Madden NFL 13 Video Interview - EA Tiburon Breaks Down Some of the New Changes

[sgibs7]

Quote: Originally Posted by baller7345

Video should be uploaded soon. Its a little more extreme than I wanted due to me being only an average user when using 1 hand but I've seen things like this not get called on multiple occasions. Its still not something that I would say is worth banning as normally in those situations its just as easy to swat the ball down but when someone doesn't have good user skill then its kind of like a cheap way to stop some throws though much harder to actually accomplish than an actual swat.

ill peak it tomorrow.

as of right now im headed to bed.

tee time for 11.

[baller7345]

There it is, sorry for the crappy quality. That is more blatant than I wanted it to be but that still isn't called very often when I literally ran right into him on that route. That is what I think Big FN Deal is getting at.

[shaunlmason]

Quote: Originally Posted by EmmdotFrisk

haha, what an epic battle. I can't wait to see you Farls, Ryno, and Shaun battle royale for the "sim vs freestyle" debate.

Gibbs, Farls, Drifter and I hashed this out into the wee hours of the morning at a bar one night, we are far closer in perspective than you would imagine.

I'm far more concerned about being honest and respectful than worrying about what is or isn't "sim", though I enforce TSO's community standards as much as anyone. To me, "sim" isn't the underlying tenet of TSO as much as being able to find a league/experience that mimics how you want to play. The only reason we don't have more "freestyle" leagues is we don't have a way to group people appropriately.

[shaunlmason]

Quote: Originally Posted by WFColonel56

You cant govern a playstyle

Sure you can, I do it every day. I'm not religious about it, i.e. I don't think my way is "the one true way".

If I were going to put a dog into this fight, it would be to say this:

The disconnect between "sim" and "freestyle" is the importance placed on the correlation between what is effective in reality vs. what is effective in Madden.

I'm fine with Hernendez at HB, because I know that he has a rare blend of talent that allows him to be effective utilized in a specific scheme in reality. If I am putting him in similar spots where he should have similar success then I'm fine with it.

Conversely, looking at the effectiveness of slot streaks in combination with screen plays; it isn't viable in reality. Why? Screens rely on deception. You are trying to take advantage of the defenses natural inclination to be aggressive upfield. Because of the deception the QB has limited time to make a read, so his key is the screen receiver. In reality, the play is constrained by time, focus, and the inability for the QB to see downfield, where in Madden you only have the time constraint. The camera angle allows you to make that downfield read where most of the time it isn't possible in real life. My opinion is the QB needs to suffer a penalty to his accuracy down field on screen plays in order to balance the effectiveness in game with the effectiveness in reality.

To me that is a "sim" gameplay design element. Would "freestyle" players hate it? Yes because they are unable to impact the game in the manner they choose. To me, it's an "exploit" to abuse the over effectiveness so I choose not to.

Bottom line, there should be a way to do both, because my view isn't the only view. When EA comes out and declares they are making a simulation and not a game my opinion would change.

[CRMosier_LM]

Quote: Originally Posted by Smoke6

This has kept my level of sanity while being in the hospital for the past 2 1/2 days. Baby is wide awoke right now too and im just running off of fumes until she goes to sleep. But im gonna keep fighting! Probably make some FREEstyle MADDEN T-shirts soon lol !

I have been on that trip for the last 3 years. As soon as my daughter got straight (bout 2.5 years old...) My son was born so now I got a few more years til I can be good at Madden again ;/

Sent from my ADR6400L using Tapatalk 2

[WFColonel56]

Quote: Originally Posted by ShaunLMason

Sure you can, I do it every day. I'm not religious about it, i.e. I don't think my way is "the one true way". If I were going to put a dog into this fight, it would be to say this: The disconnect between "sim" and "freestyle" is the importance placed on the correlation between what is effective in reality vs. what is effective in Madden. I'm fine with Hernendez at HB, because I know that he has a rare blend of talent that allows him to be effective utilized in a specific scheme in reality. If I am putting him in similar spots where he should have similar success then I'm fine with it. Conversely, looking at the effectiveness of slot streaks in combination with screen plays; it isn't viable in reality. Why? Screens rely on deception. You are trying to take advantage of the defenses natural inclination to be aggressive upfield. Because of the deception the QB has limited time to make a read, so his key is the screen receiver. In reality, the play is constrained by time, focus, and the inability for the QB to see downfield, where in Madden you only have the time constraint. The camera angle allows you to make that downfield read where most of the time it isn't possible in real life. My opinion is the QB needs to suffer a penalty to his accuracy down field on screen plays in order to balance the effectiveness in game with the effectiveness in reality. To me that is a "sim" gameplay design element. Would "freestyle" players hate it? Yes because they are unable to impact the game in the manner they choose. To me, it's an "exploit" to abuse the over effectiveness so I choose not to. Bottom line, there should be a way to do both, because my view isn't the only view. When EA comes out and declares they are making a simulation and not a game my opinion would change.

This is what i dont understand

The Hb slip screen YES is predicated on deception. Because literally without deception of the defensive lineman it doesnt work. But it only needs to deceive a couple of players and they are lineman


The slip screen in Madden does in fact does that job of deceiving the Lineman
(but a decent amount of the time a DE will sniff it out, and if you have an aware DE he will do it A LOT)

Is it kind of robotic that the game allows you to get the same (or pretty much the same) reaction from the DL every time? YES

But here is where some disconnect comes in with tourney players. As the defensive player you can control the environment.

The same way a coach on the side line can yell "WATCH THE SCREEN!" you can as well with the use of playmakers..

And with WR screens IRL they are really predicated on deception at all. The most important factors are spacing and coverage depth...one of the 08 NE Pats fav passes was the WR/Bubble screen because the coverage dictated it.

And with slot streaks in cover 2 its supposed to be open behind the hooks

With cover 3 it is supposed to be open opposite of the safety rotation past the hooks briefly

With cover 4 once you get past the hooks its pretty much 1 on 1 with the safety and if the WR gets an advantageous position on the CB it is open

With man if the receiver gets inside position its open. If you go on coachhuey.com you will see them talk about it at nausea how they like 4 verts vs cover 0

Im just confused when the seam route pretty much has the same effectiveness as IRL
(of course it may be a little more effective but it is still in the ballpark of how effective it is IRL)

And the fact that you can control the environment of your defense to tell them to play the slip screen , without selling the house I might add.

I dont understand how that is an exploit.

I have said in before posts that everything is done for a reason. If they keep calling it, it is for a reason. Because it hasnt been stopped. The same way that in High School my defense saw power 43 times in 1 game. We didnt stop it so thats all we saw.

[Smoke6]

The slip screen in Madden does in fact does that job of deceiving the Lineman
(but a decent amount of the time a DE will sniff it out, and if you have an aware DE he will do it A LOT)

And this is the problem with the game, the DE would come directly off the edge to the QB and he HB would be in the perfect position to slip by and miraculously the DE would just change direction on a dime and would be tackling the HB from behind for a loss or a short gain.

The mere fact that foot planting is non existent is what makes running this play hard for most to do unless some people have a different way of making it work in which I dont like dropping back 20yrds or running the opposite way (intentionally) to make it work. Once we get some foot planting and momentum physically from players, then the screen would be just as deadly as we see it in the game when the defense over commits!

[WFColonel56]

Quote: Originally Posted by Smoke6

The slip screen in Madden does in fact does that job of deceiving the Lineman (but a decent amount of the time a DE will sniff it out, and if you have an aware DE he will do it A LOT) And this is the problem with the game, the DE would come directly off the edge to the QB and he HB would be in the perfect position to slip by and miraculously the DE would just change direction on a dime and would be tackling the HB from behind for a loss or a short gain. The mere fact that foot planting is non existent is what makes running this play hard for most to do unless some people have a different way of making it work in which I dont like dropping back 20yrds or running the opposite way (intentionally) to make it work. Once we get some foot planting and momentum physically from players, then the screen would be just as deadly as we see it in the game when the defense over commits!

My man the slip screen works just fine... You dont have to drop back 20 yds or anything...If the DE sniffs it out, he sniffs it out..

You can say there is lack of foot planting and you would be correct but that isnt the reason that the play gets sniffed out or makes it any harder to run.