NHL 13 Screenshots - Dynamic Goalies

[bwiggy33]

Just to show how bad 2k8 blows away NHL 12 in goaltending movement lets just take a look at it from video perspective. I'm just doing this so people can understand the difference in how a game from 2k8 is light years ahead of a game in the year 2012 with goaltending. I shouldn't turn this into a comparison thread but for the sake of the topic I'm going to show it because it's just amazing how opposite the two are.

Here is the video of NHL 12. Backstrom just absolutely warps across the crease while he's already in the splits on the left post. Should never ever ever happen. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kfDWy...feature=relmfu


Now let's take a look at NHL 2k8. Go to the 5:03 mark and look at how Gerber goes down on a shot that ends up getting blocked, but then plants his foot into the ice and he uses his MOMENTUM to slide over realistically to make a great save to his left. It's unbelievable looking. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LT3yF...eature=related

I can only imagine if the NHL crew just even remotely added the movement like this in. Hell the goaltending graphics are unbelievable in this game and have been since 07. 100 X better than 2k8, but movement and saves are much bigger than the graphics IMO. It is just unbelievable how different the two games are goaltending wise.

Once again I'm sorry for comparing the two games but it is mainly for people that were a little confused or didn't know about how bad the movement of goaltending really is in the NHL series. Some of you do know that, but to me I just believe it's unacceptable that goalies still move basically the exact same way since NHL 07. Most important position in sports bar none, and they haven't gotten any true love since possibly the upcoming NHL 13.

[Revan30]

Quote: Originally Posted by bwiggy33

Just to show how bad 2k8 blows away NHL 12 in goaltending movement lets just take a look at it from video perspective. I'm just doing this so people can understand the difference in how a game from 2k8 is light years ahead of a game in the year 2012 with goaltending. I shouldn't turn this into a comparison thread but for the sake of the topic I'm going to show it because it's just amazing how opposite the two are. Here is the video of NHL 12. Backstrom just absolutely warps across the crease while he's already in the splits on the left post. Should never ever ever happen. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kfDWy...feature=relmfu Now let's take a look at NHL 2k8. Go to the 5:03 mark and look at how Gerber goes down on a shot that ends up getting blocked, but then plants his foot into the ice and he uses his MOMENTUM to slide over realistically to make a great save to his left. It's unbelievable looking. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LT3yF...eature=related I can only imagine if the NHL crew just even remotely added the movement like this in. Hell the goaltending graphics are unbelievable in this game and have been since 07. 100 X better than 2k8, but movement and saves are much bigger than the graphics IMO. It is just unbelievable how different the two games are goaltending wise. Once again I'm sorry for comparing the two games but it is mainly for people that were a little confused or didn't know about how bad the movement of goaltending really is in the NHL series. Some of you do know that, but to me I just believe it's unacceptable that goalies still move basically the exact same way since NHL 07. Most important position in sports bar none, and they haven't gotten any true love since possibly the upcoming NHL 13.

I'm actually a huge fan of the 2k8 game. Amazing product.

That being said, I actually think that EA's goalie animations are superior--the problem is that they aren't FLUID.

In the 5:03 example you showed us, Gerber is in the middle of making a butterfly-slide blocker extension save when he stops in the MIDDLE of his animation and turns the other way to make a butterfly-slide trapper extension save.

In EA, the goalie animations don't work like that. If a goalie begins an animation he HAS TO FULLY FINISH IT before he can do ANYTHING else. That's why people have been having so many problems with dumb goalie AI where it looks like a routine reactionary save but the goalie somehow magically screws up and lets in an easy goal--because he's stuck in the middle of completing a different animation.

NHL 2k8 and NHL 2k10 had PHENOMENAL animations, not just from a goalie's game but also from a player's game. Getting awesome, real, fluid, lifelike animations is the key to making a really authentic looking AND authentic feeling sports game. Look at a game like NBA 2k12, and look at all of the incredibly smooth, fluid, and realistic-looking animations that game has got. Everything that a player does in regards to his movements looks dead-on to the way it does in real life.

Even with this year's game, NHL 13, EA is really just advertising a new animation system. The only difference between skating in NHL 12 and NHL 13 is that in NHL 13, players are going to LOOK like they are skating a lot harder--which all add to the authentic aesthetic representation as well as the authentic feel of the game. I've barely been able to play the EA NHL series because the skating feels so clunky and slow--even when it's not--just because the players look so upright and rigid and downright clunky.

Fluid, realistic animations are a huge part of sports games these days. I think that EA has a lot of realistic looking animations in their goalie game--they're just not fluid--which is a big part of making the animations look and feel even more realistic.

[RealmK]

Quote: Originally Posted by bwiggy33

Just to show how bad 2k8 blows away NHL 12 in goaltending movement lets just take a look at it from video perspective. I'm just doing this so people can understand the difference in how a game from 2k8 is light years ahead of a game in the year 2012 with goaltending. I shouldn't turn this into a comparison thread but for the sake of the topic I'm going to show it because it's just amazing how opposite the two are. Here is the video of NHL 12. Backstrom just absolutely warps across the crease while he's already in the splits on the left post. Should never ever ever happen. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kfDWy...feature=relmfu Now let's take a look at NHL 2k8. Go to the 5:03 mark and look at how Gerber goes down on a shot that ends up getting blocked, but then plants his foot into the ice and he uses his MOMENTUM to slide over realistically to make a great save to his left. It's unbelievable looking. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LT3yF...eature=related I can only imagine if the NHL crew just even remotely added the movement like this in. Hell the goaltending graphics are unbelievable in this game and have been since 07. 100 X better than 2k8, but movement and saves are much bigger than the graphics IMO. It is just unbelievable how different the two games are goaltending wise. Once again I'm sorry for comparing the two games but it is mainly for people that were a little confused or didn't know about how bad the movement of goaltending really is in the NHL series. Some of you do know that, but to me I just believe it's unacceptable that goalies still move basically the exact same way since NHL 07. Most important position in sports bar none, and they haven't gotten any true love since possibly the upcoming NHL 13.

Great goalie movement means nothing when the rest of your game sucks more you know what, than Paris Hilton on a Friday night, just sayin. I hear what you're saying Bwiggy truly I do, but when you have a higher desire to have teeth pulled rather than fight with NHL2k's brand of craptastic controls, you've kinda failed as a developer.

[ComaFaction]

Quote: Originally Posted by RealmK

Great goalie movement means nothing when the rest of your game sucks more you know what, than Paris Hilton on a Friday night, just sayin. I hear what you're saying Bwiggy truly I do, but when you have a higher desire to have teeth pulled rather than fight with NHL2k's brand of craptastic controls, you've kinda failed as a developer.

That doesn't mean that we can't asked for things done properly from said game.

[bwiggy33]

Quote: Originally Posted by RealmK

Great goalie movement means nothing when the rest of your game sucks more you know what, than Paris Hilton on a Friday night, just sayin. I hear what you're saying Bwiggy truly I do, but when you have a higher desire to have teeth pulled rather than fight with NHL2k's brand of craptastic controls, you've kinda failed as a developer.

That's what I'm not trying to get into. Screw the rest of 2k8 (which I find pretty damn fun if you actually sit down and practice the game). I don't care at all about anything else. I'm specifically talking about GOALTENDING. You can't even tell me that 2k8's goalies aren't superior than 12's. I don't know how you could. EA has had plenty of time to make this part of the game leaps and bounds better than 07. It hasn't happened. I just watched videos of NHL 07 and the goalies play almost identical to NHL 12. Just sad IMO. Goalie fighting before actually looking at the all around dynamics of what it takes to be a goalie? Pretty sad.

[RealmK]

Quote: Originally Posted by bwiggy33

That's what I'm not trying to get into. Screw the rest of 2k8 (which I find pretty damn fun if you actually sit down and practice the game). I don't care at all about anything else. I'm specifically talking about GOALTENDING. You can't even tell me that 2k8's goalies aren't superior than 12's. I don't know how you could. EA has had plenty of time to make this part of the game leaps and bounds better than 07. It hasn't happened. I just watched videos of NHL 07 and the goalies play almost identical to NHL 12. Just sad IMO. Goalie fighting before actually looking at the all around dynamics of what it takes to be a goalie? Pretty sad.

In the movement animation looking realistic yes. In actual AI? That's debatable. I actually just played a little 2k8 to refresh my memory and while the goalies look good, they're still dumb as a brick, they go down when they don't need to, they're not able to adjust to blocked shots in front of the net very well, and with how bumper car hockey 2k8 is that happens alot. I think often time people look at NHL2k with either rose colored glasses or really want to give passes to 2k that they would never give to EA.

2k made 2 really excellent hockey games, Treyarch's 2k3, and Kush/VC with 2k5, the series was pretty much all down hill in nearly every aspect of gameplay as a whole ever since.

[bwiggy33]

Quote: Originally Posted by RealmK

In the movement animation looking realistic yes. In actual AI? That's debatable. I actually just played a little 2k8 to refresh my memory and while the goalies look good, they're still dumb as a brick, they go down when they don't need to, they're not able to adjust to blocked shots in front of the net very well, and with how bumper car hockey 2k8 is that happens alot. I think often time people look at NHL2k with either rose colored glasses or really want to give passes to 2k that they would never give to EA. 2k made 2 really excellent hockey games, Treyarch's 2k3, and Kush/VC with 2k5, the series was pretty much all down hill in nearly every aspect of gameplay as a whole ever since.

I'm not talking about the AI either on the goalies. I already know that the AI is not going to be the same between 2k and EA. It's just not possible for it to be the same, nor am I asking for it to be the same. I'm talking specifically movement and momentum.

I will give EA props when there is props to be given. Right now I won't give EA a lick of props in the goaltending category because I do not like any part of the goalies besides the graphical look of them. I would love to be giving props to them but that's not going to happen on the goalie side yet. I'm pointing out these flaws because they are extremely major flaws in this game. It shouldn't be overlooked considering the movement of goalies is the most fundamental aspect of goaltending.

Also I never ever liked 2k hockey games until I got sick of the NHL series last year. Once I finally opened up my mind and tried 2k8 and 2k10 I finally saw the good in those games, that's why I am giving them praise. NHL feels way better than 2k but 2k does a lot of things correctly that EA doesn't. One of them definitely being goaltending.

[RealmK]

Quote: Originally Posted by bwiggy33

I'm not talking about the AI either on the goalies. I already know that the AI is not going to be the same between 2k and EA. It's just not possible for it to be the same, nor am I asking for it to be the same. I'm talking specifically movement and momentum. I will give EA props when there is props to be given. Right now I won't give EA a lick of props in the goaltending category because I do not like any part of the goalies besides the graphical look of them. I would love to be giving props to them but that's not going to happen on the goalie side yet. I'm pointing out these flaws because they are extremely major flaws in this game. It shouldn't be overlooked considering the movement of goalies is the most fundamental aspect of goaltending. Also I never ever liked 2k hockey games until I got sick of the NHL series last year. Once I finally opened up my mind and tried 2k8 and 2k10 I finally saw the good in those games, that's why I am giving them praise. NHL feels way better than 2k but 2k does a lot of things correctly that EA doesn't. One of them definitely being goaltending.

No offense Bwigs but you're contradicting yourself. Animations that look good are one thing, and I agree 2k8's goalie animations, push off and all look great, but it's all for show when the AI driving said goaltender is flat out ********.

Edit: holy crap score one for the PC crowd, apparently herp derp is a swear.