NBA 2K12 Cover Athletes - Michael Jordan, Magic Johnson and Larry Bird

[mkharsh33]

I've given this some thought over the last couple days (I didn't waste too many brain cells on this, but enough of them to be slightly noticed)...

I think this is a terrible idea by 2K. Now, I'm a classic NBA fan and an admitted ha ter of today's NBA. BUT, if any other sport put 3 guys on the cover from 20 years ago there'd be an outrage. Should Madden put Barry Sanders on the Cover? Should MLB put Cal Ripken on their cover? Should NHL put Wayne Gretzky on theirs?

2K should do this: create the current game with all energies focused on the current game.

CREATE A 2ND GAME: Call it "2K Hardwood Classics" - put tons of classic teams (complete seasons - like we did for 2k11). Put them up against each other and see which sells BEST. I bet the results would be a bit telling and it would hold it's own.

These video game companies are making money. Hell, I wait longer in line at GameStop than I do at McDonalds. Expand their team and make a separate game. I personally don't want all the current crap, but I'd love to have a game with the old school jerseys, appropriate arenas (sorry, no 1986 Boston Garden with a screen above it and dancing girls - make it the old school one that none of us understood what all those numbers meant -LOL!!).

I just think that people do have a very good point when they say they don't like this idea of Bird-Magic-Jordan on the cover. I truly can't blame them...

[KyotoCarl]

Quote: Originally Posted by mkharsh33

I've given this some thought over the last couple days (I didn't waste too many brain cells on this, but enough of them to be slightly noticed)... I think this is a terrible idea by 2K. Now, I'm a classic NBA fan and an admitted ha ter of today's NBA. BUT, if any other sport put 3 guys on the cover from 20 years ago there'd be an outrage. Should Madden put Barry Sanders on the Cover? Should MLB put Cal Ripken on their cover? Should NHL put Wayne Gretzky on theirs? 2K should do this: create the current game with all energies focused on the current game. CREATE A 2ND GAME: Call it "2K Hardwood Classics" - put tons of classic teams (complete seasons - like we did for 2k11). Put them up against each other and see which sells BEST. I bet the results would be a bit telling and it would hold it's own. These video game companies are making money. Hell, I wait longer in line at GameStop than I do at McDonalds. Expand their team and make a separate game. I personally don't want all the current crap, but I'd love to have a game with the old school jerseys, appropriate arenas (sorry, no 1986 Boston Garden with a screen above it and dancing girls - make it the old school one that none of us understood what all those numbers meant -LOL!!). I just think that people do have a very good point when they say they don't like this idea of Bird-Magic-Jordan on the cover. I truly can't blame them...

I think NBA basketball is better suited for having old school players on the cover together with nostalgia challenges and classic teams. I don't play other sports games and the only sport I follow is NBA basketball.

To me, having a bunch of classic teams in the game together with challenges (it doesn't have to Jordan-esque, one players challenges, but instead challenges like "Replay the entire 1985 finals" or such) makes sense. They still make improvements on the current state of the NBA and they still make gameplay improvements.

To me, it's a good move cause they don't date the game. Have a current star on the cover and two years later he might not even be in the league and thus, seeing a cover from 4 years ago doesn't really make me wanna pick that game up and play it anymore. 2K11 I'm sure I'll still pick up and play now and again in the future because of the timeless content thanks to classic teams and players.

[VDusen04]

Quote: Originally Posted by mkharsh33

I've given this some thought over the last couple days (I didn't waste too many brain cells on this, but enough of them to be slightly noticed)... I think this is a terrible idea by 2K. Now, I'm a classic NBA fan and an admitted ha ter of today's NBA. BUT, if any other sport put 3 guys on the cover from 20 years ago there'd be an outrage. Should Madden put Barry Sanders on the Cover? Should MLB put Cal Ripken on their cover? Should NHL put Wayne Gretzky on theirs? 2K should do this: create the current game with all energies focused on the current game. CREATE A 2ND GAME: Call it "2K Hardwood Classics" - put tons of classic teams (complete seasons - like we did for 2k11). Put them up against each other and see which sells BEST. I bet the results would be a bit telling and it would hold it's own. These video game companies are making money. Hell, I wait longer in line at GameStop than I do at McDonalds. Expand their team and make a separate game. I personally don't want all the current crap, but I'd love to have a game with the old school jerseys, appropriate arenas (sorry, no 1986 Boston Garden with a screen above it and dancing girls - make it the old school one that none of us understood what all those numbers meant -LOL!!). I just think that people do have a very good point when they say they don't like this idea of Bird-Magic-Jordan on the cover. I truly can't blame them...

If 2K could guarantee us that they could have just droves and droves of accurate historic rosters and seasons at their disposal with entirely accurate arenas, jerseys, court art, player likenesses and accessories from a number of different eras, then I think I might possibly be all in.

However, I believe the chances of that being possible are very slim. I'd have to look at the details, but when 2K focused their football game on legends only (because they had to), I remember it being a hodgepodge of a lot of greats, a lot of okay players, and some generics. Even when 2K had no choice but to focus on former players, they likely could not do so as they pleased, unable to secure the rights of a lot of legends they were looking to sign, perhaps due to contract disputes with those individual players or just the inability to afford to include as many classic players as we all would have wanted (in a thorough fashion).

So yes, if 2K could somehow create a dream game full of all the historic stuff done to its absolute maximum potential, I think it'd sell well. However, I honestly don't think it's possible (though I guess it depends what you mean by "complete seasons". How many seasons?) Further, it's nearly a given that each team will have former players who either can't be signed or refuse to be signed. Would consumers want to drop $65 on a game that doesn't even have a single full accurate team roster? I imagine it didn't take quite as much convincing of Michael's Bull's teammate to sign on with 2K for the celebration of their greatness (and still, about 1/3 of their roster is missing). But are the primary contributors of the '88 Clippers going to be interested in having their 17 win season immortalized? And for how much money (I'm talking to you, Benoit Benjamin)?

Regarding the cover situation, I don't put Cal Ripken in the same cultural light as Barry Sanders and Wayne Gretzky. I'm not saying he's not as great, I'm just saying he never seemed to be quite as culturally relevant as those other two. I honestly don't think there'd be any sort of outrage stemming from a Gretzky or Sanders cover though. I think the masses would love it. I don't think it'd be entirely different from Desmond Howard being on the cover of NCAA Football 2006.

So when it comes down to it, knowing 2K's (and any video game company's) limitations in terms of what they'd be able to do with classic teams, and believing you may actually be in the minority (respectfully), I do not believe splitting classic and current would possibly be a good idea at this point. And when I refer to you as the minority, I'm referring to your near shunning of current NBA for only classic memories. I know you're not alone, but it is my feeling that while many people miss classic NBA, they are still quite interested in the current NBA. I know I am. I love the NBA now and I loved it then. To imagine having to pay $130 dollars to have the opportunity to use classic and current teams alike (and not even being able to pit them against one another if I so choose) would be a disaster for me as a consumer.

Again, maybe one day, things will change and it'll be suddenly a lot easier for video game companies to secure the rights of retired players, allowing them to add thousands of people as they see fit. However, I don't think that's possible at this point. Therefore, I think our situation now is just about perfect. $65 for a brand new NBA game featuring a strong retro appeal.

[DJ]

Quote: Originally Posted by mkharsh33

I've given this some thought over the last couple days (I didn't waste too many brain cells on this, but enough of them to be slightly noticed)... I think this is a terrible idea by 2K. Now, I'm a classic NBA fan and an admitted ha ter of today's NBA. BUT, if any other sport put 3 guys on the cover from 20 years ago there'd be an outrage. Should Madden put Barry Sanders on the Cover? Should MLB put Cal Ripken on their cover? Should NHL put Wayne Gretzky on theirs? 2K should do this: create the current game with all energies focused on the current game. CREATE A 2ND GAME: Call it "2K Hardwood Classics" - put tons of classic teams (complete seasons - like we did for 2k11). Put them up against each other and see which sells BEST. I bet the results would be a bit telling and it would hold it's own. These video game companies are making money. Hell, I wait longer in line at GameStop than I do at McDonalds. Expand their team and make a separate game. I personally don't want all the current crap, but I'd love to have a game with the old school jerseys, appropriate arenas (sorry, no 1986 Boston Garden with a screen above it and dancing girls - make it the old school one that none of us understood what all those numbers meant -LOL!!). I just think that people do have a very good point when they say they don't like this idea of Bird-Magic-Jordan on the cover. I truly can't blame them...

I don't think 2K would want to compete against itself. What they are doing is fine. Magic, Bird and Jordan are still three of the biggest names in basketball, and with the lockout, it makes more sense to go with retired players on the cover.

Don't get me wrong, I would go insane over a full-out Classic version of 2K basketball, but I think the way 2K is interweaving classic and current players is great.

[mkharsh33]

cal ripken might not have been the best example...LOL. okay.

[jd@os]

Quote: Originally Posted by mkharsh33

I've given this some thought over the last couple days (I didn't waste too many brain cells on this, but enough of them to be slightly noticed)... I think this is a terrible idea by 2K. Now, I'm a classic NBA fan and an admitted ha ter of today's NBA. BUT, if any other sport put 3 guys on the cover from 20 years ago there'd be an outrage. Should Madden put Barry Sanders on the Cover? Should MLB put Cal Ripken on their cover? Should NHL put Wayne Gretzky on theirs? 2K should do this: create the current game with all energies focused on the current game. CREATE A 2ND GAME: Call it "2K Hardwood Classics" - put tons of classic teams (complete seasons - like we did for 2k11). Put them up against each other and see which sells BEST. I bet the results would be a bit telling and it would hold it's own. These video game companies are making money. Hell, I wait longer in line at GameStop than I do at McDonalds. Expand their team and make a separate game. I personally don't want all the current crap, but I'd love to have a game with the old school jerseys, appropriate arenas (sorry, no 1986 Boston Garden with a screen above it and dancing girls - make it the old school one that none of us understood what all those numbers meant -LOL!!). I just think that people do have a very good point when they say they don't like this idea of Bird-Magic-Jordan on the cover. I truly can't blame them...

I agree with what other people posted in response. First and foremost, one of the things that you could do with 2K11 and 2K12 that you wouldn't be able to do with "Hardwood Classics" is something very popular: pitting the past against the present.
Jordan's Bulls vs Kobe's Lakers
Magic's Lakers vs choKing James' Heat
Bird's Celtics vs Dirk's Mavericks

And yes, I too don't think it would be outrage if Wayne Gretzky was on an NHL cover or if Barry Sanders (or maybe even Walter Payton) was on a Madden cover. I don't want to ruffle any feathers when I say this, but I think A LOT (not ALL) of the complaining about historic player covers are coming from fairly young gamers who are tired of hearing that past players were better than today's players, old school rap is better than today's rap, etc. It's like the younger generation is tired of being compared and coming up short to what older people are telling them. If they only saw MJ live on tv rather than on ESPN Classic or on some highlight dvd they would understand so much better...

But I see no problem combining the two (past and present). I remember when some of my friends had NBA Live AND NBA Street. I thought to myself if I want to play a street game, I'll just go to NBA 2K's Blacktop mode (even though Street and Blacktop were different in terms of realism).

But yeah--I wouldn't pay $63.59 for a "Hardwood Classic" game with a lot of generic players filling out team rosters, but I don't mind as much if it is included in a current NBA 2K title. All that said, I do see where you're coming from.

[jd@os]

Quote: Originally Posted by MessenjahMatt

A super special limited run of all three on the cover would be cool, something like...

Now I don't like Lebron James in the least bit, and I'm glad 2K is going to release a cover with one athlete, but the three-person cover could work. Either that one, or how about one that 2K did for Topspin 4? Maybe like a passing of the torch kind of thing: Magic, Jordan, and fill-in-the-blank. I said Lebron but it could be another (just not Kobe because it wouldn't look right with two Lakers and another team player).



Something like this maybe next year?

[mkharsh33]

Quote: Originally Posted by jd@os

I agree with what other people posted in response. First and foremost, one of the things that you could do with 2K11 and 2K12 that you wouldn't be able to do with "Hardwood Classics" is something very popular: pitting the past against the present. Jordan's Bulls vs Kobe's Lakers Magic's Lakers vs choKing James' Heat Bird's Celtics vs Dirk's Mavericks And yes, I too don't think it would be outrage if Wayne Gretzky was on an NHL cover or if Barry Sanders (or maybe even Walter Payton) was on a Madden cover. I don't want to ruffle any feathers when I say this, but I think A LOT (not ALL) of the complaining about historic player covers are coming from fairly young gamers who are tired of hearing that past players were better than today's players, old school rap is better than today's rap, etc. It's like the younger generation is tired of being compared and coming up short to what older people are telling them. If they only saw MJ live on tv rather than on ESPN Classic or on some highlight dvd they would understand so much better... But I see no problem combining the two (past and present). I remember when some of my friends had NBA Live AND NBA Street. I thought to myself if I want to play a street game, I'll just go to NBA 2K's Blacktop mode (even though Street and Blacktop were different in terms of realism). But yeah--I wouldn't pay $63.59 for a "Hardwood Classic" game with a lot of generic players filling out team rosters, but I don't mind as much if it is included in a current NBA 2K title. All that said, I do see where you're coming from.

I don't want rosters with 5 real players and then a bunch of generic ones. I'm talking about COMPLETE roster files for 25-30 years worth of rosters with 12-14 players per. We have these for 2k11 - it's not out of the realm of possibility.

secondly, i am not a fan of pitting a team from 2001 against a team from 1991. i just don't think that's possible. but that's just me...

i'm not sure people understood what i meant so i'll drop this. all i'm saying is that if i'm a CURRENT nba player like derrick rose, dirk nowitzki or kevin durant (to name a few) - i'd be a bit offended that this game, unlike any other current game on the video game market, neglects me for a player who last suited up over a decade ago. i understand more than most here the iconic nature of bird, magic and jordan (i'm 39) but i just don't think it's right. but i'll shut up...