If NBA Live Has a Future, It Has to Look Radically Different

[WTF]

Quote: Originally Posted by shutdown10

If you are seeing so much promise in this franchise, then you should provide alot of helpful feedback to that Live development team so they can make Live 15 a true next gen experience. Defending your experiences with the game is not going to change the sales numbers for this game. I advise you to get on twitter with Scott O Gallagher and Sean O Brien to provide great feedback to them if they are allowed to make Live 15

I'm providing my feedback through a public forum here.

It's much more helpful than saying "This game sucks..." "RIP Live".... "2k all the way".

What do those type of comments do? Nothing. If you all want to play the game, and post some thoughts on how to expand and make the game better, then by all means, do so.

What I see, is what I'm posting on. That's it. EASports_AJ is here on OS, and taking things to the dev team. I'm posting constructive criticisms both here and in private through several different channels.

I don't want what 2k is offering right now. Do I wish Live had their graphics? For the most part, yes. Do I wish they had their animations? For the most part, yes, UNLESS it was at the sacrifice of gameplay.

Feel free to disagree. But don't bash other members for seeing something differently than you do. And don't tell me to "help" the EA Sports team by not sharing my feelings on the game. If I'm sharing my thoughts, and it's what appeals to "me", then I'm content. I'm not in the majority, and I'll take that. I want a dynamic basketball game. I don't want a game that I know the outcome before I finish the game.

[Boilerbuzz]

Quote: Originally Posted by FLIGHTWHITE

Hilarious how almost every thread that you chime in on if impressions aren't in line with yours we are the issue/clueless. Lol You do know that our opinions have about the same weight as yours on forums right?? It's cool Boilerbuzz if you don't like the game.

Sorry. Did I offend you with a fair question? I didn't say anyone was clueless. I just asked how did he draw his conclusion. That's it. Beyond that, 20k units sold makes quite a statement: people don't seem to like the game. You don't know what my opinion really is. I don't come in here to trash the game. I come to see how others are enjoying it so that I can maximize my investment. Regardless if you or I have the same opinion of the game, it shouldn't affect anyone's ability to answer my question, if they so choose.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

[23]

Quote: Originally Posted by WTF

Wrong. Graphically speaking it doesn't stand up to any next gen game. That's where it doesn't stack up.

Graphically the game is a fail, and that doesn't even need to be said point blank because everyone knows it, and thats not the point.

This game looks like something that should've been released 3 or 4 years ago not matter what kind of pink elephant is in the room about it. Either EA knew something was wrong with it because they hid is just like they did Elite and with Live 2007, or they thought this game was good enough to make sales to sustain the budget and that's even scarier.

Quote:

If the game released today, with how the game is playing today, then it wouldn't get the 4.3 from IGN that it received. If it did, I would question it wholeheartedly. That being said, the original demo that was played prior to Synergy kicking in, yes, that game deserved a 4.3. The tendencies, etc did not feel like they were "in" the game, no baseline so to speak.

Look man, I know about Synergy. Its not new, its been in 2 other previous iterations of this series, and that still didn't stop it from being cancelled. NBA Inside Drive which did this thing much better over a decade ago died and left the scene. Many of us loved that series and that started the whole tendency revolution, but even that game didn't last.

Secondly synergy is not the be all end all, which is why I had to edit Live 10 until my fingers turned blue. Its much more than a tendency data driven game in the background.... and frankly with as much time as they had, if this is the best they can crank out I wouldn't be surprised to see more articles like this and any less than stellar reviews in the future. It wasn't just IGN, it wasn't just OS, and it wasn't just Gamespot, it was just about everybody out there... and if you think this game will continue to survive on that get ready to be let down again.

Every game that I play, is a different experience. You're not looking for the "cheese" that you see in a rubberband AI. You're constantly trying to find a mismatch, pick your spots, put together a string of stops and scores. What I'm not doing, is shaking my head in disbelief that a ball morphed THROUGH 3 of my defenders to allow the CPU to score because the game was determined that it was scoring regardless. If I get a rebound, I know I was in position. If I don't get a rebound, I know that the CPU earned the rebound. It wasn't "given" to them because they were "supposed" to get the rebound.

I'm telling EA that I "get" what they were doing. I wish they would have given learning options to teach you the game. No doubt. It would have helped with a lot of the issues that you saw. I also wish they would have included tendencies from the get-go, because in my eyes it's night and day after the updates.

Again, you all play whatever game you want. I'm just disagreeing with the premise that it has to look radically different than the game I'm playing "now". Not when it first released, but NOW.[/quote]

Now or later I think your enjoyment of this game is hampering you from seeing that it probably won't last in its current state. I know you disagree, im telling you with a sales number that low a large company wont continue to dump resources into a game costing them so much money.

[Boilerbuzz]

Quote: Originally Posted by WTF

I'm providing my feedback through a public forum here. It's much more helpful than saying "This game sucks..." "RIP Live".... "2k all the way". What do those type of comments do? Nothing. If you all want to play the game, and post some thoughts on how to expand and make the game better, then by all means, do so. What I see, is what I'm posting on. That's it. EASports_AJ is here on OS, and taking things to the dev team. I'm posting constructive criticisms both here and in private through several different channels. I don't want what 2k is offering right now. Do I wish Live had their graphics? For the most part, yes. Do I wish they had their animations? For the most part, yes, UNLESS it was at the sacrifice of gameplay. Feel free to disagree. But don't bash other members for seeing something differently than you do. And don't tell me to "help" the EA Sports team by not sharing my feelings on the game. If I'm sharing my thoughts, and it's what appeals to "me", then I'm content. I'm not in the majority, and I'll take that. I want a dynamic basketball game. I don't want a game that I know the outcome before I finish the game.

You used quite a few words to say you're more willing to forgive Live for its issues, than you are willing to forgive 2k for its issues. I'm sure you have your reasons. It just seems like a personal crusade. You keep talking about how they "broke your game". But that is neither here nor there.

A person can take ANY game and get the experience they desire out of it. Some of you really seem to turn a blind eye to the bad basketball that is played in the game. Much of which have been documented. Yet, you shrug your shoulders and move forward and rejoice in the good. And, I say that is exactly how you should play your games. It just seems you're going overboard when it comes to this game.

No one is saying that you have to help out the Live developers with feedback. But if you truly enjoy the game that much, why not?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

[shutdown10]

Quote: Originally Posted by WTF

I'm providing my feedback through a public forum here. It's much more helpful than saying "This game sucks..." "RIP Live".... "2k all the way". What do those type of comments do? Nothing. If you all want to play the game, and post some thoughts on how to expand and make the game better, then by all means, do so. What I see, is what I'm posting on. That's it. EASports_AJ is here on OS, and taking things to the dev team. I'm posting constructive criticisms both here and in private through several different channels. I don't want what 2k is offering right now. Do I wish Live had their graphics? For the most part, yes. Do I wish they had their animations? For the most part, yes, UNLESS it was at the sacrifice of gameplay. Feel free to disagree. But don't bash other members for seeing something differently than you do. And don't tell me to "help" the EA Sports team by not sharing my feelings on the game. If I'm sharing my thoughts, and it's what appeals to "me", then I'm content. I'm not in the majority, and I'll take that. I want a dynamic basketball game. I don't want a game that I know the outcome before I finish the game.

I'm not bashing you or any member on this forum about EA's ongoing issues with this franchise. I just wanted to see if you were doing your part to make sure this game improves. If you believe in something, then you do what is necessary to see it improve. I read this review the other day about what EA needs to do to be successful with this franchise again. The review said that EA would have to give their community and consumers more open feedback if they want to survive. I understand that they are watching these threads from the shadows, but what is that going to do for this franchise going forward? One thing I like about Live 10's team is that they were on this forum consistently providing open feedback with us. I was just a lurker back then, but I observed and respected what Mike Wang did on this forum for Live 10. It is vital that the new Live team connect with their community going forward. We must pound it in their heads that they need to actively communicate with us or never receive consumer trust. They cannot hide what they are working on any longer from this point on. I want success for them, but when are they finally going to deliver?

[NoTiCe_O]

Quote: Originally Posted by Boilerbuzz

I'm sorry, but how do you come to this conclusion? I see no basis for this. I've seen very little PvP Live gameplay that would support any such claim. And all anyone has posted here has been the six Live zealots posting sandbox videos and how the more they play it, the more they love it. (I call these the "Jedi Mind-trick" posts) Those are funny. But how in the world is Live so "skill based" (da-hell does that even mean, anyway)? I'm not saying you're wrong. I just want to know what makes you feel this claim is valid. The bottom line of the OP is that this was their chance to make up ground. And whether you like the game or not, the fact remains that the game is failing. It doesn't matter if you think it's a good game. If the vast majority of gamers don't want a game that is your idea of "good", then you won't have a game. It should also tell you that you need to reevaluate your sense of judgement, frankly. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

Well unlike you I haven't let a few videos and posts on a public forum decide my decision of whether a game is good or not. I've actually researched, been on twitch watching streams and I've seen it with my own eyes. I've watched games where a guy was up 70-8 going into the fourth quarter simply because he knew what he was doing and his opponent didn't. I've seen a game where a guy tried to hop step cheese a victory with LeBron and a basketball minded gamer decided to change up his strategy and the cheeser was completely shut down.

Just watching online games you can tell there is a definite difference between people who know what they're doing and people who are just playing. It's the only reason I compared the game to Street Fighter earlier because when watching street fighter you can who's highly skilled, who's alright, and who's just button mashing. It's the same thing with Live. I've seen the guys who have the bouncetek, post game, shooting, pick and roll, and defense all together just demolish folks. I say it's skilled because you could be good at one of the previous mentioned areas but a well rounded player is good at it all. It's not scripted outcomes but rather stick skill and basketball knowledge that will get you the victory.

I've played 2k14 next gen and I can say the gameplay is still very cheesable. Meaning there's just certain things that are going to happen if you want them to, it's not as free flowing as Live and essentially you get luck plays every now and then. In Live if someone knows what he is doing he can SHUT YOU DOWN! Like it should be. Just like if I'm playing Street Fighter and I know what I'm doing and you don't you're going to get whooped, it's not even a question.

In 2k there's shots that you know will be more high percentage than others no matter the contest, in Live you can be more satisfied on defense knowing that if you have the stick skills to control your defense correctly you'll be rewarded because the shots aren't just falling because the game says so, but it's more based on what you're doing to stop the opponent. Are you sending doubles? Are you going over the screen or under? Are you full court pressing or staying back? Zone or Man? I've seen all these strategies make a significant difference in Live to the point where the opponent panic's and just starts messing up.

I don't get the same vibe from 2k, it's more flashy and just a really pretty game of basketball, but the same grind to win isn't there, at least not without feeling like you got jipped. The main difference I see between Live and 2k is that if you lose in Live it's still satisfying because you know you were the cause of the loss. In 2k when you lose most times you it's because a certain animation didn't go your way at a certain point, or someone was abusing a certain animation, and instead of trying to beat someone with basketball strategy you're worrying about stopping a certain animation.

Also, I still don't get why people are bringing up the "Well the fact that you like the game isn't going to make it sell better, it's still doing terrible." argument. I mean are we consumers or producers, are you the one making the game and getting royalties, no, so why do you care how well it's selling, is that really a concern of yours when buying a game? "Hmm, Well I wonder if the games gonna sell? Hmm, probably not I'll pass." Really? Enjoy what you like and don't let figures decide what you enjoy. If that's the case most of you people probably have an iPad, iPhone, iMac, and some of the other hottest not neccsarily greatest gadgets because "They're selling well, or they're popular"

Sorry but I'm not the guy that follows the trends I buy what I like and enjoy, and if it happens to be Live then let it be. Fact of the matter is the game is very skill based whether you decide to see it or not.

I'm really not one to argue over the forums but I just have to speak my mind, I also respect WTF's opinion because he clearly can see the basketball aspects of the game that make it fun and isn't just saying he likes it for attention or something. The game s legitimately fun if you'll play it right and learn it. (Also, you must have some sort of basketball knowledge to really get the most out of the game, a BASKETBALL game mind you). That's how it should be.

Don't expect a reply if you're just going to say I work for EA, or I'm a fanboy, or I'm blind or something. ( Fair Warning)

[King_B_Mack]

Quote: Originally Posted by NoTiCe_O

Well unlike you I haven't let a few videos and posts on a public forum decide my decision of whether a game is good or not. I've actually researched, been on twitch watching streams and I've seen it with my own eyes. I've watched games where a guy was up 70-8 going into the fourth quarter simply because he knew what he was doing and his opponent didn't. I've seen a game where a guy tried to hop step cheese a victory with LeBron and a basketball minded gamer decided to change up his strategy and the cheeser was completely shut down. Just watching online games you can tell there is a definite difference between people who know what they're doing and people who are just playing. It's the only reason I compared the game to Street Fighter earlier because when watching street fighter you can who's highly skilled, who's alright, and who's just button mashing. It's the same thing with Live. I've seen the guys who have the bouncetek, post game, shooting, pick and roll, and defense all together just demolish folks. I say it's skilled because you could be good at one of the previous mentioned areas but a well rounded player is good at it all. It's not scripted outcomes but rather stick skill and basketball knowledge that will get you the victory. I've played 2k14 next gen and I can say the gameplay is still very cheesable. Meaning there's just certain things that are going to happen if you want them to, it's not as free flowing as Live and essentially you get luck plays every now and then. In Live if someone knows what he is doing he can SHUT YOU DOWN! Like it should be. Just like if I'm playing Street Fighter and I know what I'm doing and you don't you're going to get whooped, it's not even a question. In 2k there's shots that you know will be more high percentage than others no matter the contest, in Live you can be more satisfied on defense knowing that if you have the stick skills to control your defense correctly you'll be rewarded because the shots aren't just falling because the game says so, but it's more based on what you're doing to stop the opponent. Are you sending doubles? Are you going over the screen or under? Are you full court pressing or staying back? Zone or Man? I've seen all these strategies make a significant difference in Live to the point where the opponent panic's and just starts messing up. I don't get the same vibe from 2k, it's more flashy and just a really pretty game of basketball, but the same grind to win isn't there, at least not without feeling like you got jipped. The main difference I see between Live and 2k is that if you lose in Live it's still satisfying because you know you were the cause of the loss. In 2k when you lose most times you it's because a certain animation didn't go your way at a certain point, or someone was abusing a certain animation, and instead of trying to beat someone with basketball strategy you're worrying about stopping a certain animation. Also, I still don't get why people are bringing up the "Well the fact that you like the game isn't going to make it sell better, it's still doing terrible." argument. I mean are we consumers or producers, are you the one making the game and getting royalties, no, so why do you care how well it's selling, is that really a concern of yours when buying a game? "Hmm, Well I wonder if the games gonna sell? Hmm, probably not I'll pass." Really? Enjoy what you like and don't let figures decide what you enjoy. If that's the case most of you people probably have an iPad, iPhone, iMac, and some of the other hottest not neccsarily greatest gadgets because "They're selling well, or they're popular" Sorry but I'm not the guy that follows the trends I buy what I like and enjoy, and if it happens to be Live then let it be. Fact of the matter is the game is very skill based whether you decide to see it or not. I'm really not one to argue over the forums but I just have to speak my mind, I also respect WTF's opinion because he clearly can see the basketball aspects of the game that make it fun and isn't just saying he likes it for attention or something. The game s legitimately fun if you'll play it right and learn it. (Also, you must have some sort of basketball knowledge to really get the most out of the game, a BASKETBALL game mind you). That's how it should be. Don't expect a reply if you're just going to say I work for EA, or I'm a fanboy, or I'm blind or something. ( Fair Warning)

C'mon son. C'mon.

[Boilerbuzz]

Quote: Originally Posted by NoTiCe_O

Well unlike you I haven't let a few videos and posts on a public forum decide my decision of whether a game is good or not.

Master Jedi, again, I don't feel the need to constantly post why I like or dislike a game. "Wow! The more I play it, the more I love it. It's just so deep! Blah blah blah!"

Hey, did you forget who you're addressing? I'm the one that saw it at E3. I'm the one that got it before ship date. Four days before most of you Jedi here! So kill the sheep talk, dude. You don't know anything about how I form my opinions.

Frankly, I'm not going to respond to the rest of your post. It is full of the same Jedi assertions that have no details or examples to back them up. Not to mention the laughable comparisons to Street Fighter and 2K. No, I won't accuse you of working for EA or any of that other stuff. Why? There are thousands of rabid fans out there willing to eat up anything their favorite game shovels in their face. I'll just say this; all I want to hear are the details. You guys keep repeating the same thing, waiting for the brainwashing to kick in. I want to hear details. See evidence. Not clunky highlight videos that could be ripped apart at a moments notice.

So, I ask again - what are you seeing exactly that leads you to the conclusion I asked you about? It was just a question. Why so much resistance to actually answering it?