Madden Sales Down 18% Y-o-Y in October

[debauchlord]

Quote: Originally Posted by MaddenFranchise10

If it wasn't for the NFL exclusivity, Madden would have gone the way of NBA Live/Elite and been overshadowed by 2k.

Please, this train of thought NEEDS to die. Does everyone forget that in 2005, when EA "bought" the NFL license, 2K "bought" the MLB license? MVP 2005, was a good game, better than MLB 2k5. So EA stopped making MLB games, and 2K was allowed to run with it, unhindered, until the MLB the Show popped up and has been a much better game for the last two years. MLB2K whatever series has been tanking. It is not because of competition, that they are FAILING? 2k Sports is, currently, failing against an indirect competitor, making a MLB game. What sense is it that they could be making a better NFL game? Taking five year old precedent and expanding it is very poor logic. THERE IS NO WAY TO KNOW THAT 2K WOULD BE MAKING A BETTER NFL GAME. NONE. Harping on the past impedes forward progress.

[Phixius]

Quote: Originally Posted by debauchlord

Please, this train of thought NEEDS to die. Does everyone forget that in 2005, when EA "bought" the NFL license, 2K "bought" the MLB license? MVP 2005, was a good game, better than MLB 2k5. So EA stopped making MLB games, and 2K was allowed to run with it, unhindered, until the MLB the Show popped up and has been a much better game for the last two years. MLB2K whatever series has been tanking. It is not because of competition, that they are FAILING? 2k Sports is, currently, failing against an indirect competitor, making a MLB game. What sense is it that they could be making a better NFL game? Taking five year old precedent and expanding it is very poor logic. THERE IS NO WAY TO KNOW THAT 2K WOULD BE MAKING A BETTER NFL GAME. NONE. Harping on the past impedes forward progress.

2K Baseball games were always mediocre. However, their football games were decent and like you said no one knows how well they would of been had they continue.

[Armor and Sword]

Yeah the 2K thing is really tired and old. NFL2K5....great game. Stellar presentation and franchise mode.

Yet at that time I played Madden 2005 5 times more than 2K. And I actually like Maddens gameplay a tad better than 2K5. They were so close to each other IMO.

The big issue is the lack of a huge leap since Madden went next gen. It has been up unitl Madden 2010 a big letdown.

But Madden has made some big strides in gameplay IMO with 2010 and now 2011. I expect gameplay to be even tighter in 2012 and the franchise mode to really be much better. I think it is safe to say Ian and the crew really know how passion filled there hardcore buyers are and I think they will try to give us what we want in 2012.

I hope it comes to fruition. For so many of us we are enjoying the game (2011) and we just need the deep immersion to make is truly great.

I will never try to convince any 2K vet that Madden plays better than 2K. That is a futile discussion. But there are many of us who feel Madden on the last gen played just as good as 2K5 (Madden 2005/2007). I love 2K5...tremendous game. But is has plenty of flaws and issues as well. All video games typically do.

Funny thing is I think Madden 2011 is the best playing Madden I have ever played and the only thing holding it back from being a truly great title is that killer franchise mode and a polished first class network presentation.

You have 2 camps.

1) Madden fans who love playing Madden but want the deep franchise back and Network style presentation

2) Those that can't stand the game in it's current engine and feel it is a total trainwreck and want gameplay totally overhauled.


Camp one is going to win out next year. I don't see an overhaul till the PS4 or whatever new console they roll out in a few years (I will be using PS3 for the next 8-9 years no question).

So back to my year one franchise!

[pietasterp]

Quote: Originally Posted by Armor & Sword

Yeah the 2K thing is really tired and old. NFL2K5....great game. Stellar presentation and franchise mode. Yet at that time I played Madden 2005 5 times more than 2K. And I actually like Maddens gameplay a tad better than 2K5. They were so close to each other IMO. The big issue is the lack of a huge leap since Madden went next gen. It has been up unitl Madden 2010 a big letdown.

This is the point, right? Madden was good in 2005 because their competition was good. Lack of a leap on next gen, coinciding with exclusivity....That's really what irks most of the guys here, not Madden in and of itself.

[Armor and Sword]

Quote: Originally Posted by pietasterp

This is the point, right? Madden was good in 2005 because their competition was good. Lack of a leap on next gen, coinciding with exclusivity....That's really what irks most of the guys here, not Madden in and of itself.

I was not talking about the lack of competition. I agree that is never a good thing. I was talking about those who are die hard 2K fans thinking it is a gimmie 2K would have made a much better next gen football title.

No way to ever know till it happens....if ever.

[grunt]

Quote: Originally Posted by Armor & Sword

I was not talking about the lack of competition. I agree that is never a good thing. I was talking about those who are die hard 2K fans thinking it is a gimmie 2K would have made a much better next gen football title. No way to ever know till it happens....if ever.

APF2K8 was that game just without the NFL license or a franchise.

All things need competition or they will die. Now Madden is being compared with a basketball, baseball, and FPS. In reality Madden was never in a close market but a dynamic open market. Instead of having nagging little brother making football games (Visual Concepts) now their competition is with any firm making games in their demographics.

NFL2k5 was a next gen game in last gen clothes. If Visual Concepts made football games for the last 6 years where would the genre be today. My guess would be on the same level of NBA2k 11 or better.

Again I blame this on the short sightedness of the NFL. The NBA decided to go a different route and it worked for the NBA, developers, and consumers.

[Armor and Sword]

Quote: Originally Posted by grunt

APF2K8 was that game just without the NFL license or a franchise. All things need competition or they will die. Now Madden is being compared with a basketball, baseball, and FPS. In reality Madden was never in a close market but a dynamic open market. Instead of having nagging little brother making football games (Visual Concepts) now their competition is with any firm making games in their demographics. NFL2k5 was a next gen game in last gen clothes. If Visual Concepts made football games for the last 6 years where would the genre be today. My guess would be on the same level of NBA2k 11 or better. Again I blame this on the short sightedness of the NFL. The NBA decided to go a different route and it worked for the NBA, developers, and consumers.

APF2K8 is a heck of a title. I agree. NFL2K5 feels last gen to me. I still play it. I still think it's great. But no doubt it is dated. And it should be it's almost 6 years old now.

Your probably right about Visual Concepts and if they had the dev time EA has had to develop a next gen football game it would probably be very good. I just don't think Madden 2011 is nearly as poor as so many here think. I think it is quite good and going in a very good direction. It needs more polish and TLC in presentation and depth and immersion in franchise mode to knock it out of the park. I am in the minority around here that gameplay is very good and a lot of fun.....offline. It takes good sliders, and game planning for the cpu...but it works well.

Sales are down because for a lot of players it has grown stale and other sports titles are better. No question. And gamers are getting more tight with their game buying budget.

[tlc12576]

Quote: Originally Posted by Armor & Sword

APF2K8 is a heck of a title. I agree. NFL2K5 feels last gen to me. I still play it. I still think it's great. But no doubt it is dated. And it should be it's almost 6 years old now. Your probably right about Visual Concepts and if they had the dev time EA has had to develop a next gen football game it would probably be very good. I just don't think Madden 2011 is nearly as poor as so many here think. I think it is quite good and going in a very good direction. It needs more polish and TLC in presentation and depth and immersion in franchise mode to knock it out of the park. I am in the minority around here that gameplay is very good and a lot of fun.....offline. It takes good sliders, and game planning for the cpu...but it works well. Sales are down because for a lot of players it has grown stale and other sports titles are better. No question. And gamers are getting more tight with their game buying budget.

This is what I'm preaching so hard around here lately. As fond of NFL 2k5 that some many of us are, I think the majority of comparisons of Madden to that game would be put to rest with the addition of a good network broadcast presentation to Madden 12. To hear all our nostalgia about NFL 2k5, someone that never played it would think it was some unreachable NFL game utopia. The truth is, 2k just copied what ESPN was doing with NFL presentation and placed it in their game, BRILLIANT!

I don't understand why the Madden devs feel the need to "re-invent the wheel" with their presentation. There is always room for improvement in gameplay with any game but the presentation in Madden is abysmal for a 2010 sports title. There are many subtle and beautiful NFL moments in Madden that so many gamers never notice because of the lack of immersion caused by the lackluster presentation.

Note to the Madden devs, nobody wants to eat filet mignon served on a trash can lid.