NBA 2K14 Video - San Antonio Spurs vs. Miami Heat (Gamescom)

[VDusen04]

Quote: Originally Posted by Seidowskyy

They took out canned animation dunks because there was an exploit called power dunking where you could basically do posters all gm. plus, who wants to feel helpless on defense?

I think Sundown put it best, "So long as the physics, mechanics, and animations look correct, the success and trigger rates can be tuned." When a defender's going up to contest a dunk in a video game, timing, ability, rating, momentum and likely a number of other variables are taken into consideration. What I was saying is if those variables add up to the game allowing me to complete a blocked shot, I'd like it to look authentic and real, and at this point that seems it'd need a two-person animation.

Similarly, if I'm a sitting duck and due to my poor positioning and the fact that I'm controlling Muggsy Bogues, I'd rather have a two-person dunk-on animation occur instead of the dunker slamming as if I weren't even there with my virtual Bogues just jumping straight up and down with his hand straight up (or heaven forbid, being slid backward in mid-air 2K13 style).

A couple of examples - one would be at the 1:58 mark belwo. Vernon Maxwell has no chance. There's contact, but he's just jumping straight up and down and he's slide backward in mid-air. It's established he's not going to block the dunk, so I am stating I'd rather have Maxwell interact with O'Neal realistically, even if he's going to fail due to his poor positioning (and the fact he's Vernon Maxwell trying to block Shaq):



On the flip side, the number 1 play in that video (3:25) is a two-player animation (or as close as 2K13 got to one). I find those interactions much more aesthetically appealing.

2K12's dunks in traffic looked much better in my opinion due to the aforementioned animations:

[Sundown]

Quote: Originally Posted by VDusen04

Totally. I never truly understood the push for the removal of all two-player animations. At this point in gaming technology, there has to be some sort of interactive animation. In 2K13, it seems they tried to pull those animations out and hilarity and frustration frequently ensued, with a very rare amount of authentic looking mid-air interactions (but a lot of defenders changing directory mid-flight).

Yeah, while cutting down on the length of uncontrollable animations was effort well spent, the elimination of realistic interaction animations was misguided. We'll still need them to drive physical simulation systems if we ever get them.

So y'all got dunked on. Don't be late on defense next time. Or play on sim. The problem wasn't the animations, it was how often they triggered, how repetitive they were, and how overpowered they made dunking in traffic online each and every year.

Unfortunately 2K spent a year working on a dynamic contact shot system that only works for terrible shot attempts but doesn't work on dunks or drives with any real speed. But hey! No dunk ons! Only dunk throughs... ALL THE TIME.

Becareful what you ask for.

So to iterate what I think gamers want even if they don't know it and throw around verbiage like "no more animations!" without knowing what it means:

1. Responsive, realistic, visually and physically accurate simulations >

2. Responsive, visually accurate animations >

3. Unresponsive, lengthy but visually accurate animations >

4. Responsive but ugly, unrealistic physical simulations (IMO. Some would put this above 3.) >

5. Unresponsive, lengthy non-animations that both look bad and with allloss of control.

2K13 Sliding dunk-throughs are 5. It fixes no problems but just makes existing ones look even more terrible. It's like that evil genie that twists every request into the ironic abomination you never asked for.


And I know there are those that want jerky, "responsive" gameplay no matter how bad it looks. They can go play NBA Jam.

[23]

They really need to get the sp and foundation down before worrying about online play. If that portion is messed up online always will be messed up.

Galaxy Note 2

[Sundown]

Quote: Originally Posted by Seidowskyy

They took out canned animation dunks because there was an exploit called power dunking where you could basically do posters all gm. plus, who wants to feel helpless on defense?

You can still do posters all game. We still feel helpless on defense, except now it looks terrible too.

Dunk ons looked great in 2K12, even if overpowered.

At least in 2K13, it looks so terrible that neither the defense or offense are happy about it. Balance or something, I guess.

[Seidowskyy]

Quote: Originally Posted by Sundown

You can still do posters all game. We still feel helpless on defense, except now it looks terrible too. Dunk ons looked great in 2K12, even if overpowered. At least in 2K13, it looks so terrible that neither the defense or offense are happy about it. Balance or something, I guess.

lol you can bump though in 2k13, without having to worrying about the spin dunk.

In 2k11, you had to bump properly, bump so they couldnt get near the spin dunk trigger areas, then prepare for the hopstep and manual cut to the paint.

then people like batum/gwall/wade/bron would dunk on your team if they completed the pass.

14 double, if ran correctly, was the most dominant play in 2k history with yao , twill and budda.

GG

Power dunk on one side, stand dunk on the other. Thats why they took them out,

Look what these two players that I know did all gm in 2k11

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5mpc66ArD88

thats why canned animations were taken out.

[Seidowskyy]

and in 2k12, there was a play where you had people crossing under the rim, and only certain players like durant and rudy gay who had certain hesitations could pull off a power dunk , canned dunk animations consistently.

I play 2k for money year around, so i am soooooo happy they took that bull**** out.

now if we can block standing dunks.

[Sundown]

Quote: Originally Posted by Seidowskyy

lol you can bump though in 2k13, without having to worrying about the spin dunk. In 2k11, you had to bump properly, bump so they couldnt get near the spin dunk trigger areas, then prepare for the hopstep and manual cut to the paint. then people like batum/gwall/wade/bron would dunk on your team if they completed the pass. 14 double, if ran correctly, was the most dominant play in 2k history with yao , twill and budda. GG Power dunk on one side, stand dunk on the other. Thats why they took them out, Look what these two players that I know did all gm in 2k11 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5mpc66ArD88 thats why canned animations were taken out.

Sigh. Canned animations don't CAUSE overpowered moves.

Bad tuning on what triggers them causes overpowered moves.

If a contact floater lay-up animation always goes in, would you ask for contact lay-ups to be removed from the game?

If contested jump shot animation always makes a 3-pointer go in, would you ask to remove contested jump shots?

If the defender slid out of the way for either but it was just as successful, would it really improve the game any?

All 2K needs to do is tweak how often the dunk-on gets triggered, how much stamina you need, how much free space you need, what speed you need to be while doing it, the height and vertical differences between the players, morale level, and add a random or scaling factor to reduce or increase dunk-ons to a realistic level.

At the same time, they could add additional 2-player animations that favor the defender. Contact dunks-to-layups, missed dunk attempts, blocked dunks (sound familiar?), with unwise dunk attempts being sent back and the dunker falling to their butt.

Balance it all out with proper tuning, and the game would be massively improved while they go on to work on a better, more dynamic contact engine.


Dang, VDusen, after playing 2K13 for a year, 2K12's dunk ons look next-gen to me.

[horrormaster]

That was next-gen footage? I watched 20 seconds of it and wasn't impressed. Maybe if PC gets it it'll look better with higher resolution and all those nice mods.