When John Madden Speaks, Game Designers Listen w/ Video

[DaggerSwagger]

Quote: Originally Posted by RAMSFAN21

sorry guys but Madden the game has passed Madden the coach by....wth he blabbing about 3on3, also remember that he's the one who implemented the new play calling mode which makes Madden feel even more scripted. I'm not buying it...redo the engine already!

thumbs up to this

[TNT713]

Anyone can play it, but no one can perfect it - John Madden about the Madden NFL series.

Gotta love it...

Later

[youALREADYknow]

Quote: Originally Posted by rangerrick012

Well gameplanning is a good idea, I just think the execution wasn't the best in M11. He does have a point that every coach doesn't go into the game w/ 300 plays, and teams run the same play from different sets more often than most people think.

It's not just a good idea, it's one of the greatest features in this generation for the Madden franchise.

Gameplanning was like a blessing from the gods for us Coach Mode players. Hopefully they can enhance this even more in M12 and make it work for both teams like it was working at release.

[CreatineKasey]

Quote: Originally Posted by LIVEDEHTMAI666

"Hot Routes," should be limited; are your serious? One hot route? Hot routes are one of the few things Madden actually does right! In my opinion, it is very realistic to be able to execute multiple hot routes and audibles at the los. Some of the better QBs in the NFL do it often, most notable, Payton Manning. We should, have the option to change a play up based on what can be read from the defence's pre-snap showing. That's FOOTBALL! Now, in saying that, instead of unrealistically limiting hot routes and audibles, how about making them less affective via miscommunication. Crowd noise, team chemistry, and hot route/audible execution, should be studied and then implemented as relevant factors in the game, thus making every team play unique to the subject. The same for defence. I should have more options pre-snap. For example, I should be able to order my CB to shade the inside/outside of a WR. I should have more options to individually ajust my players: B&R one WR, and play off another while still maintaining inside/ouside coverage, etc. Crazy thing is, six years ago, these options were available in NFL2K5. EA Sports, It's not in the game. Guess it's not sunday. People should watch what they say on these forums, because in the off chance that EA will actually read what the community/consumer has to say, they will listen to posts like CreatineKasey's, and continue to design their game around unrealistic features and gameplay. We all know the Madden dev team tries hard every year to focus on everything but core realistic gameplay. Lets not help them. My Madden issues: WR/DB interaction, OL/DL interaction, overall animation(light years behind 2K5), terrible running animation(ice skating, runners cover ground, but legs aren't moving at a realistic pace to cover said ground; better running animation in past gen Maddens(Madden06ps2), terrible play action execution, terrible presentation(also light years behind past gen, six years old, smaller hard-drive 2K5), lack of realistic QB scramble logic for the AI, terrible QB lead feature(can't put the ball where only your WR can get it(lead high, low, in front, behind, up left, up mid, up right, etc..., more responsive in 2K), TERRIBLE replay challenges, and how could I forget, NO CONSECUTIVE HIT TACKLES(REAL GANG TACKLES)!!! ALSO PRESENT IN 2K5!!! SMH. To get the most realistic football experience, you have to own a time machine and go back six years. Or, just own 2K5. We need competition in football. How long are we going to have to wait to get the fundamental standards of old out of current gen football gaming? We deserve better than EA.

I don't think audibles are that easy to do. Do you think it's commonplace for NFL teams to come out in the same play every down and audible to one of 20 other plays and concepts from that base play after they've seen the defense?

At the very least they need to make hot routes take more time to call. I shouldn't be able to snap off 4 route changes in 4 seconds individually like I can now. There really should be a heavier commit to the base play called. I think that commit facilitates a deeper strategy that carries throughout the game, just like real football. Right now, things can get boiled down and simplified to a couple of excessively simple checks and the game can rarely evolve beyond a certain point.

Now, part of this is personal choice by the users playing, but I think the game should mimic reality more in the sense of what's possible at the LOS. I just honestly don't think it's that easy to communicate multiple individual route adjustments at the LOS. Are there audibles? YES. Does a QB draw up new plays in the sand while under center like we do in Madden? I don't think so.

Regarding the personal attacks, I don't appreciate them. Honestly, it's just my opinion and I'm not going to disparage you personally because your opinion differs. It's really hard to respect your thoughts when you won't respect my thoughts or me as a person.

A lot of those defensive adjustments I agree with, but I also think some of them could be designed into plays. A lot of defenses have certain shades in certain areas depending on the play called, the offense's formation/personnel, the spot of the ball, and the down/distance. What I've postulated in the past is having several "schemes" in the game and being able to apply whatever one you prefer. Different coaches have all kinds of schemes and rules which can differ drastically at times. How those schemes and rules interact is one aspect of football that makes it really interesting for me personally.

Think about how much harder it'd be to call an offense in Madden if you really had to pay attention to what the D was calling and audibling out of your play had real risk involved, including limits and communication errors. To me, that'd drive the game to more realistic scores and play results. How often have you seen teams commit to a play despite unfavorable defensive formation? Every game. Yes, some QB's make some adjustments to get into something they like, but it's not to the extent and simplicity Madden allows. Consequences like time loss and communication need to be a factor.

Any more thoughts on this from OSers? Agree/Disagree?

[tlc12576]

Quote: Originally Posted by LIVEDEHTMAI666

"Hot Routes," should be limited; are your serious? One hot route? Hot routes are one of the few things Madden actually does right! In my opinion, it is very realistic to be able to execute multiple hot routes and audibles at the los. Some of the better QBs in the NFL do it often, most notable, Payton Manning. We should, have the option to change a play up based on what can be read from the defence's pre-snap showing. That's FOOTBALL! Now, in saying that, instead of unrealistically limiting hot routes and audibles, how about making them less affective via miscommunication. Crowd noise, team chemistry, and hot route/audible execution, should be studied and then implemented as relevant factors in the game, thus making every team play unique to the subject.......

With all due respect to your post, you are mistaken, IMO. Hot routes/hot receivers are limited in a real NFL play. Not even Payton Manning comes to the LOS and "hot routes" every receiver on the play. If you change multiple routes, that's a new playcall, not a "hot route".

Definition of a "hot" receiver is: A receiver designated to accept a quick pass from the quarterback in the event of a blitz by the defense.

Example: If a quarterback recognizes the blitz before the snap, he may audible to the hot receiver so he can get rid of the ball before the defense has a chance to get to him.


We should NOT be able to come to the LOS in Madden and design new plays. This is what Madden actually allows now and it is NOT realistic.

EDIT*- On a side note, I do think they should add a bonus option for more route adjustment for WRs and QBs that have played together a long time. This would help differentiate WR/QB tandems and encourage team building, instead of just trying to grab the highest rated WR and QB's every year. Come to think of it, this would make sense for all areas of the game, offense, defense and special teams. The longer players play together in the same system, more playcall options, that are realistic, should be available to choose.

[2KGridiron]

Game Planning was a great feature, it needs to be expanded a lot. Maybe with Tendencies, and play calling logic. Make every Offensive and Defensive Coordinator unique with their own logic of playcalling. It can be the like the 'Ask Madden' feature- a Coordinator gives suggestions and as a coach you have the right to override them.

Madden itself has a lot of potential to be a very good football video game with the rapid growth of technology. Why hasn't it? Beyond me.

[PGaither84]

Reply to all the replies:

Having sat down and met with them, I can say first hand they already know "what's wrong with their game." They know playcalling isn't perfect, that the computer isn't very good at playing fotball, and so on. The fact of the matter is that they have limited resources. It's really up to you, the consumer, to decide if the product they put out is worth purchasing. Something I am really glad they "finally" worked on for Madden 11 was blocking in the running game. It isn't perfect, but it better than it has even been in any video game I ever played. As Phil said in a Dev. Pod Cast last year, [paraphrasing] "It's really hard to push the idea to Marketing that we want to improve blocking. What are we going to put on the back of the box, 'Blocking finally works'?"

Quote: Originally Posted by youALREADYknow

It's not just a good idea, it's one of the greatest features in this generation for the Madden franchise. Gameplanning was like a blessing from the gods for us Coach Mode players. Hopefully they can enhance this even more in M12 and make it work for both teams like it was working at release.

Agreed in full. If this feature was "fixed" and tuned, it would continue to change the game. Right now defensive playcalling doesn't care about the personnel the offense has on the feild. Also you can't just assign a game plan to the computer like you assign uniform options. You have to have a seperate profile. Fixing those two things would go a long way. I would also like to have more than 15 play per section.

[illwill10]

^^i agree

With limited resources they have to work on priorities and sometimes it is not what consumers or hardcore want to hear. Marketing always will want that new "it'' feature that can be on the back cover. So key improvements that had to be made are pushed in to the next cycle.