimate sites like OS and others would refuse to host the files because they want to avoid a lawsuit. Some would ignore the cease and desist letter....

Could you commment on why games like PES with option files overcoming lack of licensing, and similarly, FIFA 15 on PC having users adding new (authentically portrayed) leagues to the game, players, etc.. don't find themselves in this scenario? And, why the websites hosting and distributing these custom mods aren't subject to the legal action you describe?

The issue, as you stated it, seems correct to me. I'm just curious why reality doesn't appear to match the legal structure here. Or, is it just a case of video games plus licensing issues being a bit of a new frontier in IP? Should we stay tuned for more legal enforcement over mods and scaling back of customization in games generally?

[aholbert32]

Quote: Originally Posted by bad_philanthropy

Could you commment on why games like PES with option files overcoming lack of licensing, and similarly, FIFA 15 on PC having users adding new (authentically portrayed) leagues to the game, players, etc.. don't find themselves in this scenario? And, why the websites hosting and distributing these custom mods aren't subject to the legal action you describe? The issue, as you stated it, seems correct to me. I'm just curious why reality doesn't appear to match the legal structure here. Or, is it just a case of video games plus licensing issues being a bit of a new frontier in IP? Should we stay tuned for more legal enforcement over mods and scaling back of customization in games generally?

Good question:

I'll give you an example with PES. I used to play the hell out of PES 6-7 years ago and I was an avid visitor to the sites that had their mods. I downloaded a mod that put the entire Premier League (stadiums, uniforms, chants, rosters) in the game. It was a really popular mod.

Well the Premier League got wind of this mod and sent that site a cease and desist letter. The site ignored the cease and desist letter so the PL sent a cease and desist letter to the online host of the site and got the ENTIRE site taken down. Hosting copyrighted or trademarked material without permission was a violation of the sites agreement with its host so the host took down the site.

Now to your question about why PES and EA get away with it, the answer is two fold. Regarding PES, EA isnt concerned about that game especially when the majority of mods are on PC. PES 15 sold half a million copies on 5 platforms and a small amount of that on PC. Take that small percentage of PC buyers and reduce it even further because not everyone who owns the PC game uses mods.

Regarding FIFA and its mods, I think those smaller leagues dont actually care and actually see those mods as publicity. Also, is it worth it to hire lawyers to go after a small community of fans who want to add your league to the world's most popular sports game?

At that small number, its not worth it for EA to start a campaign to keep those mods off the net. Especially when FIFA is the #1 selling sports game in the world.

Because of the Digital Millenium Copyright Act, websites are only obligated to remove copyrighted works from their sites once notified that the hosting of those works constitutes copyright infringement.

For example, I could post a new Lil Wayne song on OS for download. Wayne's record label would send OS a takedown letter. OS would have two choices: Take it down and face no consequences or leave it up and get sued. Wayne's label could then go after me for copyright infringement but thats unlikely because even if they win they will likely receive little in damages because I'm not exactly rich.

Finally, if JM16 has full customization and isnt a success, I dont see EA or the NFL doing anything to stop PC mods. But if its a success, I expect them to go scorched earth and do what ever they can to stop any NFL mod.

[Steel4Reel]

Quote: Originally Posted by denverbro89

I would love to see Pro Football Focus kick start their very own football game.

Umm...why?

[Sheba2011]

Quote: Originally Posted by denverbro89

I would love to see Pro Football Focus kick start their very own football game.

I wasn't aware they had any history of making video games. Not sure what the advantage of some sports stat site would be to making a video game. You think it would be better because for some reason? Just trying to understand the logic on this.